The Klitschkos - why do we watch?

Everyone is aware that they have been at the top of boxing for a long time. Their contracts are disgracefully over-binding just so they can have things their own way and make as much money as possible. They are ordered by their adopted German public.

Why do we watch them? It's not really for their absolutely impregnable defences which is about as exciting as grey paint or for their vicious brutal knock-outs as they only happen once in a blue moon now.

No, we watch them because we want to see how they are eventually going to lose.

Vitali will eventually be out-hustled and out-worked. He showed he was slowing down badly last night - he wasn't troubled by Chisora's punches, but Dereck did take the fight to him and he struggled. (well a bit, anyway!!)

And you just know that Wlad's time will come when someone thumps him with a lucky punch on the chin a la Corrie Sanders. It'll probably be in 2019 though, when he's 42...

I have only ever watched one of there fights live and that was against Haye, aside from that I have zero interest in watching them fight.

So the answer is I don't watch.

Probably because we want someone to beat them, also their ring entrances are usually top drawer. I think chisora showed last night that Vitali isn't the unbeatable monster he was built up to be and the people who call them the greatest ever really do look foolish.

BoxingFan88 wrote:Probably because we want someone to beat them, also their ring entrances are usually top drawer. I think chisora showed last night that Vitali isn't the unbeatable monster he was built up to be and the people who call them the greatest ever really do look foolish.

Hes nearly 41 in all fairness. How many of the great heavyweights were as good as him at that age? If there was an all time great heavyweight around at the moment then his time would be up but a 118-110 win over a challenger is hardly evidence that hes done for. Hes still comfortably a top 2 heavyweight by the looks of things.

But then again Manos he had years of inactivity so his age can be somewhat misleading, it is arguably the second part of his career that has given him his reputation rather than the first part.

I agree with Manos, I really think the brothers get a lot of undeserved flak. Fighters, fans and press can all moan about the contracts, ring entrances, gloves ect you get the picture, however the result is always the same in the ring which counts. Seems both get the blame for the division being so poor, if it weren't for the brothers I'd shudder to think how many of the straps were getting exchanged and who'd we have staking a claim for champion.

Two well mannered, likable family men who are great fighters and champions, I wish we had more of them in today's sport society.

manos de piedra wrote:

BoxingFan88 wrote:Probably because we want someone to beat them, also their ring entrances are usually top drawer. I think chisora showed last night that Vitali isn't the unbeatable monster he was built up to be and the people who call them the greatest ever really do look foolish.

Hes nearly 41 in all fairness. How many of the great heavyweights were as good as him at that age? If there was an all time great heavyweight around at the moment then his time would be up but a 118-110 win over a challenger is hardly evidence that hes done for. Hes still comfortably a top 2 heavyweight by the looks of things.

The level of opposition has to be taken into consideration.

tcribb wrote:I agree with Manos, I really think the brothers get a lot of undeserved flak. Fighters, fans and press can all moan about the contracts, ring entrances, gloves ect you get the picture, however the result is always the same in the ring which counts. Seems both get the blame for the division being so poor, if it weren't for the brothers I'd shudder to think how many of the straps were getting exchanged and who'd we have staking a claim for champion.

Two well mannered, likable family men who are great fighters and champions, I wish we had more of them in today's sport society.

Amen to that seems the glass is always half empty when it comes to the brothers. The current favourite seems to be that their contracts are tough, funny don't see too many people holding that against Sugar Ray Robinson who was every inch as difficult to deal withas the brothers, far as I'm concerned they are top of the tree and have got their through graft, to the victor goes the spoils and all that.

Am a little staggered by what I have read today with people inferring that in some ways the brothers are responsible for last nights shameful events, two intelligent, articulate multi lingual model professionals who did absolutely nothing to involve themselves in the brawl last night yet still manage to get the blame in front of a known loud mouth self publicist and a convicted wife beater who has previously been banned for biting an opponent, absolutely baffling.

Good post Rowley mate.

Nothing to add to that as I agree 100%, two class acts figure heads of the sport we love.Think the pair should give both Brits a wide berth, nothing short of disgraceful, couple of jokes trying to steal the limelight when in reality both have shouted pre fight and delivered little, however as much as I don't like the man Chisora showed effort and spirit, but should be banned in my opinion.

Agree with all the level headed comments here.

The criticism seems to be bilge, frankly. Stuff like "they make me want to vomit" has no place on a boxing forum.

