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by **Ozzy3213** Thu 11 Oct 2012, 4:38 pm

First topic message reminder :

Second win of the season for Saracens and defeats for Welsh, Wasps and Worcester mean there is just 3 points between the bottom four.

Homepage - Page 10 Aviva-Premiership-Trophy-e1306508139154

2011/2012 – Newcastle Falcons
2010/2011 - Newcastle Falcons
2009/2010 - Saracens
2008/2009 - London Irish

POS	Aviva Premiership	PLAYED	WON	DREW	LOST	P F	P A	P D	T F	T A	TBP	LBP	POINTS
1	Leicester Tigers	8	7	0	1	201	166	+35	21	14	0	1	29
2	Newcastle Falcons	8	6	0	2	202	181	+21	20	15	0	2	26
3	Northampton Saints	8	5	0	3	213	189	+24	24	19	2	3	25
4	London Irish	8	5	0	3	210	194	+16	23	20	2	3	25
5	Harlequins	8	5	0	3	198	189	+9	21	20	1	3	24
6	Sale Sharks	8	4	0	4	199	189	+10	21	19	1	4	21
7	Gloucester	8	4	0	4	193	192	+1	21	20	0	3	19
8	Bath Rugby	8	4	0	4	185	193	-17	17	21	0	3	19
9	London Welsh	8	2	0	6	179	188	-9	18	18	0	6	14
10	London Wasps	8	2	0	6	172	195	-23	16	21	0	5	13
11	Worcester Warriors	8	2	0	6	175	208	-33	15	22	0	3	11
12	Saracens	8	2	0	6	166	209	-43	14	23	0	3	11

Fixture List
European Homepage

Waiting List
1. pullthestrings
2. Bathite

Welcome to Season 5 of the Aviva Premiership fantasty rugby game. Below are the rules of the game which must be adhered to. If there are any situations that arise in the course of the game which are not covered by the rules, a final decision will be made by the RFU (Ozzy3213) as to how the situation will be resolved.

Senior Squads wrote:
The maximum squad size is 40 senior players. If a team has more than 40 players in their squad then they will be fined £1 million per player over the permitted amounts per day for the first seven days. If after 7 consecutive days a team still has more than the permitted number of players then the team will be fined £2 million per player per day, and fined 1 league point per player per day for the next seven days. If after this time a team still has more than the permitted number of players in their squad, the RFU (me) will remove players at it’s discretion to bring them back under the permitted numbers. There will be no right of appeal to players being removed.

Be aware that all tier one international matches which are played during the season will count in the game, and players selected in the matchday 22's for those matches will not be eligible to play for their clubs on that weekend, therefore you must give due consideration to the make up of your squad.

Academy Rules wrote:
Each team will be allowed to have a listed senior academy squad of 20 players. Players who are in the senior academy must be under 22 years of age as of 1st September 2012 (therefore must have been born on or after 1st Septmber 1990). Players who are under the age of 20 (so born after 1st September 1992) AND are in the academy of the club that you are managing in real life, DO NOT need to be listed as senior academy players as part of your 20, but are available to you in this game and cannot be poached by other clubs without paying you a fee.

Should a player not listed in your 20 senior academy players, but part of the clubs academy in real life move clubs in real life, then you will have first option of promoting him to your listed senior academy. If you choose not to take this option he will become property of the club that he moves to in real life in this game.

Transfers wrote:

Domestic (other AP Teams)
Each team has a budget to use in the purchase of players. Domestic transfers between AP clubs, regardless of nationality of player, should be negotiated between the respective managers, and then confirmed on the Domestic Transfer Confirmation Page.

Domestic (Championship and below)
Each team may during the season purchase no more than 3 players from the Championship or the National Leagues. These players must be bid for on the Championship/National League bidding page, and each bid will be considered by me on it's own merits before being accepted or rejected. No bid will be accepted until a minimum of 24 hours has elapsed from the time the bid was made, in order to afford other managers the opportunity to make a counter bid.

