The v2 Forum
Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.

Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position

+12
Taffineastbourne
MMaaxx
whocares
ChequeredJersey
Mr Fishpaste
bluestonevedder
kiakahaaotearoa
CurlyOsp
fa0019
GunsGerms
lostinwales
Biltong
16 posters

Page 3 of 3 Previous  1, 2, 3

Go down

Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position - Page 3 Empty Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position

Post by Biltong Wed 10 Apr 2013, 2:06 pm

First topic message reminder :

I found this on another website, thought you would enjoy it.

Springbok coach Heyneke Meyer has exclusively revealed to ArenaSport the reasons for Pierre Spies’s continued inclusion in the Springbok squad.

Following the announcement of the first Springbok squad of 2013, for the June Test series against Italy, Samoa and Scotland, Heyneke Meyer has confirmed that Pierre Spies is the best player in his position in South Africa… and possibly the best in the world. Ever.

“This group is by no means a final one for the June Tests and could still change in the coming months,” says Meyer, “but what I can commit to is that Pierre Spies will always be a part of the Springbok setup, certainly as long as I’m in charge.”

Ignoring the merits of the Kings Jacques Engelbrecht, the excellent season of the Cheetahs Lappies Labuschagne, and flat-out refusing to acknowledge the existence of Heinrich Brussow and Jesus, Meyer went on to say that Spies is probably the most important member of the Springbok squad.

“You have to understand that we need Pierre. There is no one else quite like him in South African rugby. No one in any of the other local franchises can do what he does.

Those big muscles, those strong arms, those thick, immense thighs,” sighed a clearly excited Bok coach, “they are all a necessary cog in the Bok wheel.”

When pressed, Meyer confirmed what most rugby fans suspected. “Yes, undoubtedly Pierre is the best baggage handler in South African sport.

With all that time he spends in the gym, he’s able to carry the bags of 10 squad members at one time. This allows us to save and spend wisely in other areas, like on movie nights we can now afford DStv Box Office.”

Captain Jean de Villiers added to Meyer’s comments. “Pierre is great. You can give him your togs, your formal gear and your essential tour electronic gadgets and he’ll carry them from the team bus to your hotel room. We simply can’t tour without him.”
Biltong
Biltong
Moderator
Moderator

Posts : 26945
Join date : 2011-04-27
Location : Twilight zone

Back to top Go down


Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position - Page 3 Empty Re: Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position

Post by Biltong Fri 12 Apr 2013, 10:04 am

Bekker is worrying me, he is easily ruffled when you compete on his ball, the Crusaders showed how poor he can be at taking control of line outs.
Biltong
Biltong
Moderator
Moderator

Posts : 26945
Join date : 2011-04-27
Location : Twilight zone

Back to top Go down

Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position - Page 3 Empty Re: Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position

Post by rodders Fri 12 Apr 2013, 10:09 am

I don't get the criticism of Spies really. I think the key prerequisites for a no. 8 are ball carrying, control at the base of the scrum, lineout work, tackling, footballing ability.

If your no8 has to do a lot of donkey work and hit rucks I'd be questioning the tight 5 and blindside flanker. I want to see a no8 maurading in the wide channels and making yards and scoring tries not in the bottom of rucks.

rodders
rodders
Moderator
Moderator

Posts : 25501
Join date : 2011-05-20
Age : 43

Back to top Go down

Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position - Page 3 Empty Re: Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position

Post by fa0019 Fri 12 Apr 2013, 10:11 am

The difference between Matfield and Bekker is that Matfield had no problem allowing Spies or Danie to take the ball if he was being closely marked. Bekker is a bit too alpha in his calls... he wants the ball every time.

Bekker doesn't have the same luxury of players at the moment and he's their only genuine jumper. When they've been playing Fourie & Kolisi at the back it limits your options.... not only because of lack of jumpers but lack of height in lifters. We're losing 6-10inches in height without our first team lifters in the side.

I think many lineout captains would struggle at the moment with the Stormers. With Rhodes starting this weekend hopefully the balance can improve.

fa0019

Posts : 8196
Join date : 2011-07-25

Back to top Go down

Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position - Page 3 Empty Re: Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position

Post by Biltong Fri 12 Apr 2013, 10:12 am

Rodders if you look at Spies in all those areas, he is a good ball carrier, but onyl in space, put him in traffic and his body positioning is too high and he almost always loses ground in contact.

