Ireland post Mortem/new coach/new team thread

[Standulstermen]

May as well let the match thread die and have all our ramblings in one place.

Is kidney gone?
Who will be the new coach?
Will BOD, D'arcy, ROG retire?
Changes for France?


All in here guys.

My own selection for France would be

Kilcoyne (Healy if allowed)
Best
Ross
Ryan
Henderson (would be tempted by him at 6 but our tight 5 needs ball carriers)
POM
SOB
Heaslip
Murray
Jackson
Gilroy
Marshall
BOD
?
Kearney

Cronin, court, fitz, DOC, O'Donnell, Reddan, madigan, ?

Can't decide on who spdeserves the wing/outside back bench slot. Best, Kearney need good games.

[Golden]

McFadden on the wing. Hes been in brilliant form there and adds another kicking option to take the pressure off Jackson.

Ruddock or Kiss will be the new coach, unfortunetly

[UlstermaninGlasgow]

O'Callaghan is gone too. Tuohy or Stevenson to come in. Would probably prefer Dan to start with Ryan. And Hendy to 6 ahead of POM.

McFadden at 14, Fitzy on the bench.

[rodders]

Kidney hs to go now. Team is in freefall, looks to be no cohesion there at all. Doesn't seem to be good team spirit either. Attacking play was all over the shop.

ROG and BOD will be gone at the end of the season of sure. D'arcy and POC are contracted for another year. Will POC continue though?

I wouldn't make too many changes for France. A lot of the individual displays weren't that bad, just the execution and decision making. Kidney has made his bed and I expect he will back Heaslip as captain.

Team:

Kilcoyne (Healy if allowed)
Best
Ross
Ryan
DOC
POM
SOB
Heaslip
Murray
Jackson
Gilroy
Marshall
BOD
McFadden
Kearney

Cronin, court, fitz, Henderson, Toner, Reddan, ROG, Earls

[red_stag]

I would actually almost keep with the same starting 15 against France.

I think that bringing in a new goal kicker (such as McFadden) would hurt Jacksons development badly.

The Championship doesn't matter at this stage - it is about player and team development.

Making a raft of changes for next week isn't the right move in my opinion. We're missing a lot of starting players (Healy, Ferris, Sexton, Zebo, Bowe) and while some tinkering is needed we can't go over board.

I think Henderson starting at second row is a good move as it allows us to bring in an actual backrow such as O'Donnell or Coughlan to cover the bench. I think that's the only change I would make to the starting team.

[rodders]

Whats the beef with Court? I though our scrum was dominant until he came off?

[Golden]

Gibson mentioned it on the other thread, Gibbes should be on the coaching ticket. I think this would be a brilliant appointment.

[BelfastDickVet]

Whats the beef with Court? I though our scrum was dominant until he came off?

I was at the game and from what I saw it was Ross who struggled abit, we were going backwards every time when killer came on.

[rodders]

Whats the beef with Court? I though our scrum was dominant until he came off?

I was at the game and from what I saw it was Ross who struggled abit, we were going backwards every time when killer came on.

Thats what I saw too, surprised to read some of the comments on the other thread. Kilcolyne got minced when he came on and couldn't understand why the substitution was made so early.....actually none of the substitutions made sense or strengthened us, bar Henderson who stood out again.

[doctor_grey]

If Kidney goes as coach, you could always make an offer to Phillipe Saint-Andre. He might be looking for a job by April.....

[Standulstermen]

Our scrum definitely wasn't ok at any stage. Court was poor by is own standards but I reiterate, our flankers have a lot To answer for here. Their pushing was non existent

I genuinely don't see how we can call for Tuohy at this stage

[Hookisms and Hyperbole]

There was a lot of under performers and it was the nadir of Kidney's reign. A few players played decently like Ryan, Murray and Marshall. He may have had a very poor game as captain but strictly in terms of playing performance Heaslip was the best backrow player. Jackson did well enough at 10 but obviously his kicking let him down. There's no point in beating around the bush about it, if you are the primary kicker and you don't kick well then you have failed no matter the rest of your game.