Much of it is reactionary criticism anyway.

Essentially - once you praise someone enough - praising them further is boring as there's nothing new to say, so you have to criticise. Its also "edgy" and "cool" to be a contrarian.

This leads us to people swearing blind that black is white.

Statements like "Haye was well within his rights to behave as he did, lots of boxers have done that. Chisora's fault"
"Chisora didn't get hit with a bottle" (excuse me? We saw it?)
"The K-bots can't be nice guys because they are tough to deal with" (really? SRR? Floyd Mayweather? SRLvHagler? Arum for Pacquiao?)

They are the most talented fighters in the sports flagship division. Further to that - they're erudite and they don't disgrace boxing. How wicked of them.

I respect Wlad as a boxer. I recall a thread when I said he was top 10 ATG, then corrected it to top 15. What sickens me about them is their holier than thou attitude. Not my taste especially when I believe it is false.

azania wrote:I respect Wlad as a boxer. I recall a thread when I said he was top 10 ATG, then corrected it to top 15. What sickens me about them is their holier than thou attitude. Not my taste especially when I believe it is false.

You provide some valid quotes to back that up regarding "holier than thou" and I'll take it more seriously than believing it to be your usual contrarian bluster.

Think he's copying my words there Oxy, they seem to feel as though they command respect even though they have done very little to make it so, respect is earned it's not a god given right.

Imperial Ghosty wrote:Think he's copying my words there Oxy, they seem to feel as though they command respect even though they have done very little to make it so, respect is earned it's not a god given right.

Damn right. And I respect the two most dominant HWs since Lewis retired.

I respect the only HWs of the last 20 years - where the challengers actively avoid the champions.

I respect the way they carry themselves outside the ring - when it would be easy, if they so wished it - to behave like Tyson did in his title reign.

And I respect their humanitarian efforts.

To me - they've done more than enough inside and outside the ring to be worthy of respect.

Fight often and against anyone and everyone who emerges as a genuine challenger, always turn up in shape, never reduce themselves to the gutter level in interviews no matter what provocation they have to endure from opponents and from what I can see have a genuine desire to involve themselves in the democratic process in their home land. Without trying too hard and on the back of no research these things would all seem to be true of the brothers and acts that are worthy of respect.

Not doubting they are worthy of respect, but they are very dull to watch in the ring 95% of the time.

I don't care about there humanitarian efforts or crap like that but they have done little to make me respect them.

1. Hometown fighters
2. Disgraceful contracts, say what you want about Pacquiao and Mayweather they at least give their opposition a fair share of the purse.
3. Playing up to the gentleman card when they are anything but
4. Carry overmatched opponents to the final rounds

I respect Chisora but I don't respect either of them.

To me, their whole act of being such great guys is utterly boring and drives me away, they have no real charisma and seem manufactured, I watch them to see them box, but find msyelf immensly bored whilst doing so, Chisora fight last night was relatively entertaining, but it was down to Chisora charging at him like a madman more than anything, the only other entertaining fight I've seen either of them in was Lennox Lewis, Wlad for me hasn't been in a fight that was genuinely good to watch.

Imperial Ghosty wrote:I don't care about there humanitarian efforts or crap like that but they have done little to make me respect them.

1. Hometown fighters
2. Disgraceful contracts, say what you want about Pacquiao and Mayweather they at least give their opposition a fair share of the purse.
3. Playing up to the gentleman card when they are anything but
4. Carry overmatched opponents to the final rounds

I respect Chisora but I don't respect either of them.

1. Vitali has fought away from Germany for 7 of his last 13 fights. Mayweather hasn't fought out of his hometown of Vegas in years.
2. Haye nearly took 50/50 with Wlad - and he really didn't deserve that money. The K-bros are not unreasonable with cash. Compared with Sugar Ray Robinson for instance? And no-one - other than Burley fans ever bothers to remember his antics.
3. Anything but gentlemen? Well I know that Chisora bit a man, kissed a man in the ring and attacked an ex-girlfriend. Then slapped an opponent, spat at his brother and started a brawl in a press conference. I don't believe Wlad or Vitali have ever done anything like that. If I had to pick which one was the gentleman - I know which one I would pick.
4. That's a stylistic complaint. And one that you should take up with the likes of RJJ as well. Its also BS. If you're winning - you can win however you like to win - and the fans can pay to watch. If you don't like what happens in the ring - don't watch - I happen to admire their style. Its comprehensive and destructive and both of them have some of the all time highest career KO percentages. I trust that you also hold Ali in disdain for taking so long with the likes of Wepner and Shavers.

