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by **Ozzy3213** Fri 09 Nov 2012, 9:19 am

First topic message reminder :

Saracens move off the bottom of the table after picking up a losing bonus point against Gloucester.

Homepage - Page 12 Aviva-Premiership-Trophy-e1306508139154

2011/2012 – Newcastle Falcons
2010/2011 - Newcastle Falcons
2009/2010 - Saracens
2008/2009 - London Irish

POS	Aviva Premiership	PLAYED	WON	DREW	LOST	P F	P A	P D	T F	T A	TBP	LBP	POINTS
1	Leicester Tigers	10	9	0	1	252	208	+44	27	18	0	1	37
2	Harlequins	10	7	0	3	251	231	+20	27	24	1	3	32
3	Newcastle Falcons	10	7	0	3	250	228	+22	25	19	0	3	31
4	London Irish	10	6	0	4	259	239	+20	28	24	2	4	30
5	Northampton Saints	10	5	1	4	261	241	+20	29	24	2	4	28
6	Gloucester	10	6	0	4	246	237	+9	27	25	0	3	27
7	Sale Sharks	10	5	0	5	252	242	+10	27	25	1	5	26
8	Bath Rugby	10	4	0	6	229	245	-16	21	27	0	5	21
9	London Welsh	10	3	1	6	224	232	-8	22	22	0	6	20
10	London Wasps	10	2	0	8	211	244	-33	19	27	0	7	15
11	Saracens	10	2	1	7	208	255	-47	18	28	0	4	14
12	Worcester Warriors	10	2	1	7	216	257	-41	19	27	0	3	13

Fixture List
European Homepage

Welcome to Season 5 of the Aviva Premiership fantasty rugby game. Below are the rules of the game which must be adhered to. If there are any situations that arise in the course of the game which are not covered by the rules, a final decision will be made by the RFU (Ozzy3213) as to how the situation will be resolved.

Senior Squads wrote:
The maximum squad size is 40 senior players. If a team has more than 40 players in their squad then they will be fined £1 million per player over the permitted amounts per day for the first seven days. If after 7 consecutive days a team still has more than the permitted number of players then the team will be fined £2 million per player per day, and fined 1 league point per player per day for the next seven days. If after this time a team still has more than the permitted number of players in their squad, the RFU (me) will remove players at it’s discretion to bring them back under the permitted numbers. There will be no right of appeal to players being removed.

Be aware that all tier one international matches which are played during the season will count in the game, and players selected in the matchday 22's for those matches will not be eligible to play for their clubs on that weekend, therefore you must give due consideration to the make up of your squad.

Academy Rules wrote:
Each team will be allowed to have a listed senior academy squad of 20 players. Players who are in the senior academy must be under 22 years of age as of 1st September 2012 (therefore must have been born on or after 1st Septmber 1990). Players who are under the age of 20 (so born after 1st September 1992) AND are in the academy of the club that you are managing in real life, DO NOT need to be listed as senior academy players as part of your 20, but are available to you in this game and cannot be poached by other clubs without paying you a fee.

Should a player not listed in your 20 senior academy players, but part of the clubs academy in real life move clubs in real life, then you will have first option of promoting him to your listed senior academy. If you choose not to take this option he will become property of the club that he moves to in real life in this game.

Transfers wrote:

Domestic (other AP Teams)
Each team has a budget to use in the purchase of players. Domestic transfers between AP clubs, regardless of nationality of player, should be negotiated between the respective managers, and then confirmed on the Domestic Transfer Confirmation Page.

Domestic (Championship and below)
Each team may during the season purchase no more than 3 players from the Championship or the National Leagues. These players must be bid for on the Championship/National League bidding page, and each bid will be considered by me on it's own merits before being accepted or rejected. No bid will be accepted until a minimum of 24 hours has elapsed from the time the bid was made, in order to afford other managers the opportunity to make a counter bid.

Foreign
To make a foreign transfer (i.e from any club outside of the AP, regardless of whether the player is English) a bid should be made on the Foreign Transfers Page, which will be considered by me against the posted guidelines for purchase prices before being accepted or rejected. No bid will be accepted until a minimum of 24 hours has elapsed from the time the bid was made, in order to afford other managers the opportunity to make a counter bid.

Foreign transfers will unlimited during the off season and 2 during the season. The exact dates of the two transfer windows during the season is to be confirmed.