Has Best had a poorer match for Ireland? POM was utterly anonymous and demonstrated, just as he did against England that he his not the man for when games get tough. He doesn't work hard enough and doesn't do enough at the breakdown. I didn't think Court did enough to justify his selection and then Kilcoyne came on and was hammered in the scrums. People need to wakeup on O'Brien. Working hard is all well and good and no one can doubt his commitment and effort. But one break this championship aside his ball carrying has been totally ineffective and he gives away too many penalties at the breakdown. People are saying that O'Brien had another excellent game. Aside from his effort and commitment and tackle count against Wales what has he done that is so excellent? In three matches so far the Irish backrow have been dominated by their opponents when it really matters, at key times with penalties and turnovers. SOB is seriously hampered by Kidney's tactics. Let's go back to the World Cup against Wales. All we had in terms of attack was shovelling the ball to O'Brien and Ferris. Wales tackled us off the park. All we had against Scotland was give the ball to O'Brien and the Scots gobbled him up nearly every time.

Earls showed in one move why he has so much potential yet has simply not progressed and will never, ever be an international class centre. Every word that his critics have spoken about his awareness, distribution and linkplay was once again, just as in the autumn internationals, been utterly exposed. How much more evidence to people need? He is the Irish player most likely to make that break as he runs good lines and has an eye for a gap. But he simply doesn't have the footballing brain to bring others into attack. However to suggest that he should never play for Ireland is ridiculous. He is still a better wing than Gilroy who, try aside, had a quiet and uninspiring match and his kicking and kick chase is deplorable at this level.

Rob Kearney will not even smell the Lions tour this summer.

[rodders]

Jackson did well enough at 10 but obviously his kicking let him down. There's no point in beating around the bush about it, if you are the primary kicker and you don't kick well then you have failed no matter the rest of your game.

Accepted but given that he was not primary kicker for his province, nor in good form with the boot going into the game then I don't see how Jackson can carry the can for this.

He played how I would have expected, he defended excellently, showed good hands and was generally good with his distribution,positioning and all round play. His kicking game wasn't good enough but this is exactly consistant with his recent Ulster performances so Kidney knew what he was getting.

It's not like he was in great form anyway and then he bottled it or couldn't make the step up. He's been out of sorts with the boot since christmas.

[Standulstermen]

Hookisms

I agree with a lot of what you say but can you point to when Gilroy kicked? I noticed one which was a shot to nothing as we had the penalty advantage. I don't recall another time. Gilroy did everything that was asked of him, was solid under the high ball and when the ball came his way he took his try. I'm not sure what else he is supposed to have done

[Hookisms and Hyperbole]

Rodders, take the kicking issue out of the equation and he had a pretty decent debut. If Earls and Marshall's distribution had have been better we may have won the match comfortably and we would saying Jackson had a great game, shame about the kicking. But when it comes down to it he was the kicker, he didn't kick his points. Some fans on here will of course say the loss was primarily down to him. Thats nonsense. Nor is it down to Earls or ROG or whoever else. It was an utter collective failure.

One thing is for sure, Heaslip is a poor captain and the decision making process on the pitch undermined Jackson's confidence from the start.

[RuggerRadge2611]

Kidney hs to go now. Team is in freefall, looks to be no cohesion there at all. Doesn't seem to be good team spirit either. Attacking play was all over the shop.

This sort of comment angers me, especially when another esteemed Irish poster commented on the Scottish build up thread pre match with this post ;

Team Injured:

01 Cian Healy
02
03
04 Mike McCarthy
05 Paul O'Connell
06 Stephen Ferris
07 Chris Henry
08
09
10 Jonny Sexton
11 Simon Zebo
12 Gordon Darcy
13
14 Tommy Bowe
15

That's a list of players unavailable through injury or suspension. With 6 game changers in there (Bowe, Zebo, Sexton, Ferris, POC & Healy) and still you blame Kidney.

As I have already said he didn't make The Irish backs (Earls most famously) squander all those chances, the Intense Scottish defence did.

He also didn't make Best lose the plot at lineout time, the Intense Scottish lineout work and taller players did. Players dismissed in the Irish press as being not being effective.

He also didn't make your tight five get mullered in the Scrum.

Ireland have the bones of a good team and I concede the point that Kidney is slow to cap the youngsters that have been playing so well. Under those choices I agree with calls for him to go.

However sifting through the wreckage of you 6N campeign I think Kidney deserves some criticims but he can't be held to account when the bul of Ireland's best players are either injured or not playing well.