AlexHuckerby wrote:To me, their whole act of being such great guys is utterly boring and drives me away, they have no real charisma and seem manufactured,

Other than a subjective "feeling" are you going to back that up with any evidence of it?

I haven't come across a report of someone who has met them and left with a bad impression. People meet them and seem to rave about how genuinely nice guys they are.

Depends what you what Alex, they're so boring because they leave nothing to chance and are so dominant, Floyd Mayweather is the same you could say he hasn't been in a decent fight either, but because he acts pre fight so boorish and in my opinion absolute stomach churning I can't stand to listen to the chap, but he sells well because of this.

I'm upset at the amount of criticism both chaps receive, if they were two rude obnoxious, full of hyperbole chaps I'd understand but Im baffled.

Can't agree with much of that Oxy.

Where do you propose Mayweather to fight when he's fighting american fighters also based in Las Vegas? Was hardly hometown when he faced De La Hoya was it nor Ortiz, Mosley, Hatton or Cotto, all fighters who by choice would fight there.

Ali did it with style on the whole while the brothers do it such a manner that I don't bother watching them aside from Germany who cares about them? KO percentages mean something if you are knocking good opponents out but they don't, the majority are corner or referee stoppages.

tcribb wrote:

I'm upset at the amount of criticism both chaps receive, if they were two rude obnoxious, full of hyperbole chaps I'd understand but Im baffled.

You and me both, we are united in our bafflement cribb, for me genuinely feel people confuse crude oafishness with charisma nowadays. whenever I have seen either of the brothers interviewed i have always found them honest, accomodating, articulate and charming, i'll take that over Haye's "hilarious" gang r**e jokes any day of the week, but maybe I'm getting old.

oxring wrote:

AlexHuckerby wrote:To me, their whole act of being such great guys is utterly boring and drives me away, they have no real charisma and seem manufactured,

Other than a subjective "feeling" are you going to back that up with any evidence of it?

I haven't come across a report of someone who has met them and left with a bad impression. People meet them and seem to rave about how genuinely nice guys they are.

Watch ANY interview on Youtube with them. job done.

AlexHuckerby wrote:

oxring wrote:

AlexHuckerby wrote:To me, their whole act of being such great guys is utterly boring and drives me away, they have no real charisma and seem manufactured,

Other than a subjective "feeling" are you going to back that up with any evidence of it?

I haven't come across a report of someone who has met them and left with a bad impression. People meet them and seem to rave about how genuinely nice guys they are.

Watch ANY interview on Youtube with them. job done.

Not really. About as done as putting "FACT" at the end of a sentence.

As rowley said - confusing oafishness, wearing headless t-shirts and making jokes about gang Cuddle in a bad way with charisma.

Imperial Ghosty wrote:Can't agree with much of that Oxy.

Where do you propose Mayweather to fight when he's fighting american fighters also based in Las Vegas? Was hardly hometown when he faced De La Hoya was it nor Ortiz, Mosley, Hatton or Cotto, all fighters who by choice would fight there.

Ali did it with style on the whole while the brothers do it such a manner that I don't bother watching them aside from Germany who cares about them? KO percentages mean something if you are knocking good opponents out but they don't, the majority are corner or referee stoppages.

How about Marquez? Mexican fighter on a Mexican national holiday.

Hell - it would be helped if he'd even travel around the states - maybe fight at the garden once, or Texas once (although we know why he won't fight in Texas...)

To keep things simple - you accused them of being hometown fighters. I pointed out and proved Vitali isn't. Lest we forget - Arreola was fought in the Staples centre - practically a home fight for him. Adamek was fought in Poland.

Secondly - Ali struggled past his second rate opponents "with style"? You're scraping the barrel for criticism now Ghosty. RJJ was carrying his opponents as well - doesn't make much difference really does it?

Some of the stoppages they have produced have been scary looking KOs. Manny Steward rates Wladimir as the most naturally powerful HW he has worked with. Frankly - I don't care whether its the ref, the corner or political intervention that stops the fight - watching the Kbros throw a straight right is a joy to behold.

rowley wrote:

tcribb wrote:

I'm upset at the amount of criticism both chaps receive, if they were two rude obnoxious, full of hyperbole chaps I'd understand but Im baffled.