Player Releases wrote:
Managers may choose to release players from their clubs, for which they will be offered compensation

Compensation will be paid as follows

£2 million – current international (must have played international rugby in the previous 12 months)
£1.5 million – former international
£1m – top flight experience
£0.5m – other

If a released player plays in real life for a team outside of this game he will be deemed to have returned to that team. If not then he will be deemed to have signed for a Championship side. If another manager wants to pick a released player up, they will have to bid for him in the same way as for a foreign or Championship/National League player.

Retirements wrote:
There will be no compensation for retiring players. Should a player who retires decide to come out of retirement and play again, then he will automatically go back to the club who he was playing for in the game when he retired.

Fixtures wrote:
There will be 22 Aviva Premiership games per season, plus the play offs. There will also be Heineken Cup, Amlin Challenge Cup and Anglo Welsh Cup matches. These games will take place once a week. A thread will be put up for managers to name their teams on Thursdays, then on Fridays, managers will post the scores that they think will happen from these games (apart from games in which they are involved). An average of all predictions will be taken, and then 0.5 points added to each teams score for each prediction that had them as the winner, and that will then be the final score.

Teams wrote:
When naming your team, not only should you put the starting XV and replacements, but also tactics that your team will employ. Results will be affected by the tactics described.

In addition, each team must have the following:-

At least 10 England qualified players in your matchday 23, and at least 5 of those must be in your starting XV.

At least 2 props and 1 hooker on the bench.

All players must be eligible (not injured or banned).

Failure to comply with these rules will result in forfeiting the match and a 1 league point deduction.

If you fail to submit a team for a match, then the other team will be automatically awarded a 30-0 bonus point win. If both teams fail to submit a team, then it will be scored as a 0-0 draw.

Injuries and Suspensions wrote:
Injuries in this game do NOT reflect real life, they will be generated by me.

Players banned in real life will be ineligible for selection in this game for the duration of the ban.

Inclusion of injured/banned players will result in them being replaced by players on the bench, and the bench not having eight players, which may result in punishment if it concerns the front-row.

Punishment for fielding an ineligible player will be loss of one match point for a first offence, two for a second offence and so on.

Financial Rewards wrote:
There will be no rewards for the result of an individual match, instead the managers will receive cash for predicting.

£1.5m for descriptive predictions
£0.25m for scores on the doors predictions
If you fail to predict without first advising me that you are unable to do so that week, you will be fined £1m for a first offence, £2m for a second offence, £3m for a third offence etc.

AP finishing positions.

Champions: 8m
Runners Up: 6m
Playoff Semi Finalist Losers: 5m
5th: 4m
6th: 3.5m
7th: 3m
8th: 2.5m
9th: 2m
10th: 1.5m
11th: 1m
12th: 0.5m

Heineken Cup

Losing Quarter Finalists - £2 million each
Losing Semi Finalists - £3 million each
Runners Up - £4 million
Champions - £5 million

Amlin Challenge Cup

Losing Quarter Finalists - £1 million each
Losing Semi Finalists - £2 million each
Runners Up - £3 million
Champions - £4 million

Anglo-Welsh Cup

Losing Semi Finalist - £1 million each
Runners Up - £2 million
Champions - £3 million

If your budgets falls below minus £10 million for any reason, the administrators (ozzy3213) will step in and players from within your squad will be released for the relevant financial compensation in order to bring your budget back above minus £10 million.

by prop_lyd Sat 24 Nov 2012, 5:30 pm

I'd like to see someone defend Andrew Hore for that!!

by dammit_chris Sat 24 Nov 2012, 5:49 pm

Havent seen the England game - but getting a lot of people slating Flood, any reason for it?

by SirJohnnyEnglish Sat 24 Nov 2012, 5:55 pm

Youngs had a few good touches but didn't have the best game overall from what I saw passing wasn't always the cleanest and a few stupid decisions. Thought Farrell was very poor. Kicking from hand was terrible and he didn't give his team mates much chance with a lot of his passing

by Sgt_Pooly Sat 24 Nov 2012, 5:56 pm

He was nothing past ok Chris.

He looked better when Farrell came off tbh as straight away the standard of execution goes down and you can see that Flood at least passes well and makes on the whole the right choices.

Farrell just looks lost, although his kicking from tee and defending was great. Flood fluffed a couple of kicks he should have made and made one bizarre run from deep that was stupid.

Burns needs to be blooded.

by Sgt_Pooly Sat 24 Nov 2012, 6:09 pm

AB's soooooo good

by **Ozzy3213** Sat 24 Nov 2012, 6:11 pm

Not seen the game yet but listened to the last 20 minutes on the radio. Matt Dawson was saying that Farrell should play 12 as he looks like a 12 playing 10 at the moment. Have to watch the game later to see if I can see what he means.

by Sgt_Pooly Sat 24 Nov 2012, 6:16 pm

You know my stance on Farrell Pete.