The set piece aside, in the 1st half the Irish forwards were dominant, it was in the backs that the issues were obvious and it wasn't Jackson or Marshall's fault, the blame can be placed on the more experience heads of Kearney and Earls who had days to forget.

I'll leave you guys to it but that's my tuppence.

p.s I fully expect you guys to have enough to beat France at home.

[Barney McGrew did it]

Having watched the Sco/Ire game carefully I couldn’t work out why everyone was saying that Scotland had won. I had at look at the score board and that didn’t help, but added to my confusion. I then checked the game stats to find that Ireland had bettered Scotland in possession, territory, penalties conceded, rucks won, possession not kicked away, missed tackles, offloads and line breaks; scrums were even. So no joy there. Then I spotted it, Scotland lost less of their LOs. So there you have it. And maybe a change at the top.

[yappysnap]

Dean Ryan may be free as a consultant...

[dragonbreath]

Lot of panicking going on. There wasn't a lot wrong from a neutrals perspective. Just one of those days when all the good work went unrewarded. You were cliinical against Wales and clinically dead against Scotland. Loads of line breaks loads of territory loads of ball, This is a game you would have won comfortably 99 times out of a hundred.

You were poor against England no getting away from that and handed them the game on a silver platter, England did nothing to win that game except sit back and wait for errors, but you were excellent for a half against us and did everything except win yesterday.

Kidney is not everyones cup of tea but you could argue that the coaches identified Scotlands defensive weaknesses and the plan to exploit them led to three very good chances, that they players failed to execute. Change for change sake is not always a good thing.

[Notch]

Probably the one change I would make is Henderson for O'Mahony to add a ball carrying option. McFadden AT LEAST to the bench as another place kicking option. And Madigan to the bench to replace ROG.

Whilst Court struggled with the rest of our front row, Kilcoyne was really punished. He was thrown to the Lions a bit being brought on into a scrum that was struggling and Court was holding up that end better than he managed. I would have to say about our set piece is that the front row will carry the can for scrummaging/lineout issues and rightly so. But the performances of our second rows and backrows in both set pieces were very far from stellar. Particularly evident in the scrum that Scotland scrummaged as an 8 and we did not.

The Scots targeted Gilroy in the air and he took everything magnificently. Given that, and his finish in no space at all for the try, he was probably our best back which is why I was baffled at his early substitution.

I know that players from the first XV are not normally released for their provinces in rest weeks in the 6N, but with Ulster at home to Treviso maybe it would be a good idea to let Jackson have 40 minutes taking the kicks at goal and down the line?

[RuggerRadge2611]

Also it's important not to take anything away from Scotland. Their defence was outstanding and from the Scottish point of view that defence was a big part in the mistakes Ireland made through intense defencive pressure.

Also our lineout and scrum laid the foundations for the win. Best was in all kinds of trouble thanks to Gray and more importantly Hamilton who was a pain in the erse for Best all game long.

[rodders]

The Scots targeted Gilroy in the air and he took everything magnificently. Given that, and his finish in no space at all for the try, he was probably our best back which is why I was baffled at his early substitution.

I know that players from the first XV are not normally released for their provinces in rest weeks in the 6N, but with Ulster at home to Treviso maybe it would be a good idea to let Jackson have 40 minutes taking the kicks at goal and down the line?

I think that all the substitutions were predetermined. Bar Henderson everyone of theme weekened the side.

Regarding the second point, for Jacksons and Ireland sake he needs to be give primary kicking duties at Ulster. For Ulsters sake Pienaar needs to keep them because he's better.....

[Artful_Dodger]

I agree with many of the posts above about the number of great chances squandered by Earls. The guy simply has incredibly little passing or distribution to his game, the break for the line were he had O'Driscoll on his inside but just tried to go on his own as the pass required wasn't easy demonstrated this. With his passing and distribution game as bad as it is I think its laughable that a lot of fans, particularly Munster fans think this guy is the next 13 for Ireland. Especially when Munster keep signing All Blacks or Spring Boks that are playing 13 for them such as Lualala, Tuitupou, De Villiers and others.

It would be a bit like Ulster signing a top class 10 from New Zealand but still insisting that Paddy Jackson should be Ireland's next 10.

[Notch]

Also it's important not to take anything away from Scotland. Their defence was outstanding and from the Scottish point of view that defence was a big part in the mistakes Ireland made through intense defencive pressure.

I have to disagree. I felt Scotland conceded three very soft linebreaks in midfield. Against a better team you would have been 21 points down and the headlines would be about your leaky defence. The try we did score should have been prevented too.

We let a disorganised Scottish defence off the hook.

[Artful_Dodger]

By the way.....has anybody heard that Adam Ashley Cooper is Leinster bound, I've seen it on both twitter and facebook today.

[Shifty]

To me it looked as though Ireland didn't have the experience and control at fly half to win the game, you didn't score points when the oppertunity arose.

RoG has to go, truth be told Ireland should of let him retire when he announced it at the end of the last world cup, it's hardly a secret he wants to retire but he is being held to his contract by the IRU. He just doesn't have the ability anymore, he can rarely kick with distance and is simply too slow now, secondly what made him one of the greats was his kicking ability and drop goals than stole tight games for them, he can't do it anymore.

I don't think you need to change coaches myself, or do anything drastic, your missing Bowes tries, with him and Zebo you have talent on the wings. PoC is badly missed but still has 1-2 years left I think.

[Shifty]

By the way.....has anybody heard that Adam Ashley Cooper is Leinster bound, I've seen it on both twitter and facebook today.

If true Leinster are bringing in a great player, and using BoD's wages to do it!
80 odd caps and hes what 27-28 years old?

[Hookisms and Hyperbole]

It's easy to defend against backrowers running in straight lines into crowded areas. Scotland dealt with it easily because it was easy to deal with. We have no variations in attack apart from shovelling it to O'Brien and absolutely no offloading game. Just as I said before the match attacking the Scottish midfield would prove fruitful. Though many Scottish posters took exception that I thought Lamont was a poor positional defender at 13 he proved to be so. The fact that we lost to such a poor Scottish side is why so many of us are up in arms.

[GoodinTightSpaces]

The Scots targeted Gilroy in the air and he took everything magnificently. Given that, and his finish in no space at all for the try, he was probably our best back which is why I was baffled at his early substitution.

I know that players from the first XV are not normally released for their provinces in rest weeks in the 6N, but with Ulster at home to Treviso maybe it would be a good idea to let Jackson have 40 minutes taking the kicks at goal and down the line?

I think that all the substitutions were predetermined. Bar Henderson everyone of theme weekened the side.

Regarding the second point, for Jacksons and Ireland sake he needs to be give primary kicking duties at Ulster. For Ulsters sake Pienaar needs to keep them because he's better.....

Gilroy was taken off with a groin injury. a doubt for the france game if the reports are to be believed. also apparently Ryan is struggling with a shoulder injury.

[SecretFly]

Skill provides about 55% I'd say
Belief in the structures and each other is about 40%
The other 5% is the crazy passion to succeed that should be present in any (and all) Internationals.

That 5% has been missing badly in the last number of years. It truly has. The players go through the motions of being fired up sometimes but it's not believable. - It isn't there; not at the anthems, not in the body language on the field.

To use an example, I'll use Court. He's been mentioned above so why not - and I'm not criticising him for yesterday or anything like that...just using him as an example. I don't think I've Ever seen him in that foul belligerent mood in an Irish jersey that I witnessed him in that time he scored his try for Ulster and the defiance and fury of his display of power in the aftermath. Beauty to behold...I only wish he and the rest of them showed the same absolute vicious belief and determination when in an Irish shirt.

But I don't blame him or the rest of them. That flame just isn't being lit in camp and I truly believe it's because of the other 40% - the belief in the systems they come into at camp. Players will come and go but this side will continue to act erratically because this side is not being coached to the standards required for a modern professional side. There is no way a side as conditioned as Irish players should be falling off so badly in energy levels and skill levels in virtually every game they play. That's either lack of true conditioning or it's a lack of belief.

[dragonbreath]

Lot of panicking going on. There wasn't a lot wrong from a neutrals perspective. Just one of those days when all the good work went unrewarded. You were cliinical against Wales and clinically dead against Scotland. Loads of line breaks loads of territory loads of ball, This is a game you would have won comfortably 99 times out of a hundred.

You were poor against England no getting away from that and handed them the game on a silver platter, England did nothing to win that game except sit back and wait for errors, but you were excellent for a half against us and did everything except win yesterday.

Kidney is not everyones cup of tea but you could argue that the coaches identified Scotlands defensive weaknesses and the plan to exploit them led to three very good chances, that they palyers failed to execute. Change for change sake is not always a good thing.

[asoreleftshoulder]

Lot of panicking going on. There wasn't a lot wrong from a neutrals perspective. Just one of those days when all the good work went unrewarded. You were cliinical against Wales and clinically dead against Scotland. Loads of line breaks loads of territory loads of ball, This is a game you would have won comfortably 99 times out of a hundred.

You were poor against England no getting away from that and handed them the game on a silver platter, England did nothing to win that game except sit back and wait for errors, but you were excellent for a half against us and did everything except win yesterday.

Kidney is not everyones cup of tea but you could argue that the coaches identified Scotlands defensive weaknesses and the plan to exploit them led to three very good chances, that they palyers failed to execute. Change for change sake is not always a good thing.

No panicking,we've been calling for Kidney to go for over 2 years now (some longer) this is just another in a long list of failures under his stewardship.

[RuggerRadge2611]

No panicking,we've been calling for Kidney to go for over 2 years now (some longer) this is just another in a long list of failures under his stewardship.

Is nobody going to comment on your injury list?
01 Cian Healy
02
03
04 Mike McCarthy
05 Paul O'Connell
06 Stephen Ferris
07 Chris Henry
08
09
10 Jonny Sexton
11 Simon Zebo
12 Gordon Darcy
13
14 Tommy Bowe
15



or is Kidney an easier scapegoat?

[rodders]

No panicking,we've been calling for Kidney to go for over 2 years now (some longer) this is just another in a long list of failures under his stewardship.

Is nobody going to comment on your injury list?
01 Cian Healy
02
03
04 Mike McCarthy
05 Paul O'Connell
06 Stephen Ferris
07 Chris Henry
08
09
10 Jonny Sexton
11 Simon Zebo
12 Gordon Darcy
13
14 Tommy Bowe
15



or is Kidney an easier scapegoat?

ok I will, we had 80 odd percent possession and territory so if we are reliant on an individual bit of magic from Bowe, Sexton or Zebo to get a try then there is something drastically wrong.

[Standulstermen]

We have injuries. There's a comment.

[Golden]

No panicking,we've been calling for Kidney to go for over 2 years now (some longer) this is just another in a long list of failures under his stewardship.

Is nobody going to comment on your injury list?
01 Cian Healy
02
03
04 Mike McCarthy
05 Paul O'Connell
06 Stephen Ferris
07 Chris Henry
08
09
10 Jonny Sexton
11 Simon Zebo
12 Gordon Darcy
13
14 Tommy Bowe
15



or is Kidney an easier scapegoat?

While that might explain the last match, it does not explain the performances for the last 3 years

[SecretFly]

Lot of panicking going on. There wasn't a lot wrong from a neutrals perspective. Just one of those days when all the good work went unrewarded. You were cliinical against Wales and clinically dead against Scotland. Loads of line breaks loads of territory loads of ball, This is a game you would have won comfortably 99 times out of a hundred.

You were poor against England no getting away from that and handed them the game on a silver platter, England did nothing to win that game except sit back and wait for errors, but you were excellent for a half against us and did everything except win yesterday.

Kidney is not everyones cup of tea but you could argue that the coaches identified Scotlands defensive weaknesses and the plan to exploit them led to three very good chances, that they palyers failed to execute. Change for change sake is not always a good thing.

The 'neutrals' never see much wrong... "Kidney doesn't make the forward passes etc, etc" Yep, Dragon, we've heard the lot, and aren't buying it. Loads of everything great and good players can bring to a game as individuals and a complete lack of anything worthy of them from a coaching perspective - again - again - and now again. So when Kidney is up for re-election somewhere else, there'll be a bunch of English Scottish, Welsh and Italian outfits looking for him? Sure there will

[Standulstermen]

Kidney has tobe judged on results like any coach. In that regard he has failed miserably.

[SecretFly]

80percent odd possession and territory - with our team devoid of all the injured players mentioned- tells me once again, and proves it, that Ireland have strength (real strength) both in the first team choices and in backups. The players are there...all it needs is a plan that works for them, that's suited to them and that runs for a full 80 minutes rather than three or four rehearsed moves that either happen in the first half or the second half and then batten down the hatches in defence.

In short, a new coaching team would be a nice way to continue our downward spiral - at least hope would be on the end of it for a while. This current ship has no hope left. It's done.

[GunsGerms]

Didnt think Ireland were as bad as some do.

Jackson missed lots of kicks which if he had nailed we would have been comfortbale winners. Earls also butchered a try despite making an exceptional break. Another day we would have won easily.

I dont blame Jackson on this it was his debut and kicking success is directly correlated to nerves. I fancy him to turn that around. He was excellent in every other way.

These are the biggest problems for me:

It defys belief that Kidney hasnt encouraged the likes of Kearney to practice his kicking to provide a second option or indeed play McFadden instead of Earls or Gilroy to take pressure off the OH.

Murray unfortunatly remains way too slow which is a big part of why we didnt convert our massive posession and territory stats into scores.

[100%beefy]

Is Kidney gone....he can't be blamed for injuries or ROG being a mentalist but succession planning is nil...you were awesome first half v Wales and then its all gone pete tong, if you beat France and ? remaining fixture, he will survive until IRFU identifies successor and then he will be revealed as being a leprechaun and sacked, but any more losses and yes he is gone March 17th
ROG, BOD and D'ARCY will all go as you would expect.
New coach...?

[Artful_Dodger]

New coach most people would probably want Joe Schmidt but many also say Schmidt wouldn't take it. Mike Ruddock who is Ireland youth coach is a potential candidate, other than that we are either looking at the likes of O'Shea who apparently doesn't get on with the IRFU, Mark McCall or a non-Irish man or somebody outside of Irish rugby.

[dragonbreath]

Lot of panicking going on. There wasn't a lot wrong from a neutrals perspective. Just one of those days when all the good work went unrewarded. You were cliinical against Wales and clinically dead against Scotland. Loads of line breaks loads of territory loads of ball, This is a game you would have won comfortably 99 times out of a hundred.

You were poor against England no getting away from that and handed them the game on a silver platter, England did nothing to win that game except sit back and wait for errors, but you were excellent for a half against us and did everything except win yesterday.

Kidney is not everyones cup of tea but you could argue that the coaches identified Scotlands defensive weaknesses and the plan to exploit them led to three very good chances, that they palyers failed to execute. Change for change sake is not always a good thing.

The 'neutrals' never see much wrong... "Kidney doesn't make the forward passes etc, etc" Yep, Dragon, we've heard the lot, and aren't buying it. Loads of everything great and good players can bring to a game as individuals and a complete lack of anything worthy of them from a coaching perspective - again - again - and now again. So when Kidney is up for re-election somewhere else, there'll be a bunch of English Scottish, Welsh and Italian outfits looking for him? Sure there will

You may not like it but it is true. His job at this level is not to teach people how to pass, execute 2 on 1s etc. The approach and tactics were spot on the stats may not reflect the result but they do emphatically endorse the game plan. If he has lost the dressing room then that is more of a problem, but the only spat I have heard of is with BOD and he will be gone sooner rather than later. Kidney does not seem to be a hugely inspirational character and maybe this is a problem especially with the established leaders in the team coming to an end of their careers. Maybe he needs to do what Gatland did. Bring a crop of young players who are somewhat in awe of him and will chew broken glass to keep him happy

[Notch]

The Scots targeted Gilroy in the air and he took everything magnificently. Given that, and his finish in no space at all for the try, he was probably our best back which is why I was baffled at his early substitution.

I know that players from the first XV are not normally released for their provinces in rest weeks in the 6N, but with Ulster at home to Treviso maybe it would be a good idea to let Jackson have 40 minutes taking the kicks at goal and down the line?

I think that all the substitutions were predetermined. Bar Henderson everyone of theme weekened the side.

Regarding the second point, for Jacksons and Ireland sake he needs to be give primary kicking duties at Ulster. For Ulsters sake Pienaar needs to keep them because he's better.....

Gilroy was taken off with a groin injury. a doubt for the france game if the reports are to be believed. also apparently Ryan is struggling with a shoulder injury.

Oh ffs! There must be more Ulster players in the treatment room than on the pitch at this point.

[Golden]

Lot of panicking going on. There wasn't a lot wrong from a neutrals perspective. Just one of those days when all the good work went unrewarded. You were cliinical against Wales and clinically dead against Scotland. Loads of line breaks loads of territory loads of ball, This is a game you would have won comfortably 99 times out of a hundred.

You were poor against England no getting away from that and handed them the game on a silver platter, England did nothing to win that game except sit back and wait for errors, but you were excellent for a half against us and did everything except win yesterday.

Kidney is not everyones cup of tea but you could argue that the coaches identified Scotlands defensive weaknesses and the plan to exploit them led to three very good chances, that they palyers failed to execute. Change for change sake is not always a good thing.

The 'neutrals' never see much wrong... "Kidney doesn't make the forward passes etc, etc" Yep, Dragon, we've heard the lot, and aren't buying it. Loads of everything great and good players can bring to a game as individuals and a complete lack of anything worthy of them from a coaching perspective - again - again - and now again. So when Kidney is up for re-election somewhere else, there'll be a bunch of English Scottish, Welsh and Italian outfits looking for him? Sure there will

You may not like it but it is true. His job at this level is not to teach people how to pass, execute 2 on 1s etc. The approach and tactics were spot on the stats may not reflect the result but they do emphatically endorse the game plan. If he has lost the dressing room then that is more of a problem, but the only spat I have heard of is with BOD and he will be gone sooner rather than later. Kidney does not seem to be a hugely inspirational character and maybe this is a problem especially with the established leaders in the team coming to an end of their careers. Maybe he needs to do what Gatland did. Bring a crop of young players who are somewhat in awe of him and will chew broken glass to keep him happy

.


Kidneys job is to win games, regardless of whos on the pitch. If you look at his record over the last 4 years he just hasnt been doing that.

[GunsGerms]

D'Arcy is completly crocked but has been pretty good in his last few games he has played for Ireland. Would be a decent back up to Marshall for at least another year.

I wouldnt have even brought Rog to the WC. Makes 0 sense to have him in the Ireland squad. Shame, he was once a tremendous talent.

BOD will retire after the Lions if he makes it. His place may be in doubt now that he has had two average games. Though in fairness after witnessing the birth of his child hours prior to the England game Im surprised he was able to focus at all. It is a completly exhausting and overwhelming experience at least it was for me.

[rodders]

You may not like it but it is true. His job at this level is not to teach people how to pass, execute 2 on 1s etc.

Agreed but his job is to pick players who can execute 2 on 1's and send them out with a gameplan they all understand. Either the players can't play basic rugby or they don't have a gameplan. Either way the buck stops with the coaches.

[red_stag]

Rodders was it a bad job for Kidney to pick Luke Marshall.

He ruined a 2 on 1 with Gilroy (threw forward pass) and knocked on the final ball that cost us the game.

Now I thought Marshall had a superb game but just making the point; while I do feel Kidney has had his day I dont think selection cost us the game.

[SecretFly]

Schmidt probably wouldn't want it... think he's going back home after his Leinster stint, or such a story was going around anyway.

Ruddock I wouldn't want. He's had his time just like Kidney has had his. People so readily put time on players "He should now retire"; well, coaches have their time too - they get into a style rut and keep going back to it in the face of times moving on and tactics moving on with it (Johnson's another example of a man who resisted ways that he wasn't trusting of)

O'Shea.............. well, is he a coach or a manager? Who would do the coaching? If it's him then I'd have to say No again - I've listened to too much of his ideas and they sit very comfortable between the middle of the fence and the rock and the hard place on the other side He's a man for all seasons, always wise owl after the event. Tell us how to do it, not how it shouldn't have been done, there's a good man, Conor.

I'd try a new coach to International who wants to begin an attempt at it (from perhaps the SH)...what I wouldn't want is one of the list of usual suspects who always get mentioned in 'International Coaching' selections. Those guys must live in a protected estate somewhere in sunny Florida under the business title "Exalted Union Coaches in Waiting" - playing golf with some beach bunnies

[rodders]

Rodders was it a bad job for Kidney to pick Luke Marshall.

He ruined a 2 on 1 with Gilroy (threw forward pass) and knocked on the final ball that cost us the game.

Now I thought Marshall had a superb game but just making the point; while I do feel Kidney has had his day I dont think selection cost us the game.

[Sponsored content]