LIONS 2013 SQUAD

pikcing it today here is what i am thinking - 35 players

Healy/Jenkins/Cole/Jones/?
Hibberd/Rees/Hartley/Best
Gray/AW Jones/Charteris/Palmer or Lawes?
Croft/Ferris?/Heaslip/Warburton/Lydiate/Faletau/Haskellhoff/SOB/Wood

Philipps/Youngs/lloyd or Care/ Irish 9?

Sexton/Priestland/Flood!?
Roberts and tuilagi (ouch) Davies
North, Ashton, Scottish winger?
Foden Halfpenny Kearney

Too many forwards and not enough backs...

My 22

Healy
Best
Jones
Charteris
AWJ
SOB
Warburton
Haskell

Philipps
Priestland
Roberts
Tuilagi
North
Ashton
Foden

Hartley/Hibberd
Gethin/Cole
Gray
Heaslip/Lydiate
Youngs/Care
Sexton
Davies
Halfpenny

As the opposition, three area's of that really concern me - front row, back row and centers.

Gatts,
One observation, and without nit-picking for the sake of it, if some of these players continue to develop the Lions could have a really strong squad in a couple of years. Some great talent and competition for the test team. I predict a whitewash.

Sorry not to nit pick too much, but that looks like an anglo welsh team not a Lions squad

No Tommy Bowe, no Sean Lamont (who put Tualagii and Tindall in his pocket a few weeks ago) to name but two

flyhalffactory wrote:Sorry not to nit pick too much, but that looks like an anglo welsh team not a Lions squad

No Tommy Bowe, no Sean Lamont (who put Tualagii and Tindall in his pocket a few weeks ago) to name but two

Ah... That's my point. Even more talent to consider. An abundance of riches.

LIONS 2013 SQUAD.

Is two years hence.

Best chose a 2011 team from the 2009 favourites.

Portnoy wrote:LIONS 2013 SQUAD.

Is two years hence.

Best chose a 2011 team from the 2009 favourites.

No that won't work - wouldn't be enough Welsh.

flyhalffactory wrote:Sorry not to nit pick too much, but that looks like an anglo welsh team not a Lions squad

No Tommy Bowe, no Sean Lamont (who put Tualagii and Tindall in his pocket a few weeks ago) to name but two

bring it fhf, i am so open to additions but don't know wenough about scottish game...bowe is a definite and prob earls well spotted

flyhalffactory wrote:Sorry not to nit pick too much, but that looks like an anglo welsh team not a Lions squad

No Tommy Bowe, no Sean Lamont (who put Tualagii and Tindall in his pocket a few weeks ago) to name but two

My starter is 3 irish 4 english and 8 welsh and i think it is quite balanced

Gatts wrote:

flyhalffactory wrote:Sorry not to nit pick too much, but that looks like an anglo welsh team not a Lions squad

No Tommy Bowe, no Sean Lamont (who put Tualagii and Tindall in his pocket a few weeks ago) to name but two

My starter is 3 irish 4 english and 8 welsh and i think it is quite balanced

Sorry whatever was I thinking ............. yes perfectly balanced

I would suggest
Euan Murray - destroyed the England front row on his own
Richie Gray -Wales were pretty poor in the line out
Schlong Lamont - had both England centres in his pocket, and will only get better working with Nigel Davies down PyS
Tim Visser (residency allowed by then)- Awesome now

wales just take all the places - we can have a nice test series with france and ireland instead

These Lions threads normally create some banter but most are done as WUMs. I can't make up my mind about this one yet.

My contribution, Scotland are poor in the backs however without a doubt we have the best Hooker in the home nations in the shape of Ross Ford. Furthermore our pack utterly dominated England in the Scrum, Lineout and Breakdown in the 6N and the RWC back and it was England's potent backs that won the game for them.

Barclay, Brown, Gray, Murray and Ford I reckon will be in contention for a Lions tour as would either Lawson or Blair. Furthermore I would also give honourable mentions to Ansbro, S Lamont and Max Evans to make the trip too.

Haskell starting at 8??

I think he is probably the most over rated player in world rugby, maybe only second to Quade Cooper.