To be fair to the lad he defends like a lion and kicks from the tee as good as the best.

But.....you can't play International rugby with such poor execution. His distribution is on the whole very poor. He made a lovely miss pass and it's something he has in his bag but he passes often behind his man and choose to kick(badly) from hand too often.

He's got some great qualities but he shouldn't be playing Int rugby for me.

by prop_lyd Sat 24 Nov 2012, 6:42 pm

Now THAT is how you do it!!!!!!

by Sgt_Pooly Sat 24 Nov 2012, 6:43 pm

That was crazy

by prop_lyd Sat 24 Nov 2012, 6:44 pm

It was awesome!!

by dammit_chris Sat 24 Nov 2012, 6:58 pm

I've said it for ages that Farrell is a 12 who plays at 10 - he never played age group rugby at 10, was thrust in to Sarries team last year as a 10 and doesnt actually play there now. He doesnt have the tactical awareness that a 10 needs.

Pooly, agree with you about Burns, was a bit unsure about his kicking last year but seems excellent this year. I'd have him on the bench, as he offers that something different.

Who played well today for England? SOunds like we actually fronted up!

by prop_lyd Sat 24 Nov 2012, 7:05 pm

Good hands there from Wales, much better performance in 2nd half...Jenkins has really lost form in France.

by **Ozzy3213** Sat 24 Nov 2012, 7:07 pm

Just to let you all know, Fluxy is going to take over Wasps, I know you'll all make him welcome.

by stnick88 Sat 24 Nov 2012, 7:08 pm

pienaar had a stinker pooly. farrelll was awful. agree with u pooly that at least flood passes properly but his kicking was poor.

forwards did well. morgan and parling the pick for me. scrum went well also although looked like corbs was binding dodgily.

by prop_lyd Sat 24 Nov 2012, 7:15 pm

Ok my reaction from Wales: not an awful performance, better than the last couple of weeks. We seemed to want to be behind before performing. Nice to see Cuthbert do more this match, felt Tips had good impact and Andrews wasn't done over too badly. Would like Warburton to be in the ref's ear a bit more.

My standout player was Liam Williams, really performed above how I've seen him before and was well up for the game.

If I had to change anyone I'd like to see Owens start, Priestland to be dropped if Biggar's fit, quicker ball from Phillips and felt the engine room battled well.

People think that's a fair assessment?

by Sgt_Pooly Sat 24 Nov 2012, 7:32 pm

Aye fair as always Prop.

Welcome Flux, sure you'll do well. Stand by for offers lads.

Your boy Launchbury looked class Chris, him and Parling were excellent as was T Youngs(few dodgy throws aside). Morgan grew into it but needs to take on more work.

Backs just ok, Brown played well on wing.

by Fluxy Sat 24 Nov 2012, 8:25 pm

Alright boys, I will get, my page up later tonight. Looking forward to facing off against you guys boxing

by CJB Sat 24 Nov 2012, 11:40 pm

Anyone up for a deal, haven't done one for ages on here

by **Ozzy3213** Sat 24 Nov 2012, 11:41 pm

I'm always open to offers mate, and am sure that Fluxy will be once he's got his page up.

by Guest Sun 25 Nov 2012, 8:28 am

Very good player ratings

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/9700618/England-v-South-Africa-how-the-players-rated-at-Twickenham.html

by dammit_chris Sun 25 Nov 2012, 9:13 am

Going to watch the game now - get the impression our forwards really did well, but our decision making at key times let us down again from a number of players when we got ourselves into key areas.

Am sure when we get Hartley, Lawes and Croft back we could have one of the best packs in the world come 2015. Just need to sort out that back line

by **Ozzy3213** Sun 25 Nov 2012, 9:20 am

I'd say those ratings are about right, with the exception of Wood, who is overmarked by 1 point, and much as I have bashed him before, Parling who is undermarked by 1.

Also a couple of the Boks are undermarked.

Some positives for England, but decision making awful throughout.

by Guest Sun 25 Nov 2012, 9:31 am

I
Would
Have robshaw as a 3 out of 10. His job is captain and he has been miserable at it the last 2 weeks. Such poor decision making.

You see better at local level.

by **Ozzy3213** Sun 25 Nov 2012, 9:43 am

Robshaw had a poor game, but then I have said many times he is not a 7. The balance of our back row is very wrong right now.