You and me both, we are united in our bafflement cribb, for me genuinely feel people confuse crude oafishness with charisma nowadays. whenever I have seen either of the brothers interviewed i have always found them honest, accomodating, articulate and charming, i'll take that over Haye's "hilarious" gang r**e jokes any day of the week, but maybe I'm getting old.

Me and you both mate

The days of Langford one lined but innocent put downs are over, too many fighters seem to sell themselves acting like this gangster type egotistical prats.

The Klitschko's have been nothing but gentleman, media and fan friendly if that's a turn off, I worry for the sport and humanity.

oxring wrote:

azania wrote:I respect Wlad as a boxer. I recall a thread when I said he was top 10 ATG, then corrected it to top 15. What sickens me about them is their holier than thou attitude. Not my taste especially when I believe it is false.

You provide some valid quotes to back that up regarding "holier than thou" and I'll take it more seriously than believing it to be your usual contrarian bluster.

They come across as gentlemen in a brutal sport. Yet they spend time tying up opponents in slave contracts, disrupting their training, requiring them to say how high when they say jump. I mean entering Chisora's drssing room and demanding they re=wrap the hands and denying the same right to Chisora's team. That is low and not gentlemanly like. Level playing field is something which is alien to them.

More importantly, if you get ghosty and I agreeing on something, you know we're correct.

Bottom line is Oxy I don't rate them, cant stand them and will never respect them, they have dragged heavyweight boxing to an all time low.

Jones and Ali fought in such a way that it was a pleasure to watch them and I personally don't rate Jones, I could watch them fight round after round but the brothers produce such borefests I wish they would get it over with, Lewis did most of the time so why can't they?

oxring wrote:

AlexHuckerby wrote:

oxring wrote:

AlexHuckerby wrote:To me, their whole act of being such great guys is utterly boring and drives me away, they have no real charisma and seem manufactured,

Other than a subjective "feeling" are you going to back that up with any evidence of it?

I haven't come across a report of someone who has met them and left with a bad impression. People meet them and seem to rave about how genuinely nice guys they are.

Watch ANY interview on Youtube with them. job done.

Not really. About as done as putting "FACT" at the end of a sentence.

As rowley said - confusing oafishness, wearing headless t-shirts and making jokes about gang Cuddle in a bad way with charisma.

Which is why I was saying it originally as in my opinion...

tcribb wrote:

rowley wrote:

tcribb wrote:

I'm upset at the amount of criticism both chaps receive, if they were two rude obnoxious, full of hyperbole chaps I'd understand but Im baffled.

You and me both, we are united in our bafflement cribb, for me genuinely feel people confuse crude oafishness with charisma nowadays. whenever I have seen either of the brothers interviewed i have always found them honest, accomodating, articulate and charming, i'll take that over Haye's "hilarious" gang r**e jokes any day of the week, but maybe I'm getting old.

Me and you both mate

The days of Langford one lined but innocent put downs are over, too many fighters seem to sell themselves acting like this gangster type egotistical prats.

The Klitschko's have been nothing but gentleman, media and fan friendly if that's a turn off, I worry for the sport and humanity.

Very much agree. I appreciate not everyone likes their style or rates them highly as fighters but some of the sheer hostility towards them I find hard to understand.

oxring wrote:

Imperial Ghosty wrote:Think he's copying my words there Oxy, they seem to feel as though they command respect even though they have done very little to make it so, respect is earned it's not a god given right.

Damn right. And I respect the two most dominant HWs since Lewis retired.

I respect the only HWs of the last 20 years - where the challengers actively avoid the champions.

I respect the way they carry themselves outside the ring - when it would be easy, if they so wished it - to behave like Tyson did in his title reign.

And I respect their humanitarian efforts.

To me - they've done more than enough inside and outside the ring to be worthy of respect.

They are boring inside and outside the ring. Lewis was boring outside the ring. but delivered inside it with exciting fights. Fine be politicians all they want. But I want edge of my seat stuff and clean KO's. They dont deliver.

I've said this before just to show I am not bias. Floyd is the best boxer at the moment by a mile. But inside he doesn't deliver edge of the seat stuff. His mouth does the work. If he was humble and gentlemanly like the Ks he wouldn't command the column inches he does.