Foreign
To make a foreign transfer (i.e from any club outside of the AP, regardless of whether the player is English) a bid should be made on the Foreign Transfers Page, which will be considered by me against the posted guidelines for purchase prices before being accepted or rejected. No bid will be accepted until a minimum of 24 hours has elapsed from the time the bid was made, in order to afford other managers the opportunity to make a counter bid.

Foreign transfers will unlimited during the off season and 2 during the season. The exact dates of the two transfer windows during the season is to be confirmed.

Player Releases wrote:
Managers may choose to release players from their clubs, for which they will be offered compensation

Compensation will be paid as follows

£2 million – current international (must have played international rugby in the previous 12 months)
£1.5 million – former international
£1m – top flight experience
£0.5m – other

If a released player plays in real life for a team outside of this game he will be deemed to have returned to that team. If not then he will be deemed to have signed for a Championship side. If another manager wants to pick a released player up, they will have to bid for him in the same way as for a foreign or Championship/National League player.

Retirements wrote:
There will be no compensation for retiring players. Should a player who retires decide to come out of retirement and play again, then he will automatically go back to the club who he was playing for in the game when he retired.

Fixtures wrote:
There will be 22 Aviva Premiership games per season, plus the play offs. There will also be Heineken Cup, Amlin Challenge Cup and Anglo Welsh Cup matches. These games will take place once a week. A thread will be put up for managers to name their teams on Thursdays, then on Fridays, managers will post the scores that they think will happen from these games (apart from games in which they are involved). An average of all predictions will be taken, and then 0.5 points added to each teams score for each prediction that had them as the winner, and that will then be the final score.

Teams wrote:
When naming your team, not only should you put the starting XV and replacements, but also tactics that your team will employ. Results will be affected by the tactics described.

In addition, each team must have the following:-

At least 10 England qualified players in your matchday 23, and at least 5 of those must be in your starting XV.

At least 2 props and 1 hooker on the bench.

All players must be eligible (not injured or banned).

Failure to comply with these rules will result in forfeiting the match and a 1 league point deduction.

If you fail to submit a team for a match, then the other team will be automatically awarded a 30-0 bonus point win. If both teams fail to submit a team, then it will be scored as a 0-0 draw.

Injuries and Suspensions wrote:
Injuries in this game do NOT reflect real life, they will be generated by me.

Players banned in real life will be ineligible for selection in this game for the duration of the ban.

Inclusion of injured/banned players will result in them being replaced by players on the bench, and the bench not having eight players, which may result in punishment if it concerns the front-row.

Punishment for fielding an ineligible player will be loss of one match point for a first offence, two for a second offence and so on.

Financial Rewards wrote:
There will be no rewards for the result of an individual match, instead the managers will receive cash for predicting.

£1.5m for descriptive predictions
£0.25m for scores on the doors predictions
If you fail to predict without first advising me that you are unable to do so that week, you will be fined £1m for a first offence, £2m for a second offence, £3m for a third offence etc.

AP finishing positions.

Champions: 8m
Runners Up: 6m
Playoff Semi Finalist Losers: 5m
5th: 4m
6th: 3.5m
7th: 3m
8th: 2.5m
9th: 2m
10th: 1.5m
11th: 1m
12th: 0.5m

Heineken Cup

Losing Quarter Finalists - £2 million each
Losing Semi Finalists - £3 million each
Runners Up - £4 million
Champions - £5 million

Amlin Challenge Cup

Losing Quarter Finalists - £1 million each
Losing Semi Finalists - £2 million each
Runners Up - £3 million
Champions - £4 million

Anglo-Welsh Cup

Losing Semi Finalisst - £1 million each
Runners Up - £2 million
Champions - £3 million

If your budgets falls below minus £10 million for any reason, the administrators (ozzy3213) will step in and players from within your squad will be released for the relevant financial compensation in order to bring your budget back above minus £10 million.

by dammit_chris Mon 22 Oct 2012, 6:02 pm

Wonder if any English French-based players will get called up - Wilko singing the praises of Steffon Armitage!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/20025686

by Sgt_Pooly Mon 22 Oct 2012, 6:40 pm

Not sure if any will Chris as they won't be available for the training camps.

by dammit_chris Mon 22 Oct 2012, 7:00 pm

This is what confuses me about it all as they all say that they put it into their contracts that they are available for all get togethers - I am sure Wilko has that and thye all copied him.