Positives

Corbisiero's return - was blowing due to lack of gametime, but showed he is our best scrummaging loosehead by a distance.
Cole - never has a poor game really.
Launchbury/Parling - both played well and look as if they might work as a combination if we can get the back row balance right.

Negatives

Half backs - Poor decision making in this key area and also poor skills cost England dear.
Captain - Again, really poor decisions cost England.
Tom Youngs - showed why he is not yet and international class hooker. Threw a bad one early and went to pieces.
Lack of any real backline moves, we are relying too much on individuals to create something.
Poor basics (far too many knock ons)
Balance of backline not right, no creativity whatsoever.

by Guest Sun 25 Nov 2012, 9:44 am

100%agree pete

by **Ozzy3213** Sun 25 Nov 2012, 9:48 am

Be interesting to see what Lancaster selection to face the All Blacks is!

by Sgt_Pooly Sun 25 Nov 2012, 9:51 am

Robshaw was steady as a player, decisions dubious though.

by dammit_chris Sun 25 Nov 2012, 9:54 am

Healy not happy with Lancaster and lack of tactical nous England are showing

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/international/england/9700824/England-v-South-Africa-the-honeymoon-is-over-and-if-we-dont-improve-we-might-need-an-annulment.html

Criticises Robshaws decision making, says England don;t know what they are doing tactically, only backs option is Tuilagi making breaks, need an out and out international wing instead of Brown there and he's been too slow in blooding Burns at this level.

Sounds as though Launchbury and Haskell both did well though - Corbs made a difference and Wood did well at the breakdown - just starting to watch.

by **Ozzy3213** Sun 25 Nov 2012, 10:03 am

Wood did ok, but expected more from him to be honest. Haskell wasn't on long enough to make a real impression. If it was down to me, Burns would have started at 10 in each of the last 3 games.

by Sgt_Pooly Sun 25 Nov 2012, 10:08 am

Flood wasn't great and then Farrell to come just doesn't add anything really, it just takes away any attacking threat we had.

Burns is the only other option, hopefully get a half next week.

by CJB Sun 25 Nov 2012, 10:28 am

http://www.boxingscene.com/quade-cooper-fight-on-williams-vs-botha-card--59725

Cooper looking to take up boxing.

by dammit_chris Sun 25 Nov 2012, 10:30 am

Pete, who else would you play next week, assuming from what you've said you'd make some changes?

Watching the game and I have absolutely no idea what the tactics are for us - we seem very naive and don't offer enough in attack through the backs. I think that Goode is a very talented rugby player but someone made the point on her last week that we neeed a strike running 15 like every other top team there.

If we are going to keep the Barritt/Tuilagi midfield then we have to get an attacking 10, otherwise we just wont create anything - Brown has looked ok but he's not an international wing, just look at his support lines.

by Sgt_Pooly Sun 25 Nov 2012, 10:35 am

Brown went ok, anything was better than Sharples last week though. We just needed to tighten up on that side really.

I'm thinking the centres may be tweaked

by **Ozzy3213** Sun 25 Nov 2012, 10:44 am

Chris, I would want to make changes, but I am not a fan of wholesale ones as I think that's a recipe for disaster against the All Blacks.

I would start Paice over Youngs in the front row, and go with Care and Burns at half back. The problem is that is 3 pivotal positions being changed, so I wouldn't change much else otherwise it is going to look like a Baa Baas game with a thrown together team not knowing what each other is doing.

Come 6 Nations time the team I want to see would look very different.

by dammit_chris Sun 25 Nov 2012, 10:49 am

England seem to put all their focus on stopping other teams scoring tries and none on scoring them ourselves - wont ever beat a southern hem team with that mind set. By 6Nations I'd like to see a new inside centre, an out and out winger instead of playing guys like Brown and Foden out of position, a ball playing 10.

I'd agree with the changes you've said Pete - big call to start Burns though, Flood definitely out of next week from the sounds of it. He's such a strange player - at times he can can completely boss a game, but then his decision making just goes to pot.

Wonder how long Hore will get for what he did to Davies? A week...liked how the IRB said the ban that was given out to Thomson for treading on the Scottish guys head was far too lenient and they just added one extra on! All Blacks get away with so much more than any other team.