Boxing needs boxers who crossover. Not boring automatons however humble and nice to grannies they may be.

Since when has boxing been a barometre of humanity? It isn't. Its an escape. Entertainment. Do the brother's entertain you inside the ring?

"The Klitschko's have been nothing but gentleman, media and fan friendly
if that's a turn off, I worry for the sport and humanity."

erm- they create an unlevel playing field, couldnt be less unsporting- chirosa couldnt even play his own music- its a total joke. Your being played big time pal.

azania wrote:

oxring wrote:

azania wrote:I respect Wlad as a boxer. I recall a thread when I said he was top 10 ATG, then corrected it to top 15. What sickens me about them is their holier than thou attitude. Not my taste especially when I believe it is false.

You provide some valid quotes to back that up regarding "holier than thou" and I'll take it more seriously than believing it to be your usual contrarian bluster.

They come across as gentlemen in a brutal sport. Yet they spend time tying up opponents in slave contracts, disrupting their training, requiring them to say how high when they say jump. I mean entering Chisora's drssing room and demanding they re=wrap the hands and denying the same right to Chisora's team. That is low and not gentlemanly like. Level playing field is something which is alien to them.

More importantly, if you get ghosty and I agreeing on something, you know we're correct.

Az - if I agree with you about anything, I start to question my sanity - and I believe ghosty should start to consider his.

The handwraps? Why did Chisora have his hands wrapped w/o supervision in the first place? He knows that he's going to have to unwrap them again. That's the same bull that Margarito tried to pull (except without the cheating) against Mosley. The commisioner was there laughing with Margarito and Garcia with the wraps finished - when Nazeem made them do it all over again. Look what happened there...Klitschko's well within their rights to make the hands get re-wrapped.

Disrupting their training? Yes - Chisora ended up messed around a bit (mostly Haye's fault for vacilliating over a Wlad date, signing for the fight, pulling out with a fake back injury, offering the fight then signing for Harrison etc) - however - how many other of their opponents have ended up in the same situation?

The contracts aren't worse than Arum's, Mayweathers or SRR's or SRL's. So if you're going to hate on the brothers - hate on them all.

Entertainment within the ring is a different issue. I personally find them entertaining.

Perhaps they're too sophisticated for the taste of the more simple minded - who seem to want 1 punch KOs against overmatched opponents and jokes about beheading, shooting, burning, and Cuddle in a bad way.

mystiroakey wrote:"The Klitschko's have been nothing but gentleman, media and fan friendly
if that's a turn off, I worry for the sport and humanity."

erm- they create an unlevel playing field, couldnt be less unsporting- chirosa couldnt even play his own music- its a total joke. Your being played big time pal.

A level playing field I beg your pardon ? It's a hardly a mitigating reason why he lost the fight? as far as I'm concerned its completely level when both are in the ring wearing gloves. Being champion means something and if it means turning off your ring music to get a shot at the title so be it.

I guess you wouldn't class Chisora slapping Vitali pre fight as unsporting then !

Why was Chisora denied the right to do the same to Vit?

Actually Mayweather offers fair contracts. He doesn't call for options that tie his opponents up should he win. Plus he doesn't offer 95%-5% purse split.

azania wrote:Since when has boxing been a barometre of humanity? It isn't. Its an escape. Entertainment. Do the brother's entertain you inside the ring?

Yes they do and I bet you tune in every fight.

Ok so all that don't enjoy there style (Which seems to be most) automatically gets lumped in the idiots category, fair does...

AlexHuckerby wrote:Ok so all that don't enjoy there style (Which seems to be most) automatically gets lumped in the idiots category, fair does...

If you expand disliking their boxing style - to disliking them as human beings - then that is a sign of a lack of rationality - so yes, I suppose you are absolutely correct.

azania wrote:Actually Mayweather offers fair contracts. He doesn't call for options that tie his opponents up should he win. Plus he doesn't offer 95%-5% purse split.

Fair contracts? Ask Marquez about how fair he felt their contract was.

azania wrote:Why was Chisora denied the right to do the same to Vit?

Actually Mayweather offers fair contracts. He doesn't call for options that tie his opponents up should he win. Plus he doesn't offer 95%-5% purse split.

I forgot we allknow the inside and outsides of everyone contracts and negotiations now.