Isnt that what they did with Palmer and Haskell 2 years ago?

To be honest though I think Robshaw has the no7 shirt nailed at the moment - but just want someone in the Ebngland squad whose name doesnt rhyme with Phil Dowson...

by Sgt_Pooly Mon 22 Oct 2012, 7:04 pm

I'm not sure they did have it written in, wasn't they real issues with Haskell & Palmer at some point ??

by dammit_chris Mon 22 Oct 2012, 7:23 pm

Always a hard one for English players abroad as in a lot of cases getting to play with top class players will only improve the player - just look at Armitage for Toulon, playing with the guys he does week in week out is obviously doing wonders.

I think they also play less rugby, due to squad sizes, so are better rested, whilst in the AP all of our England players will play tough HC games, go back into the league and then straight into the AI's, then possibly I think its HC games again!

Should consider just playing the LV Cup for the whole of December time or so, gives 4 weeks or so for the fringe players to play and top players to have a rest!

by **Ozzy3213** Tue 23 Oct 2012, 10:40 am

Match thread is up...

https://www.606v2.com/t36384-fantasy-aviva-premiership-round-seven#1629049

will hopefully get the Heino/Amlin results/pools done later.

by Steven_Sharks Tue 23 Oct 2012, 11:32 am

Glasgow have signed Sean Maitland

by stnick88 Tue 23 Oct 2012, 11:35 am

decent signing.

interesting debate on the main forum about England full backs. Beshocked really has it in for Delon Armitage!

by **Ozzy3213** Tue 23 Oct 2012, 11:47 am

He talks utter bollix sometimes. Gems like he's never seen Armitage have a decent game at international level, and never seen him string 3 consistent performances together. Also Mike Brown and Alex Goode are apparently far superior players to an in form Delon.

I had to walk away from that debate as I can't be @rsed discussing stuff with people talking out their hole!

by stnick88 Tue 23 Oct 2012, 12:03 pm

Yeh hes a n ob head.

I agree on Brown, hes quality and for me Englands number 1. But I'd have Delon and Foden above Goode. Goode is a solid, consistent player though.

by Sgt_Pooly Tue 23 Oct 2012, 12:08 pm

Not a more biased poster than Beshocked, some of the stuff he comes out with pro Sarries and anti Tigers is mental.

by **Ozzy3213** Tue 23 Oct 2012, 12:15 pm

If he said something like, "Oh I don't think Delon should play for England due to his disciplinary issues and maybe the boat has sailed and we now have good depth there" then I would disagree, but respect his opinion. When he comes out with the stuff he's put above I just sit there and think what a bell end.

by Sgt_Pooly Tue 23 Oct 2012, 12:29 pm

He was on the other AP game and had to quit as he got so wound up in predo's, I just think he's touchy and highly strung

by stnick88 Tue 23 Oct 2012, 12:57 pm

He comes across like the kind of fan who sits there at games going mental at every little thing that goes against his team.

Perfect person to be sitting behind and wind up!

by Steven_Sharks Tue 23 Oct 2012, 12:58 pm

I do think players playing in France shouldn't be selected though.

by Steven_Sharks Tue 23 Oct 2012, 12:59 pm

I do think players playing in France shouldn't be selected though.

by **Ozzy3213** Tue 23 Oct 2012, 1:04 pm

And that's a fair enough viewpoint Steve. I disagree, as I think we should be selecting the best players we have regardless of where they play, but I can see the arguments about training camps and availability and stuff.

by Guest Tue 23 Oct 2012, 1:06 pm

For me it comes down to is armitage talented enough to play?? The answer is absolutely he is a really gifted player and has performed well for england especially in the early days.

Would i be worried he could lose us a game due to dreadful discipline and one of those silly high tackled?? absolutely

for me his talent outweighs his stupidity and i would have him ahead of a goode for example but Foden and Brown have been great and deserve the spot. Playing in france should count against you but not disqualify you completely.

by Guest Tue 23 Oct 2012, 1:08 pm

My issue is purely around the availability. eg french final this year clashed with england vs south africa 1st test

by Sgt_Pooly Tue 23 Oct 2012, 1:10 pm

If players are fully available that's fine I reckon.