Takcling the same issue applies, he goes to high anf hardly ever takles a ball carrier back.

Line out operator he is excellent

Scrum control, average, he does tend to knock balls on when his scrum is under pressure, your best eights can handle the ball even when going back

Spies in my opinion should never have been a forward.
Biltong
Biltong
Moderator
Moderator

Posts : 26945
Join date : 2011-04-27
Location : Twilight zone

Back to top Go down

Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position - Page 3 Empty Re: Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position

Post by GunsGerms Fri 12 Apr 2013, 10:15 am

rodders wrote:I don't get the criticism of Spies really. I think the key prerequisites for a no. 8 are ball carrying, control at the base of the scrum, lineout work, tackling, footballing ability.

If your no8 has to do a lot of donkey work and hit rucks I'd be questioning the tight 5 and blindside flanker. I want to see a no8 maurading in the wide channels and making yards and scoring tries not in the bottom of rucks.


Ireland dont have a blindside flanker. Hence Heaslip does that role. Its pretty clear that SOB and Heaslip are hybrid 7 and 8s and switch some roles.

GunsGerms

Posts : 12542
Join date : 2011-05-31
Age : 44
Location : Ireland

Back to top Go down

Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position - Page 3 Empty Re: Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position

Post by rodders Fri 12 Apr 2013, 10:24 am

GunsGerms wrote:
rodders wrote:I don't get the criticism of Spies really. I think the key prerequisites for a no. 8 are ball carrying, control at the base of the scrum, lineout work, tackling, footballing ability.

If your no8 has to do a lot of donkey work and hit rucks I'd be questioning the tight 5 and blindside flanker. I want to see a no8 maurading in the wide channels and making yards and scoring tries not in the bottom of rucks.


Ireland dont have a blindside flanker. Hence Heaslip does that role. Its pretty clear that SOB and Heaslip are hybrid 7 and 8s and switch some roles.

No I don't accept that Guns. Heaslips performances in the 6N were embarressing compared to those of the other 8's particularly Parisse and Picamoles. His yardage is shocking sometimes not reaching double figures. O'Brien is working his socks of in defence but hasn't been as effective carrying either without Ferris or since his hip op. O'Brien is our best carrier still but even he is a long way off the top 8's now.

I like Spies, he's a phenomenal athlete but I suppose he's nothing special in SA terms...would it be fair to compare him to Haskell?

rodders
rodders
Moderator
Moderator

Posts : 25501
Join date : 2011-05-20
Age : 43

Back to top Go down

Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position - Page 3 Empty Re: Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position

Post by fa0019 Fri 12 Apr 2013, 10:28 am

Haskell got a lot of respect last year with his year out in SR. He dug in, did dirty work and whilst he wasn't expected to start come mid way through last season he was starting every game (albeit as an openside).

People joke about him and this brand haskell etc but he just kept his head down and worked hard.... something a lot of today's NH players I doubt would risk doing.

His double punch on 2 cheetahs last year was classic. Fair given 1 was grabbing him by the balls.

fa0019

Posts : 8196
Join date : 2011-07-25

Back to top Go down

Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position - Page 3 Empty Re: Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position

Post by kiakahaaotearoa Fri 12 Apr 2013, 10:28 am

How much have SA missed rugby greats like Burger and Juan Smith and how much better would Spies look if those two players were operating?

But it's a moot point as Louw was SA's best player for me last year. But it does raise the crucial issue of combinations and balance. England really struggled in their last games with the balance of their backrow thrown out and Ireland showed how much they miss Ferris.

kiakahaaotearoa

Posts : 8287
Join date : 2011-05-10
Location : Madrid

Back to top Go down

Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position - Page 3 Empty Re: Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position

Post by GunsGerms Fri 12 Apr 2013, 10:29 am

rodders wrote:Morning Guns mug ...ah come on man this isn't an Ulster thing look at Straus, VDW, Botha, Stander, Payne, Roux, De Villiers etc.

SA journey men have been key players for the Irish provonces. SA don't always play the most attractive rugby but are a true rugby super power and net exporter of talent.

At times we have closed the gap on them but certainly right now we can't argue to be on par. They have far more depth and particularly so in terms of forwards. The IRB rankings are flawed but can't be ignored either.