Have they announced the coaching team for the next Lions tour yet? I'd like to see Declan Kidney given a shot...

"These Lions threads normally create some banter but most are done as WUMs."

Totally agree Rugger

I always think its funny how people view games....i mean even yourself and another scottish fan appear to have different views on games....

Flyhalf twice suggests:
"Schlong Lamont - had both England centres in his pocket, "

yet

You suggest:
"and it was England's potent backs that won the game for them."

Love it....

Why oh why do the fans of the team ranked 8th constantly insist that their players are better than the players of the teams ranked 6th & 5th?

There could be so many changes to player availability, skill etc over the next 2 years that it is almost impossible to predict who will be playing.

The Lions will get picked on performance & DOMINATION(TM) over the next 2 years.

Gatts wrote:

flyhalffactory wrote:Sorry not to nit pick too much, but that looks like an anglo welsh team not a Lions squad

No Tommy Bowe, no Sean Lamont (who put Tualagii and Tindall in his pocket a few weeks ago) to name but two

bring it fhf, i am so open to additions but don't know wenough about scottish game...bowe is a definite and prob earls well spotted

Gatts - two Scottish wingers called Lee Jones and Tim Visser will also be in contention, I believe.

George Carlin wrote:

Gatts wrote:

flyhalffactory wrote:Sorry not to nit pick too much, but that looks like an anglo welsh team not a Lions squad

No Tommy Bowe, no Sean Lamont (who put Tualagii and Tindall in his pocket a few weeks ago) to name but two

bring it fhf, i am so open to additions but don't know wenough about scottish game...bowe is a definite and prob earls well spotted

Gatts - two Scottish wingers called Lee Jones and Tim Visser will also be in contention, I believe.

A Dutchman who is qualified to play for England who now wants to play for Scotland and becomes eligible next summer - now there's a recipe for a fine British and Irish Lion

My Squad :

Prop:
Healy (I)
Jenkins (W)
Murray (S)
Jones (W)
Sherridan (E)

Hookers :
Ford (S)
Rees (W)
Hartley (E)

Lock:
Gray (S)
AW Jones (W)
Charteris (W)
Lawes (E)
POC (I)

Backrow:
Barclay (S)
Ferris (I)
Warburton (W)
Lydiate (W)
Faletau (W)
Heaslip (I)
SOB (I)
Brown (S)

Scrum Half :
Phillips (W)
Laidlaw (S) (Far better than any of the current Scottish crop at the moment and I have no Idea why he was not taken to the RWC)
Youngs (E)

Fly Half :
Sexton (I)
Priestland (W)
Flood (E)

Centres :
Roberts (W)
Tuilagi (E)
Davies (W)
Banahan (E)

Wing :
North (W)
Ashton (E)
Earles (I)
Bowe (I)

Full Back
Foden (E)
Halfpenny (W)
Armitage (E)

8 Irish, 14 Welsh, 10 English and 6 Scots = 38 people

leading to a possible test XV of

1. Healy (I)
2. Ford (S)
3. Jones (W)
4. Gray (S)
5. AW Jones (W)
6. Ferris (I)
7. Warburton (W) Captain
8. SOB (I)

9. Phillips (W)
10. Priestland (W)
11. Bowe (I)
12. Roberts (W)
13. Tuilagi (E)
14. Ashton (E)
15. Armitage (E)

I'll be happy to justify any selections on request.

RuggerRadge2611 wrote:. Furthermore I would also give honourable mentions to Ansbro, S Lamont and Max Evans to make the trip too.

Look, I am not being funny here or a wum, but when your backs can start learning to score tries against decent oposition, then they can be considered. Although I do think th Scots have some handy forwards though.

Who cares, The Lions is anachronistic sentimentality.

Would certainly make room for Ford at hooker alongside Best and Rees. Ad Murray to Cole, Jones, Jenkins and Healy. Nobody had Manu in their pocket this RWC, Tindall however..., would certainly make room for Sean Lamont and Croft as I think they'll flourish down in Oz.

Rugger, Mike Phillips? I like to see an aggressive scrum half but his service at the breakdown isn't that good and against the current Oz team I don't think we need the added physicality he brought against SA. I would prefer the Lions coaches to be looking at 9s with better footballing skills and better passes.

Not wanting to nit-pick but some of those players may well be struggling to get into their club/regional side come 2013. The likes of Matthew Rees, Gethin Jenkins, Adam Jones and a few more are not spring chickens now.

Bitter Beer wrote:Who cares, The Lions is anachronistic sentimentality.

Fortunately a minority view.

formerly known as Sam wrote:Rugger, Mike Phillips? I like to see an aggressive scrum half but his service at the breakdown isn't that good and against the current Oz team I don't think we need the added physicality he brought against SA. I would prefer the Lions coaches to be looking at 9s with better footballing skills and better passes.

Agree, hence my comment about Laidlaw, Connor Murray for Ireland I reckon too will be in with a shout of making the trip in 2 years time if he continues to develop.

Bitter Beer wrote:Who cares, The Lions is anachronistic sentimentality.

A minority view to which I am eternally grateful.

I care, I also would bet a huge ammount of money that the Southern Hemisphere teams we play care too. Furthermore being a Scotland and Edinburgh fan its nice to get 100% behind a team that might actually win something.



My biggest hope however is a few more Scottish guys get to make the trip. I love the lions and everything it stands for but for the good of the game in Scotland I hope we get a few more tourists than last year. Scotland don't win many matches and have a problem with scoring tries but our forwards have created a very powerful 1st scrum on any day bar Sunday and our lineout is rarely threatened.

Come on, you'd have to take Mike Phillips. He's a big game player and has proved it on several occassions. If you took Youngs and Care as well then you'd have enough to choose from.

Props: A Jones, D Cole, E Murray, C Healy and G Jenkins
Hookers: M Rees, R Best and D Hartley
Second row: C Lawes, POC, L Charteris, R Gray and B Davies
Back row: D Ferris, SOB, D Lydiate, S Warburton, J Barclay, J Heaslip and T Falatau

Forwards: 20

Scrum halves: M Phillips, B Youngs and D Care
Fly halves: R Priestland, T Flood and J Sexton
Centres: J Roberts, J Davies, S Williams, S Lamont and M Tuilagi
Wings: T Bowe, G North, C Ashton
Full backs: B Foden, D Armitage, L Halfpenny

Backs: 17

I can't believe I haven't found a slot for Tom Croft, but on current form he isn't matching Ferris or Lydiate, plus SOB covers 6 as does Lawes if you need it.

offload wrote:

Bitter Beer wrote:Who cares, The Lions is anachronistic sentimentality.

Fortunately a minority view.

Christ, that took about 2 minutes

No views on the coaching set-up fellas? Looks like we may hear something soon going by what Andy Irvine said last year:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/rugby_union/9105973.stm

If he's ruling out home nations coaches then that only really leaves Geech but how would Bath feel about that?

Any chance Woodward or Henry would want/get another crack at it?

I would rather have my nippples blow torched off than see SCW back in charge of a lions tour. 2005 was a disaster that tarnished the Lions ethos and comeraderie.

Geech's tour in 2009 recaptured what it meant to be a Lion, for the players and the coaching staff. Henry is a good shout, I would like to see PDV or Lievermont taking charge of the 2013 tour

I think Gatland would be the obvious choice. He's been on a tour before, McGeechan rates him highly (which will carry great weight with Irvine) and the likely skipper, Warburton, would work well with Gatland.

Edwards would be a likely contender to accompany him, perhaps Andy Robinson to coach the forwards.

Kidney wouldn't be a daft pick either. Knows a thing or two about beating Australia in a high pressure match.

RuggerRadge2611 wrote: Geech's tour in 2009 recaptured what it meant to be a Lion

What, you mean to go down south and get hammered?

flyhalffactory wrote:Euan Murray - destroyed the England front row on his own -

Well he gave Matt Stevens problems in the first half, but he had problems against everyone and England were on top in the scrum after half time. He's obviously a fantastic player, but his refusal to play or train on Sundays may rule him out of the next tour.

flyhalffactory wrote:Richie Gray -Wales were pretty poor in the line out -

Gray doesn't run the Scottish lineout though does he? And I think Wales' problems were more to do with Bennett than the locks. May be wrong though.

flyhalffactory wrote:Schlong Lamont - had both England centres in his pocket, and will only get better working with Nigel Davies down PyS -

Well Tuilagi was fantastic against Scotland, and Tindall's anonymity wasn't restricted to that game. Lamont may make the squad but I doubt he'll get near the test team at all.

flyhalffactory wrote:Tim Visser (residency allowed by then)- Awesome now -

I'll give you that one. Haven't seen him myself but he's being touted a lot on here.

Props: A Jones, D Cole, E Murray, C Healy and G Jenkins
Hookers: M Rees, R Best and D Hartley
Second row: C Lawes, POC, L Charteris, R Gray and B Davies
Back row: D Ferris, SOB, D Lydiate, S Warburton, J Barclay, J Heaslip and T Falatau

Forwards: 20

Scrum halves: C Murray, B Youngs and Laidlaw
Fly halves: R Priestland, T Flood and J Sexton
Centres: J Roberts, J Davies, S Lamont, M Evans and M Tuilagi
Wings: T Bowe, G North, C Ashton
Full backs: B Foden, F Jones and L Halfpenny

Backs: 17

Don't understand why people are picking Mike Philips, don't rate him as a scrumhalf really, as an athlete I do but not as a guy who gets the ball out of the rucks quickly and on a silver platter for his 10.

Think Max Evans in a good attacking team could be nothing short of lethal. Really like his elusive running. Ansbro may get in there too as may BOD.

Jones is in there cos I can see big things on the horizon for this guy as long as he can avoid injuries for a while!

Not sure on Bradley Davies but put him in anyways.

ACtually would also bring Visser and hopefully Bowe will be a centre by then in BOD's absence.

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:Don't understand why people are picking Mike Philips, don't rate him as a scrumhalf really, as an athlete I do but not as a guy who gets the ball out of the rucks quickly and on a silver platter for his 10.

I thought Philips had a very good RWC, He was superb against Ireland but his awful descision making in the French half cost Wales a place in the final IMO. He completely butchered 3 drop goal set ups and looked all over the place without Priestland.

He's the form home nations scrum half still though.

1. Healy
2. Ford
3. A.Jones
4. AWJ
5. Charteris
6. Ferris
7. Warburton (c)
8. Faletau
9. Lloyd Williams
10. Rhys Preistland
11. George North (Tim Visser?)
12. Jamie Roberts
13. Manu Tuilagi
14. Tommy Bowe
15. Leigh Halfpenny

16. Gethin Jenkins
17. Matthew Rees
18. Courtney Lawes
19. Toby Faletau/Dan Lydiate/SOB/Heaslip/Croft/Haskell.....too many choices)
20. Mike Phillips
21. Jonathon Sexton
22. Keith Earls

1. Healy
2. Ford
3. A.Jones
4. AWJ
5. Charteris
6. Ferris
7. Warburton (c)
8. Faletau
9. Lloyd Williams
10. Rhys Preistland
11. George North (Tim Visser?)
12. Jamie Roberts
13. Manu Tuilagi
14. Tommy Bowe
15. Leigh Halfpenny

16. Gethin Jenkins
17. Matthew Rees
18. Courtney Lawes
19. Toby Faletau/Dan Lydiate/SOB/Heaslip/Croft/Haskell.....too many choices)
20. Mike Phillips
21. Jonathon Sexton
22. Keith Earls

Not one person has mentioned Lloyd Williams at 9.

He will be Wales's 9 by then and is better than any of the 9's mentioned on here. His fitness, speed and accuracy of pass, and his ability to break are all better than any of the above. Watch this space.

Scott Williams if he can get some time for Wales is a far better centre than Lamont now, Lamont can barely make the Scarlets side and I would bet my house he will not be on the Lions tour.

roddersm wrote:

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:Don't understand why people are picking Mike Philips, don't rate him as a scrumhalf really, as an athlete I do but not as a guy who gets the ball out of the rucks quickly and on a silver platter for his 10.

I thought Philips had a very good RWC, He was superb against Ireland but his awful descision making in the French half cost Wales a place in the final IMO. He completely butchered 3 drop goal set ups and looked all over the place without Priestland.

He's the form home nations scrum half still though.

Rodders, my take on it is that it's just as well he scored the tries he did because apart from them he was so frustrating to watch. Then again, maybe I'm weird in wanting my scrum half to get the ball away sharpish.

I want to see Lloyd Williams play eighty minutes against Australia next month. He's a much better scrum half, for my money.

roddersm wrote:

pete (buachaill on eirne) wrote:Don't understand why people are picking Mike Philips, don't rate him as a scrumhalf really, as an athlete I do but not as a guy who gets the ball out of the rucks quickly and on a silver platter for his 10.

I thought Philips had a very good RWC, He was superb against Ireland but his awful descision making in the French half cost Wales a place in the final IMO. He completely butchered 3 drop goal set ups and looked all over the place without Priestland.

He's the form home nations scrum half still though.

Completely agree with Roddersm here. Yes, there are important limitations to his game, but against Ireland he was a match winner, and there are few scrum halves available to the Lions that offer you that. I think Ben Youngs, once fully fit, is a viable alternative, and prior to injury, Danny Care was looking really sharp. Other candidates will be Laidlaw and Cusiter (once fit) from Scotland, Murray and Redden from Ireland (I think Murray will soon win that battle) and Simpson from England (a player will oodles of potential).

Still, none can yet hold a candle to Genia. One position where Australia will have an edge I suspect.

Haven't seen nearly enough of Lloyd Williams to make a judgement. Will look out though.

Thought the two young Osprey half backs in the LV looked really sharp the other day (against Exeter I think). Talent to burn there, especially that electric fly half.

despite a poor world cup, Hook is to talented a player to leave behind, especially when he finds some sort of form playing in france

Shouldn't that be 'IF he finds some sort of form playing in France?'

Could anyone see a 2nd row of Charteris and Gray working? There wouldn't be much lineout ball stolen from the Lions eh.

Stevens
Bennet(on form hooker atm)
Jones
Gray
Charteris
O'Brien
Warburton
Faletau
Youngs
Priestland
Bowe
Roberts
Earls
North
Foden

Subject to much change within 2 years of course.

I really really rate Hook as a player, but it looks like he's moving to play 10, and I think Priestland, Flood and Sexton have the edge on him.

It's very early days though, and all sorts can happen between now and then. England in particular are going to need to sort out their options at 10, and all sorts could emerge from that.

I worry for Hook, he is arguably the most talented player Wales have but he may well end up a bit part player due to his versatility. Jack of all and master of none.

funnyExiledScot wrote:I really really rate Hook as a player, but it looks like he's moving to play 10, and I think Priestland, Flood and Sexton have the edge on him.

It's very early days though, and all sorts can happen between now and then. England in particular are going to need to sort out their options at 10, and all sorts could emerge from that.

I reckon the Sarries 10 Farrell is a fantastic player. I would expect him to feature for England in the 6N.

Oh no... another "if I was to pick a Lions squad now" post...

England have a poor World Cup, Wales have a good one. All of a sudden the squad looks very Welsh.

I have admired the Welsh and how they performed in the World Cup, but if they follow up by having a poor 6N, do they suddenly become bad and therefore ruling themselves out of contention?

So, so much rugby to be played between now and then; 2 6 Nations tournaments, Autumn Series, not to mention countless Heineken Cup games...

I hate these articles.

doctornickolas wrote:Not one person has mentioned Lloyd Williams at 9.

He will be Wales's 9 by then and is better than any of the 9's mentioned on here. His fitness, speed and accuracy of pass, and his ability to break are all better than any of the above. Watch this space.

*cough* look just above your post....

I think scrumhalves like Philips and O'Leary are really good at certain game plans and can boss around games by bullying others but if the forwards are in a mighty aggressive mood or expect the big muscular 9 to come at them more often than not the 9 ends up on his ass or lying on top of the ruck he was just behind.

It's a certain style I think and it really slows the game down. I much prefer a 9 in the mould of Genia, Yachvilli or Pichot who get the ball away quick make breaks and in Yachvillis case kick more intelligently than most 10s.

I think a lock pairing of Gray and POC or Gray and Lawes would be best myself.