Quite hard to build a style if play if players aren't though so if unavailable for camps I don't think they should be selected.

by Steven_Sharks Tue 23 Oct 2012, 2:15 pm

My feeling behind it is that the English league should be as strong as possible so would like our best players to be playing here instead of France.

by dammit_chris Tue 23 Oct 2012, 2:25 pm

I'd select foreign based English players if they can take part in all the training camps - doesn't seem to do the Welsh any harm with quite a few of their players in France.

After all its a 90minute flight from Nice to London, so it isn't exactly a hardship for them - but like Pooly says if you can't make it to all training camps it is pretty tough to get the style of play right.

Thursday the squad gets announced isn't it? Does anyone know how many changes Lancaster can make to the EPS this time round? Got to be a couple of injuries he can call up, mainly for Foden - would hope May and Sharples are around the training, still not 100% sure if Wade is ready.

by Steven_Sharks Tue 23 Oct 2012, 2:33 pm

My ideal would be that all the best English players played against each other every week. I think there would be positive externalities to young EQ players playing against Steffon, Delon, JW, Shaw, Sheridan and others who have played over there. There is the argument that the likes of Sheridan and Shaw might keep younger EQ players out but I think the issue of poor imported players is more pressing.

by Steven_Sharks Tue 23 Oct 2012, 4:04 pm

Morne Steyn banned for a week as well prop

by dammit_chris Tue 23 Oct 2012, 4:17 pm

Steven I gues the other argument would be that if young English players went to France they would get to train with guys like Wilko, Giteau etc at Toulon week in week out and see what it takes to be a world class player.

There's an 18 year old called Mark Bennett who joined Clermont last year and is tipped to become a world class player - he's not going to get game time in the first team, but must be some experience training alongside Fofana, Rougerie each week.

by Steven_Sharks Tue 23 Oct 2012, 4:21 pm

But if all the best young english players went to france then our own league would suffer hugely, therefore all those left playing in AP wouldn't be playing at a good level.

by Sgt_Pooly Tue 23 Oct 2012, 4:38 pm

dammit_chris wrote:Steven I gues the other argument would be that if young English players went to France they would get to train with guys like Wilko, Giteau etc at Toulon week in week out and see what it takes to be a world class player.

There's an 18 year old called Mark Bennett who joined Clermont last year and is tipped to become a world class player - he's not going to get game time in the first team, but must be some experience training alongside Fofana, Rougerie each week.

That makes no sense Chris to me. You are basically saying the T14 is a much superior league which in all honesty I don't think it is.

Niether Matt Giteau or Wilkinson are currently world class in my eyes. In our league we have players like Nick Evans (whose a better player than both Gits & Wilko imo).

A younger player has more chance of improving getting gametime in a competive league (which he more than likely wouldn't in the T14) than training with players that have been great but are no longer playing at the top of their game and not part of the Int scene.

Keep the youngsters here!!

by dammit_chris Tue 23 Oct 2012, 5:18 pm

In a lot of cases youngsters go out on loan in England to Championship, Div 1/2 clubs, so not always exposed to first team rugby over here.

Just my opinion that players must improve by training with a squad of world class players - top French teams squads are incredible these days - though money that gets thrown in is ridiculous, am sure I read that Clermont spent 16m Euro on their team last year, whilst Tigers spent £4m.

Training facilities over there are far better too.

Not in anyway saying that all youngsters should go over there, but for the ones that do they are going to be getting a very beneficial experience. And it will also mess up the French system by flooding their league with foreign players so another benefit Smile

by Steven_Sharks Tue 23 Oct 2012, 5:22 pm

French style of play though can be very negative. Whilst players talented a fair chance all they might learn is how to boot the ball 60 yards. No tries in the T14 semi finals or final or the All French Amlin final.

by dammit_chris Tue 23 Oct 2012, 5:24 pm

Or they could play for Sarries Steve where they boot it 50 yards into touch.