There have been plenty of SA turkeys too. De Villiers was one of them if you ask me as was CJ and Sykes. CJ and De Villiers were both world cup medal winners but werent great at all for Munster and Leinster.

Stander is excellent, Payne was a great pro but I wouldnt say he would have been International class.

Much of Strauss' development has been at Leinster at this stage so he is as much a product of Ireland as SA now. He wasnt a complete player when he arrived. Same may end up being true of Stander.

Botha of all those that you mentioned is a stand player here for me. I would also say that front row is an area where SA consistently produce better players than Ireland. Not sure in recent years the same could be said of any other position to the same extent.

GunsGerms

Posts : 12542
Join date : 2011-05-31
Age : 44
Location : Ireland

Back to top Go down

Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position - Page 3 Empty Re: Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position

Post by fa0019 Fri 12 Apr 2013, 10:32 am

surprised De Villers came home so quickly. I think he would have got a lot better if he lasted it out. He didn't do himself justice thats for sure.

fa0019

Posts : 8196
Join date : 2011-07-25

Back to top Go down

Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position - Page 3 Empty Re: Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position

Post by GunsGerms Fri 12 Apr 2013, 10:33 am

rodders wrote:
GunsGerms wrote:
rodders wrote:I don't get the criticism of Spies really. I think the key prerequisites for a no. 8 are ball carrying, control at the base of the scrum, lineout work, tackling, footballing ability.

If your no8 has to do a lot of donkey work and hit rucks I'd be questioning the tight 5 and blindside flanker. I want to see a no8 maurading in the wide channels and making yards and scoring tries not in the bottom of rucks.


Ireland dont have a blindside flanker. Hence Heaslip does that role. Its pretty clear that SOB and Heaslip are hybrid 7 and 8s and switch some roles.

No I don't accept that Guns. Heaslips performances in the 6N were embarressing compared to those of the other 8's particularly Parisse and Picamoles. His yardage is shocking sometimes not reaching double figures. O'Brien is working his socks of in defence but hasn't been as effective carrying either without Ferris or since his hip op. O'Brien is our best carrier still but even he is a long way off the top 8's now.

I like Spies, he's a phenomenal athlete but I suppose he's nothing special in SA terms...would it be fair to compare him to Haskell?


Rodders why would Heaslips yardage be outstanding when O'Brien is the Irish back row go to guy for ball carrying? Do you actually know what his yardage was?

Heaslip's performances certainly werent embarassing. He might not grab the headlines as much as he used to but he gets through a ridiculous amount of work. I think it has become fashionable to consider him the scapegoat for Irelands failings. Not sure its entirely fair though.

GunsGerms

Posts : 12542
Join date : 2011-05-31
Age : 44
Location : Ireland

Back to top Go down

Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position - Page 3 Empty Re: Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position

Post by Biltong Fri 12 Apr 2013, 10:41 am

GunsGerms wrote:Much of Strauss' development has been at Leinster at this stage so he is as much a product of Ireland as SA now. He wasnt a complete player when he arrived. Same may end up being true of Stander.


That pretty much happens when you contract a standout player i the first place, if they have talent, has proven themselves to be great players, and they tend to pay attention to the manner in which they play, they develop.

As for being a product. Look at the label, it says "Made in SA"
Biltong
Biltong
Moderator
Moderator

Posts : 26945
Join date : 2011-04-27
Location : Twilight zone

Back to top Go down

Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position - Page 3 Empty Re: Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position

Post by fa0019 Fri 12 Apr 2013, 10:47 am

Stander was already the best tackler last year in SR... well at least in the SA conference. His game is 9/10th there already.

Had he re-signed with the bulls he would have been capped by Meyer last year, guys who took his place were playing for the boks once he left. He even tried to cap him after the contract was signed with Munster.

fa0019

Posts : 8196
Join date : 2011-07-25

Back to top Go down

Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position - Page 3 Empty Re: Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position

Post by GunsGerms Fri 12 Apr 2013, 10:49 am

Biltong wrote:
GunsGerms wrote:Much of Strauss' development has been at Leinster at this stage so he is as much a product of Ireland as SA now. He wasnt a complete player when he arrived. Same may end up being true of Stander.