I have no question they benefit from greater contracts, but at the end of the day until a fighter actually proves his worth with a majority fan base and clout behind them, they gonna have to put up with what theyre given to get a shot.

tcribb wrote:

mystiroakey wrote:"The Klitschko's have been nothing but gentleman, media and fan friendly
if that's a turn off, I worry for the sport and humanity."

erm- they create an unlevel playing field, couldnt be less unsporting- chirosa couldnt even play his own music- its a total joke. Your being played big time pal.

A level playing field I beg your pardon ? It's a hardly a mitigating reason why he lost the fight? as far as I'm concerned its completely level when both are in the ring wearing gloves. Being champion means something and if it means turning off your ring music to get a shot at the title so be it.

I guess you wouldn't class Chisora slapping Vitali pre fight as unsporting then !

i dont rate chisora,haye or the k's- dont give a monkies about any off them- just pawns, germany is getting there rocky character's and there british anti heros- its just 'hollywood'

oxring wrote:

AlexHuckerby wrote:Ok so all that don't enjoy there style (Which seems to be most) automatically gets lumped in the idiots category, fair does...

If you expand disliking their boxing style - to disliking them as human beings - then that is a sign of a lack of rationality - so yes, I suppose you are absolutely correct.

I find there style in the ring boring, and find them outside of the ring boring...

Am I a complete moron due to this?

I like to think no.

tcribb wrote:

azania wrote:Since when has boxing been a barometre of humanity? It isn't. Its an escape. Entertainment. Do the brother's entertain you inside the ring?

Yes they do and I bet you tune in every fight.

Actually I dont. Only saw the Adamek fight a few weeks ago. Haven't seen the Arreola fight or the Sosnowski fight. If I have insomnia one day, I may watch it.

AlexHuckerby wrote:

oxring wrote:

AlexHuckerby wrote:Ok so all that don't enjoy there style (Which seems to be most) automatically gets lumped in the idiots category, fair does...

If you expand disliking their boxing style - to disliking them as human beings - then that is a sign of a lack of rationality - so yes, I suppose you are absolutely correct.

I find there style in the ring boring, and find them outside of the ring boring...

Am I a complete moron due to this?

I like to think no.

Read my post again. I make it clear - that if you are equating boring style inside the ring with their worth as human beings then you are a moron (I don't recall you doing this).

If you find them boring in and out of the ring, it is my own, personal, opinion that you may lack some appreciation of sophistication.

azania wrote:

tcribb wrote:

azania wrote:Since when has boxing been a barometre of humanity? It isn't. Its an escape. Entertainment. Do the brother's entertain you inside the ring?

Yes they do and I bet you tune in every fight.

Actually I dont. Only saw the Adamek fight a few weeks ago. Haven't seen the Arreola fight or the Sosnowski fight. If I have insomnia one day, I may watch it.

I'd often wondered why you have some odd opinions about boxing. Probs because you don't watch enough of it. Arreola-VK was a good fight. I found Sosnowski a bit disappointing - but Arreola came to fight and failed.

Quite sad actually - he gave it his all and came well short. At the end he's a man whose dreams have fallen about his ears.

How many millions did Marquez get from fighting Mayweather Oxy?

Arreola VK was boring, Sosnowski was incredibly boring...

There is just never any drama any rush anything pushing the fight forward, just the same repetetiveness that sadly opponents can't get around, not the K's fault that people can't push them, but the are dreadfully boring in doing so, I watch boxing to be entertained, I do not get that satisfaction when watching the K's fight. The Chisora fight was his most exciting fight since Lewis. what was that 2003?

tcribb wrote:

azania wrote:Why was Chisora denied the right to do the same to Vit?

Actually Mayweather offers fair contracts. He doesn't call for options that tie his opponents up should he win. Plus he doesn't offer 95%-5% purse split.

I forgot we allknow the inside and outsides of everyone contracts and negotiations now.

I have no question they benefit from greater contracts, but at the end of the day until a fighter actually proves his worth with a majority fan base and clout behind them, they gonna have to put up with what theyre given to get a shot.

Fighters can actully do something to improve the contracts they are offered. I am pretty certain when Haye first signed to fight Wlad in 2009 he was getting nowhere near a 5-50 split, however when that fight fell through he went away, got a belt and a PPV following and a fan base and went back to the table from a stronger bargaining position and ended up gettting 50-50. the reason most of their challengers get shafted is because they have no fan base, no PPV audience behind them and limited interests from the major TV networks, none of which is the brothers fault.