It's odd how they play like that in the actual French league, but play amazing rugby in the HC. Think Clermont in the first 25mins of the second half against Exeter was some of the best rugby I've seen!

by Sgt_Pooly Tue 23 Oct 2012, 5:51 pm

I still don't understand how training in France would be better than playing competitive rugby.

French training is notoriously low intensity with the French generally saving themselves for match day. If the youngsters don't have the match day they'll just train at lower standard than they would over here and regress slowly.

by dammit_chris Tue 23 Oct 2012, 6:55 pm

Dont think you can train poorly when you have guys like Giteau, Wilko, Botha, Hayman, Sheridan, Jenkins etc in your squad. But I guess we all have different opinions.

If youngsters get gametime then that's the best learning curve, but training with people who have won WC's, HC's and have been the best in their position in the world at some stage can't do any harm at all.

You were right about Mako getting called up to the England squad Pooly, looks like he's going to get named according to quite a few papers - might have to call him back from Steve!

by Sgt_Pooly Tue 23 Oct 2012, 7:01 pm

I didn't say they'd train poorly, just that French teams don't generally train like other NH teams do. Pointless debate anyway as its not happening.

Yea Mako has looked pretty solid, has coped with most in set piece.

by Steven_Sharks Tue 23 Oct 2012, 9:05 pm

I'd appreciate if you could spare him or another LH over the Ai's but after that he's yours. Must be the coaching at Quins you know Wink

by dammit_chris Tue 23 Oct 2012, 10:34 pm

You want to take a few more of my youngsters then and train them up to be internationals! I should be ok with LH's over AIs mate, but not 100% sure who I will have and who I wont for them!

by Sgt_Pooly Tue 23 Oct 2012, 10:54 pm

What a signing Sean Maitland is for Glasgow/Scotland. Lad is a fantastic talent, he'd walk into most NH teams.

Wish I'd never sold him now Prop!

by Steven_Sharks Tue 23 Oct 2012, 11:42 pm

Looks exciting when I've seen him and a fine finisher. Not seen enough to comment on his all round game

by prop_lyd Wed 24 Oct 2012, 9:09 am

Haha well you're not getting him back Pooly!! He's also qualified for Scotland too right? Or not because he played age grade and maori?

by Sgt_Pooly Wed 24 Oct 2012, 9:20 am

I don't think he's played either mate, I know he has a Scottish grandparent.

by dammit_chris Wed 24 Oct 2012, 10:01 am

Apparently Richart Strauss the Leinster hooker is going to be included in the Ireland squad for the AI's.

by Driver Wed 24 Oct 2012, 10:02 am

Hes joined with the intention of playing for the jocks

by prop_lyd Wed 24 Oct 2012, 10:20 am

Ah man, I don't want Strauss to get called up!! Has Dave Ward played much for Quins since his ban?

by Guest Wed 24 Oct 2012, 10:28 am

Been on the bench since Gray got injured a few weeks ago prop

by prop_lyd Wed 24 Oct 2012, 10:44 am

Ok cool I'm guessing he hasn't set the world alight! Just need a few steady performances from him and hope Britton continues to develop!!

by Guest Wed 24 Oct 2012, 10:55 am

Britton looks better and better each week. hugely physical and good darts

by Sgt_Pooly Wed 24 Oct 2012, 11:02 am

Britton's throwing was terrible during U20 WC, seems to really sharpened up.

by Steven_Sharks Wed 24 Oct 2012, 12:05 pm

Rob Buchanan is number 2 for wins atm ahead of ward

by Guest Wed 24 Oct 2012, 12:11 pm

Yes Buchanan does well whenever he gets the chance. be interesting in a year or two when Buchanan has developed a bit.

could be a real tussle between him and grey at quins and maybe england

by prop_lyd Wed 24 Oct 2012, 12:18 pm

So there's me happy to finally get my sh players back and 2 of them are banned?! Blydi typical!!

by Sgt_Pooly Wed 24 Oct 2012, 12:23 pm

You don't have much luck Prop!

Henderson & Luke Marshall called into Ireland squad with Strauss

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