Cant believe Scotland lost to Tonga at home, must be the end of Robinson?

by Sgt_Pooly Sun 25 Nov 2012, 10:51 am

I'd preserver with T Youngs, early days for him and experience will be great. Paice is solid but not the future.

by **Ozzy3213** Sun 25 Nov 2012, 11:05 am

League table updated

by LukeLovesLuka Sun 25 Nov 2012, 11:39 am

Out with mates last night. They all said T.Youngs and Parling our best players. Funny how people see things differently. I was slating the side, saying in particular our backs have nothing, they were much more optimistic.

by **Ozzy3213** Sun 25 Nov 2012, 11:42 am

Were they Tigers fans by any chance Luke? I don't think anyone other than the most blinkered Leicester fans would see Tom Youngs as having been one of our best players yesterday.

by LukeLovesLuka Sun 25 Nov 2012, 11:44 am

No, not at all. I questioned his lineout and they both said he is lee ring and up against probs best lineout in the world. Were saying how often he is our go to man in the tight.

by **Ozzy3213** Sun 25 Nov 2012, 11:44 am

I think Foden on the wing can work Chris, and I wouldn't be against a back three of Ashton, Foden, Goode. The thing is however, if Ashton is not getting on the end of things, he actually brings little else to the side. Unless we can find a way of getting our centres offloading with him hitting the line on their shoulder then we may need to look at picking more of a footballer on the wing who is going to make things happen himself.

by LukeLovesLuka Sun 25 Nov 2012, 11:46 am

Robinson gone.

by **Ozzy3213** Sun 25 Nov 2012, 11:47 am

the Boks lineout is good, but it's not a world class lineout at this stage, and if he wants to be an international hooker then he needs to be able to cope with that. I like Youngs, and he brings some good things to the game, but the basics for him are the scrum and lineout, and he has struggled in both at various times during this series. I would keep him in the EPS and see how he develops, but against the top SH sides at the moment, in my opinion he is not ready to be our starting hooker.

by Driver Sun 25 Nov 2012, 11:54 am

Surprised he's gone now , surely he would have waited till post six nations?

Thought the pick of the Boks was Etzebeth and JP. Louw made a game of it at 7.

Parling and Morgan both looked good whilst Flood looked out of sorts.

If i was SL second half i would of came out with

9.Youngs
10.Goode
11.Joseph
12.Barritt
13.Tuilagi
14.Ashton
15.Brown

by LukeLovesLuka Sun 25 Nov 2012, 11:57 am

Have to do something about our backs. Just have no spark at all for me. Goode was our best back, but he hasn't hit he Fiji heights again. Flood, Farrell, Barritt bore the bejesus out of me.

by Steven_Sharks Sun 25 Nov 2012, 12:02 pm

Barritt has to go with Tuilagi having a crack at 12 untill Twelvetrees ready at Gloucester (looks to have it all)

side for AB's

1. Corbs
2. Youngs
3. Cole
4. Launchbury
5. Parling
6. Wood
7. Robshaw
8. Morgan
9. Care
10. Flood
11. Brown
12. Manu
13. JJ
14. Ashton
15. Goode

Side for 6N

1. Corbs
2. Hartley
3. Cole
4. Launchbury
5. Parling
6. Wood
7. Robshaw
8. Morgan
9. Care
10. Burns
11. Brown
12. Manu/36
13. JJ
14. Ashton
15. Foden

by **Ozzy3213** Sun 25 Nov 2012, 12:03 pm

Farrell is not an international 10. He can play there at AP level in particular for Sarries as he is able to execute their gameplan well. It's really frustrating watching him for England as he looks like a man with the weight of the world on his shoulders and struggles to make the right decision.

I would like to see him tried at 12 for England, as I think he could do well there as a second distributer. His defence is good and as a second tactical kicker i think he could work there.

9. Care
10. Burns
11. Joseph
12. Farrell
13. Tuilagi
14. Ashton
15. Goode

has potential for me, but I still think at this stage would get carved up the AB's next week. Barritt/Tuilagi midfield does not work and I've seen nothing to suggest that it can develop over time. Lancaster needs to start looking at other options pretty quickly.

by Steven_Sharks Sun 25 Nov 2012, 12:04 pm

Armitage in at 7 if he was playing in England

by Driver Sun 25 Nov 2012, 12:07 pm

Tom Taylor (FH) and Hika Elliot (HK) have been called up to the All Blacks.

by Guest Sun 25 Nov 2012, 12:10 pm

Barritt is probably the worst 12 I have seen play for England . He offers nothing.
I would drop Goode and have a strike runner like Blair.
Would be tempted to put Manu at 12 and Joseph 13 with Burns at 10. I am off to the game next week and I would rather us get spanked and play the right way than just trying not to lose.

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