That pretty much happens when you contract a standout player i the first place, if they have talent, has proven themselves to be great players, and they tend to pay attention to the manner in which they play, they develop.

As for being a product. Look at the label, it says "Made in SA"

Ha ha. Yes Stander is an outstanding talent alright and looks very good when playing for Munster.

GunsGerms

Posts : 12542
Join date : 2011-05-31
Age : 44
Location : Ireland

Back to top Go down

Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position - Page 3 Empty Re: Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position

Post by GunsGerms Fri 12 Apr 2013, 10:55 am

...and yes I'd be very annoyed too if I was from SA re Stander.

GunsGerms

Posts : 12542
Join date : 2011-05-31
Age : 44
Location : Ireland

Back to top Go down

Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position - Page 3 Empty Re: Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position

Post by rodders Fri 12 Apr 2013, 10:56 am

Guns I don't consider Heaslip a scapegoat but I don't accept this rediculous amount of work he does either, none of his stats are anything special and his yardage is woeful.

O'Briens carrying has been decent at best but he's a flanker, it's Heaslip who needs to be providing an attacking platform from the set piece but isn't.

Healsip was quality 3 seasons ago but like Leamy did, has lost his pace and athleticsm at very early age due to injury and is now a fairly average player by international standards.
rodders
rodders
Moderator
Moderator

Posts : 25501
Join date : 2011-05-20
Age : 43

Back to top Go down

Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position - Page 3 Empty Re: Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position

Post by fa0019 Fri 12 Apr 2013, 11:00 am

SA are better off without players like that to be honest.

He is a good player... but he's a mercenery.... and teams work better without these guys. The greats never did it for money... as the always knew money will come.

He is good enough to have got into the bok side, perhaps play in the next world cup and get 30-40 caps by then..... and he could have still then come to Europe and made his fortune.

By the time he qualifies for Ireland he may have had 20-30 caps for the boks... Meyer was a big fan.... I certainly place him above Kolisi who is set to debut this year.

fa0019

Posts : 8196
Join date : 2011-07-25

Back to top Go down

Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position - Page 3 Empty Re: Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position

Post by Biltong Fri 12 Apr 2013, 11:02 am

Agree FA, if a player wants to go for the Money he must %^^&* in my view, but also don't return, you have made the decision, so live with it.
If we keep our Bok team pure I am happy.

I see the Ozzies are excited because at the end of the Year, Speight who is playing for the Brumbies will qualify to play for Australia.
Biltong
Biltong
Moderator
Moderator

Posts : 26945
Join date : 2011-04-27
Location : Twilight zone

Back to top Go down

Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position - Page 3 Empty Re: Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position

Post by rodders Fri 12 Apr 2013, 11:04 am

I thought Stander was told he was too small to be a springbok?
rodders
rodders
Moderator
Moderator

Posts : 25501
Join date : 2011-05-20
Age : 43

Back to top Go down

Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position - Page 3 Empty Re: Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position

Post by Biltong Fri 12 Apr 2013, 11:06 am

nope
Biltong
Biltong
Moderator
Moderator

Posts : 26945
Join date : 2011-04-27
Location : Twilight zone

Back to top Go down

Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position - Page 3 Empty Re: Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position

Post by rodders Fri 12 Apr 2013, 11:06 am

Thats what he said when he signed for Munster I'm sure? Sorry don't have a link...
rodders
rodders
Moderator
Moderator

Posts : 25501
Join date : 2011-05-20
Age : 43

Back to top Go down

Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position - Page 3 Empty Re: Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position

Post by fa0019 Fri 12 Apr 2013, 11:07 am

at 6'2 and 17st... whereas Meyer has just called up Kolisi... barely 6ft and 16st?

Sounds like his agent talking pretending to know whats best (regardless of the fact he would be in line for a bumper pay day had he signed for Munster).

fa0019

Posts : 8196
Join date : 2011-07-25

Back to top Go down

Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position - Page 3 Empty Re: Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position

Post by fa0019 Fri 12 Apr 2013, 11:09 am

near identical to Frans Louw in stature too.

fa0019

Posts : 8196
Join date : 2011-07-25

Back to top Go down

Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position - Page 3 Empty Re: Heyneke exclusive: Spies best in his position

Post by Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Page 3 of 3 Previous  1, 2, 3

Back to top

- Similar topics

 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum