Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
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The v2 Forum :: Sport :: Rugby Union :: International
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Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
First topic message reminder :
Thought I'd start a thread to discuss next weeks game.
ENGLAND
Scotland
Scots team:
1.grant
2.ford
3.low
4.swinson
5.hamilton
6.wilson
7.fusaro
8.denton
9.laidlaw
10.weir
11.lamont
12.scott
13.dunbar
14.seymor
15 hogg
Thought I'd start a thread to discuss next weeks game.
ENGLAND
England head coach Stuart Lancaster has kept faith with the side which lost to France and named an unchanged line-up for Saturday's match against Scotland.
Gloucester's Jonny May starts on the wing despite breaking his nose nine minutes into the 26-24 loss in Paris.
Courtney Lawes will be in the second row after his cheekbone bruising eased, while Danny Care and Owen Farrell form the half-back partnership.
"They're determined to put last week's result behind them," said Lancaster.
England will be hoping to avoid a third successive Test defeat, having lost to New Zealand in the autumn and France in the opening weekend of the Six Nations.
Scotland, however, were well beaten by Ireland on Sunday have not prevailed in the Calcutta Cup since their 15-9 win at Murrayfield in 2008.
"Scotland will be hugely motivated by their defeat in Dublin and, as we found two years ago, Murrayfield is a tough place to play," added Lancaster, who began his England reign with a 13-6 win against Scotland in 2012.
May is not expected to wear a protective face mask when he wins his third cap in Edinburgh.
Luther Burrell, who scored on his debut at the Stade de France, will make his second Test appearance at centre, while Jack Nowell takes up the right-wing spot for what will also be his second cap.
Wasps prop Matt Mullan will travel as the 24th man.
England XI v Scotland: Mike Brown (Harlequins, 22 caps), Jack Nowell (Exeter Chiefs, 1 cap), Luther Burrell (Northampton Saints, 1 cap), Billy Twelvetrees (Gloucester Rugby, 9 caps), Jonny May (Gloucester Rugby, 2 caps), Owen Farrell (Saracens, 20 caps), Danny Care (Harlequins, 43 caps), Joe Marler (Harlequins, 16 caps), Dylan Hartley (Northampton Saints, 51 caps), Dan Cole (Leicester Tigers, 44 caps), Joe Launchbury (London Wasps, 15 caps), Courtney Lawes (Northampton Saints, 26 caps), Tom Wood (Northampton Saints, 24 caps), Chris Robshaw (Harlequins, capt, 21 caps), Billy Vunipola (Saracens, 6 caps)
Replacements: Tom Youngs (Leicester Tigers, 13 caps), Mako Vunipola (Saracens, 11 caps), Henry Thomas (Sale Sharks, 2 caps), Dave Attwood (Bath Rugby, 6 caps), Ben Morgan (Gloucester Rugby, 16 caps), Lee Dickson (Northampton Saints, 13 caps), Brad Barritt (Saracens, 17 caps), Alex Goode (Saracens, 14 caps)
Scotland
Scots team:
1.grant
2.ford
3.low
4.swinson
5.hamilton
6.wilson
7.fusaro
8.denton
9.laidlaw
10.weir
11.lamont
12.scott
13.dunbar
14.seymor
15 hogg
Last edited by yappysnap on Thu 06 Feb 2014, 4:40 pm; edited 4 times in total
yappysnap- Posts : 11993
Join date : 2011-06-01
Age : 36
Location : Christchurch, NZ
Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:
If Care gets injured Youngs is a like for like replacement.
A much bigger worry would be Farrell getting injured, England do not have a reserve fly half. Or reserve flankers. Or a fit reserve full back. Or a reserve tighthead. Or a reserve hooker who can throw to the back. Or reserve 12 who can act as a distributor.
I have never rated Ben Youngs as a starting 9 at International level myself. He is, however, the perfect impact sub at International level.
I do think that SL is putting too many eggs in one basket when it comes to Farrell though by not having a replacement 10 in the subs. I think this is a very risky approach. It would be very wise to get one of the other boys in there and give them the experience because if Farrell (hope not) gets injured, there is no specialist with the experience to replace him.
Nachos Jones- Posts : 2232
Join date : 2013-11-15
Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
How many points does Farrell miss for,England!
Aside from that we should have put 50 points on them yesterday!
Ireland are going to hump us big time.
Aside from that we should have put 50 points on them yesterday!
Ireland are going to hump us big time.
Geordie- Posts : 28849
Join date : 2011-03-31
Location : Newcastle
Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
TJ wrote:tigertattie wrote:Why are folk singing the praises of Denton? He show boats. Doesn't get involved in rucks. Hangs back looking for the glory carry. And when he gets the ball he runs into the first defender, doesn't get over the gain line. Never offloads. Poor. Poor. Poor.
Beattie is by far the better player.
significantly the most yards made - and put his heart into it - one of the few players to do so
Denton made the most yards because he was running back kicks - same reason FB's often have such high numbers. The point is that when he did get to the England defenders he did next to nothing.
Look - he can be a much better player than he showed yesterday, but the stats alone dont tell you anything
lostinwales- lostinwales
- Posts : 13355
Join date : 2011-06-09
Location : Out of Wales :)
Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
Nachos Jones wrote:Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:
If Care gets injured Youngs is a like for like replacement.
A much bigger worry would be Farrell getting injured, England do not have a reserve fly half. Or reserve flankers. Or a fit reserve full back. Or a reserve tighthead. Or a reserve hooker who can throw to the back. Or reserve 12 who can act as a distributor.
I have never rated Ben Youngs as a starting 9 at International level myself. He is, however, the perfect impact sub at International level.
I do think that SL is putting too many eggs in one basket when it comes to Farrell though by not having a replacement 10 in the subs. I think this is a very risky approach. It would be very wise to get one of the other boys in there and give them the experience because if Farrell (hope not) gets injured, there is no specialist with the experience to replace him.
Ben Youngs when on form and truly fired up can be one of the best 9's on the planet. Unfortunately we dont see that anything like often enough. He was injured on the Lions tour and played through injury, and has evidently been poor since.
I have been really very pleased with Care so far this 6N. He really has finally brought his club game to the international side. He is running everything and so far mostly making great decisions. (And that drop goal was a beauty). There is no problem on relying on the 9 being the playmaker and not the 10 if it is done well, and he really has done it well so far. It does mean there is a lot less pressure on Farrell and he also has been looking a lot better. I don't have any confidence in Dickson at all however. I just dont know what he brings to the party.
lostinwales- lostinwales
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Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
He (Denton) consistently made the hard yards as well- getting go forward ball and setting it back. I assume that was his assigned role. Watch it again if you can - he was one of the few Scots who looked hungry and gave his all
Last edited by TJ on Sun 09 Feb 2014, 11:03 am; edited 1 time in total
TJ- Posts : 8603
Join date : 2013-09-22
Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
yeah thats right.GeordieFalcon wrote:How many points does Farrell miss for,England!
Aside from that we should have put 50 points on them yesterday!
Ireland are going to hump us big time.
you having a bad day or something..
what is it that you expect ?
and do you think Ireland are a bunch of superheros?
mystiroakey- Posts : 32472
Join date : 2011-03-06
Age : 47
Location : surrey
Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
Ireland look by far the best side so far in this 6N.
TJ- Posts : 8603
Join date : 2013-09-22
Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
GeordieFalcon wrote:How many points does Farrell miss for,England!
Aside from that we should have put 50 points on them yesterday!
Ireland are going to hump us big time.
To be honest we should have had a min of 40 pts yesterday even with the bad pitch, the 2003 team would have ripped them apart, I believe we had the players but for what ever the reason we just aren't ruthless enough NZ And SA would have had a field day against the jocks.
Ford should have got some game time yesterday why we are persisting with Farrell when he seems to only want to have cheap shots at the oppositions expense, that grin and push on cusiter was a disgrace and shows how immature he is.
Scrumpy- Posts : 4217
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Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
not to me.TJ wrote:Ireland look by far the best side so far in this 6N.
but ok fair enough they look up there- do you think they will hump england..
mystiroakey- Posts : 32472
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Age : 47
Location : surrey
Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
TJ wrote:He (Denton) consistently made the hard yards as well- getting go forward ball and setting it back. I assume that was his assigned role. Watch it again if you can - he was one of the few Scots who looked hungry and gave his all
He was hungry enough to take the ball and give it a go - which does give him a great deal of credit in the overall performance. But his yards were almost all 'soft'. You want to see 'hard' yards watch Vunipola...
lostinwales- lostinwales
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Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
GeordieFalcon wrote:How many points does Farrell miss for,England!
Aside from that we should have put 50 points on them yesterday!
Ireland are going to hump us big time.
And I am deemed a harsh critic of Farrell
I thought that England were solid for the win yesterday in absolutely shocking conditions. They won without really getting going and in better conditions I think England would have won by double that score.
I still think that England has played better as a team than anyone else in the 6N so far and I think that it will be a tight match against Ireland at home but I think you guys will win. If it were in Ireland I would say Ireland would nick it but the home ground advantage will play a big part.
Nachos Jones- Posts : 2232
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Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
I really cant see the Ireland game being tight. No disrespect to the irish- they have played well. But i can only see a 15 pt plus win at Twickenham. Away would be completely different off course.
mystiroakey- Posts : 32472
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Location : surrey
Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
jeez, this site is starting to get pretty depressing with all the negative posts. Whats going with you people!
nathan- Posts : 11033
Join date : 2011-06-14
Location : Leicestershire
Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
England Ireland will be very interesting.
Last 2 years England out thought and out 'adapted' Ireland but Ireland have a new coaching team who are evidently capable of developing tactics to fit the opposition. England have to have an edge playing at home but...
Last 2 years England out thought and out 'adapted' Ireland but Ireland have a new coaching team who are evidently capable of developing tactics to fit the opposition. England have to have an edge playing at home but...
lostinwales- lostinwales
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Join date : 2011-06-09
Location : Out of Wales :)
Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
They drive me mad Nathan..
To shut out Scotland in the mud, to have all that territory.
Scotland had something like 20 seconds in our 22 second half!!!!!
Normally those games are 9-6 either way and all you see is kick spill . kick, spill.
People are saying Farrell is rubbish,
I just do not have a clue what people expect any more.
I used to think i was one of the lesser knowledgeable posters on here. TBH I am starting to think i am a freicking master mind compared to the rest of them.
I have no idea what they are watching
To shut out Scotland in the mud, to have all that territory.
Scotland had something like 20 seconds in our 22 second half!!!!!
Normally those games are 9-6 either way and all you see is kick spill . kick, spill.
People are saying Farrell is rubbish,
I just do not have a clue what people expect any more.
I used to think i was one of the lesser knowledgeable posters on here. TBH I am starting to think i am a freicking master mind compared to the rest of them.
I have no idea what they are watching
mystiroakey- Posts : 32472
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Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
By the way Have england ever once won a game because they played well?
Has it ever happened in the history of any sport ever?
Has it ever happened in the history of any sport ever?
mystiroakey- Posts : 32472
Join date : 2011-03-06
Age : 47
Location : surrey
Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
Ireland are looking ominous. Not only in the forwards (all areas), but their unutilised backs. BOD has lost his initial searing pace though but not his nous and could be now exploited through the 12/13 channels. But defensively they are very, very well-organised. Sexton is supeb and they have the excellent Marshall at SH. Not exciting but extremely efficient.Hood83 wrote:gregortree wrote:The French tested our newbies on the wing in that way, and to good effect, albeit with a helpful bounce or two. The Doc is saying it might be worth a further punt as a tactic (not a plan as such) by Ireland. I think the new boys are learning quickly, and Billy V is covering back well and I expect the Irish management will not regard it as a key tactic. The Irish line out and the drive look formidable though.SecretFly wrote:doctor_grey wrote:Was especially concerned about Nowell. If he felt comfortable that is a good thing. From the reports I read, Ireland was kicking to the Welsh backs a lot, so we could expect more of the same towards May and Nowell.
Why?
England are a different team to Wales. They'll need either a vaguely different plan or a completely different one. I don't think Ireland under Schmidt will be a single plan team
Their maul looked incredible. That to me is a worrying sign that Schmidt is going to slowly give them more and more strings to their bow. I think Lancaster etc. have improved us in areas but I'm not sure what are weapons are and where we've really moved forward. Definitely are carrying has been a step up these last two weeks.
Good job they are playing England and France away...
Portnoy's Complaint- Posts : 3498
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Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
nathan wrote:jeez, this site is starting to get pretty depressing with all the negative posts. Whats going with you people!
I don't think that its too bad
I made comments about Farrell's ability as a attacking 10 and was jumped on (unfairly I thought as I explained my thoughts behind it) but for the rest I have been quite positive towards England. It was a very professional performance by England in terrible conditions.
Nachos Jones- Posts : 2232
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Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
mystiroakey wrote:By the way Have england ever once won a game because they played well?
Has it ever happened in the history of any sport ever?
Not that I can recall mate
kingjohn7- Posts : 782
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Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
I am becoming more confident, there was assuredness and control about the English play that I haven't seen for years. They didn't panic against France and didn't go into their shells against the Scots, despite the conditions. If we can beat the Irish I think we have a real shot at the title.
Cumbrian- Posts : 5605
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Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
Yesterday's game answered the critics..
We did everything to move on.
We didn't switch off. Our backs got involved.
They run intelligent lines, Farrell and care bossed it.. The line out was better, the scrum was better, we didn't make stupid subs, we didn't lose a point, we didnt score massive points, but the weather and pitch was shocking.
Not one person has the right to ask for more.. Not one,,
We did everything to move on.
We didn't switch off. Our backs got involved.
They run intelligent lines, Farrell and care bossed it.. The line out was better, the scrum was better, we didn't make stupid subs, we didn't lose a point, we didnt score massive points, but the weather and pitch was shocking.
Not one person has the right to ask for more.. Not one,,
mystiroakey- Posts : 32472
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Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
Cumbrian wrote:I am becoming more confident, there was assuredness and control about the English play that I haven't seen for years. They didn't panic against France and didn't go into their shells against the Scots, despite the conditions. If we can beat the Irish I think we have a real shot at the title.
Absolutely bang on. In their recent history, England would have allowed Scotland to get back into the game by their indiscipline. They never ever looked like they would lose their cool yesterday. As horrible as the match was as a spectacle, I really enjoyed it.
Nachos Jones- Posts : 2232
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Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
i swear it's a defect in the English that unless there beating everyone by 100 points there Poopie and everyone needs dropping or sacking.
nathan- Posts : 11033
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Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
mystiroakey wrote:Yesterday's game answered the critics..
We did everything to move on.
We didn't switch off. Our backs got involved.
They run intelligent lines, Farrell and care bossed it.. The line out was better, the scrum was better, we didn't make stupid subs, we didn't lose a point, we didnt score massive points, but the weather and pitch was shocking.
Not one person has the right to ask for more.. Not one,,
Except Suart Lancaster:
We were pleased with a lot of aspects, but are frustrated that we didn't convert more of our opportunities because we dominated the second half," Lancaster said. "There were chances there that we didn't take and we definitely have regrets over the points we left out there
Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler- Posts : 10344
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Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
Aye, well if Lancaster didn't say that he'd be accused of being complacent, settling for 2nd best and having no ambition
England did leave plenty of points out there but signs are certainly more than promising.
England did leave plenty of points out there but signs are certainly more than promising.
Cyril- Posts : 7162
Join date : 2012-11-16
Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
Fair play SL needs to allways look at how we can improve.
That is a key trait to a good Coach.
NZ coaches have allways had that attitude.
But in this case I think its very easy to look at the game and think the conditions were better than they were. Hence thinking we should have converted more.
Scotland couldn't hold on to the ball. England normally cant hold on to the ball in those conditions either. I think we made it look easier that it was..
That is a key trait to a good Coach.
NZ coaches have allways had that attitude.
But in this case I think its very easy to look at the game and think the conditions were better than they were. Hence thinking we should have converted more.
Scotland couldn't hold on to the ball. England normally cant hold on to the ball in those conditions either. I think we made it look easier that it was..
mystiroakey- Posts : 32472
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Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
mystiroakey wrote:not to me.TJ wrote:Ireland look by far the best side so far in this 6N.
but ok fair enough they look up there- do you think they will hump england..
I doubt they will hump England - but I'd be surprised if Ireland didn't win. England are the closest to them but Ireland are clearly the best side from what we have seen so far.
TJ- Posts : 8603
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Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
You will be surprised if Ireland don't beat England at twickenham..ok.. Lol
mystiroakey- Posts : 32472
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Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
I'm not sure I agree with that. What do you base it on?TJ wrote:mystiroakey wrote:not to me.TJ wrote:Ireland look by far the best side so far in this 6N.
but ok fair enough they look up there- do you think they will hump england..
I doubt they will hump England - but I'd be surprised if Ireland didn't win. England are the closest to them but Ireland are clearly the best side from what we have seen so far.
Ireland have played well enough but I don't think anyone is head and shoulders above anyone else. England are at home.
We'll know in a couple of weeks anyway.
Cyril- Posts : 7162
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Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
Fair enough calling Ireland favs. I have no problem with that. But to be surprised by England beating Ireland at twickenham is a pretty strong claim that you think Ireland are massive favourites,,
mystiroakey- Posts : 32472
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Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
As an Irishman I don't think that Ireland have been the best team this 6N. I think that England have been better but there is not much in it. Englands win but only due to home ground advantage, in Ireland I would back Ireland to win. It will be a close match though.
Nachos Jones- Posts : 2232
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Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
Ireland/england and france
you cant split them. No point trying to be honest
you cant split them. No point trying to be honest
mystiroakey- Posts : 32472
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Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
Really looking forward to the England/Ireland game now. Could be the game of the tournament Two well-matched sides. It could be really brutal.
Twickenham's a decent pitch but let's hope the conditions are good too.
Twickenham's a decent pitch but let's hope the conditions are good too.
Cyril- Posts : 7162
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Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
I am just hoping one of Ireland or Wales can beat France.. SO the tourney is open
mystiroakey- Posts : 32472
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Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
Is it too much to hope Italy can do it today?mystiroakey wrote:I am just hoping one of Ireland or Wales can beat France.. SO the tourney is open
Answer: Probably yes.
Cyril- Posts : 7162
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Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
What do I base that on?
they have the best 10 around right now
They are playing the right tactics and vary them for each game / opposition
they have a settled experienced team
They absolutely destroyed last years champions
They have confidence and team ethic
They have no obvious weak points
Now England are not a bad side but are not the finished article yet and I don't think they have the tactical flexibility or understanding of each other to beat Ireland
Ireland just have that extra bit of something that separates the great from the good
Its just on the showing so far but to any neutral Ireland are clearly the best side FROM WHAT WE HAVE SEEN SO FAR
they have the best 10 around right now
They are playing the right tactics and vary them for each game / opposition
they have a settled experienced team
They absolutely destroyed last years champions
They have confidence and team ethic
They have no obvious weak points
Now England are not a bad side but are not the finished article yet and I don't think they have the tactical flexibility or understanding of each other to beat Ireland
Ireland just have that extra bit of something that separates the great from the good
Its just on the showing so far but to any neutral Ireland are clearly the best side FROM WHAT WE HAVE SEEN SO FAR
TJ- Posts : 8603
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Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
Its going to be a cracking match Cyril. One of those games that you know will be entertaining.
Nachos Jones- Posts : 2232
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Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
mystiroakey wrote:Fair play SL needs to allways look at how we can improve.
That is a key trait to a good Coach.
NZ coaches have allways had that attitude.
But in this case I think its very easy to look at the game and think the conditions were better than they were. Hence thinking we should have converted more.
Scotland couldn't hold on to the ball. England normally cant hold on to the ball in those conditions either. I think we made it look easier that it was..
I think points about England in previous years would have made far harder work of that game are right. But I think it's fair to suggest that we could, and should have put more points on the board. As someone said, NZ and the Boks would have, we need to be realistic about what that performance shows us.
There is still huge room for improvement, I don't see it as being unnecessarily dour to think this, quite the opposite.
On an aside, this is not meant to rub Scotland's noses in it. They are far far better than they looked yesterday, I think Johnson is clueless.
Hood83- Posts : 2751
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Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
You also cant pretend it was a flawless victory. They dominated against weak opposition but to pretend that this makes England suddenly invincible is delusionary. As does pretending Ireland are suddenly invincible after one big game over a distracted Wales side.
What we do know is that theres 3 teams in the title race now.
Im certainly not in the camp that thinks englasnd will get humped by Ireland, but nor would it be on any level a shock if they lost...other than the bombastic dullards who havent learnt from the last 10 years.
Weve seen England twice get humiliated when chasing grand slams, and one of those years they were head and shoudlers the best team in the competition. This year they are looking second best or maybe joint best, so dont be amazed if they contrive to lose another game or even two.
Im not in the "Farrell is rubbish" camp, I think hes answering his questions.
I too have pointed out that england backed themselves to win through their strengths and using they superior players rather than trying to nullify a weak opposition...a mistake theyve made many times in these kind of games over the last 5 years..Johnsosn or Lancaster.
I cant see though how anyone can see that its still frustrating they didnt convert more possession to scores given the dominance of possession and territory. There still has to be question marks over how good they are given the quality of opposition theyve faced to date.
What we do know is that theres 3 teams in the title race now.
Im certainly not in the camp that thinks englasnd will get humped by Ireland, but nor would it be on any level a shock if they lost...other than the bombastic dullards who havent learnt from the last 10 years.
Weve seen England twice get humiliated when chasing grand slams, and one of those years they were head and shoudlers the best team in the competition. This year they are looking second best or maybe joint best, so dont be amazed if they contrive to lose another game or even two.
Im not in the "Farrell is rubbish" camp, I think hes answering his questions.
I too have pointed out that england backed themselves to win through their strengths and using they superior players rather than trying to nullify a weak opposition...a mistake theyve made many times in these kind of games over the last 5 years..Johnsosn or Lancaster.
I cant see though how anyone can see that its still frustrating they didnt convert more possession to scores given the dominance of possession and territory. There still has to be question marks over how good they are given the quality of opposition theyve faced to date.
Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler- Posts : 10344
Join date : 2011-06-02
Location : Englandshire
Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
Nachos Jones wrote:Its going to be a cracking match Cyril. One of those games that you know will be entertaining.
Indeed - should be good.
TJ- Posts : 8603
Join date : 2013-09-22
Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
Tj.TJ wrote:What do I base that on?
they have the best 10 around right now
They are playing the right tactics and vary them for each game / opposition
they have a settled experienced team
They absolutely destroyed last years champions
They have confidence and team ethic
They have no obvious weak points
Now England are not a bad side but are not the finished article yet and I don't think they have the tactical flexibility or understanding of each other to beat Ireland
Ireland just have that extra bit of something that separates the great from the good
Its just on the showing so far but to any neutral Ireland are clearly the best side FROM WHAT WE HAVE SEEN SO FAR
No disrespect to Ireland mate. But that is shear hyperbole mate.. Ireland are not a great team..and I doubt any irish fan would admit that either
mystiroakey- Posts : 32472
Join date : 2011-03-06
Age : 47
Location : surrey
Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
I didn't say they were a great team. They have that bit of something special tho.
TJ- Posts : 8603
Join date : 2013-09-22
Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
You said they have something that separates the great from the good.
Look mate. Wales bashed England in much better fashion last year, England bashed Ireland up big time two years ago. Ireland at home have bashed England up.. England have bashed France up.
Sadly none of us are great. We just are not. We cannot maintain levels of constancy a t that level..
England will be slight favs to home advantage,, both teams are similar..
We are the NH..
Nz are great
SA are very good.
Then there are 5 teams that are ok, all of who can beat each other.. Bar Wales mental block v aus..
Look mate. Wales bashed England in much better fashion last year, England bashed Ireland up big time two years ago. Ireland at home have bashed England up.. England have bashed France up.
Sadly none of us are great. We just are not. We cannot maintain levels of constancy a t that level..
England will be slight favs to home advantage,, both teams are similar..
We are the NH..
Nz are great
SA are very good.
Then there are 5 teams that are ok, all of who can beat each other.. Bar Wales mental block v aus..
mystiroakey- Posts : 32472
Join date : 2011-03-06
Age : 47
Location : surrey
Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:You also cant pretend it was a flawless victory. They dominated against weak opposition but to pretend that this makes England suddenly invincible is delusionary. As does pretending Ireland are suddenly invincible after one big game over a distracted Wales side.
What we do know is that theres 3 teams in the title race now.
Im certainly not in the camp that thinks englasnd will get humped by Ireland, but nor would it be on any level a shock if they lost...other than the bombastic dullards who havent learnt from the last 10 years.
Weve seen England twice get humiliated when chasing grand slams, and one of those years they were head and shoudlers the best team in the competition. This year they are looking second best or maybe joint best, so dont be amazed if they contrive to lose another game or even two.
Im not in the "Farrell is rubbish" camp, I think hes answering his questions.
I too have pointed out that england backed themselves to win through their strengths and using they superior players rather than trying to nullify a weak opposition...a mistake theyve made many times in these kind of games over the last 5 years..Johnsosn or Lancaster.
I cant see though how anyone can see that its still frustrating they didnt convert more possession to scores given the dominance of possession and territory. There still has to be question marks over how good they are given the quality of opposition theyve faced to date.
Pretty much my thoughts exactly
Hood83- Posts : 2751
Join date : 2011-06-12
Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
England got a good win yesterday, but you have to take into account that was a truly woeful Scotland not even living up to their lowly expectations – NZ would have put 60 on them. We need to lengthen our attention spans before getting too excited – or wait for the Wales and Ireland games.
Farrell, though, is improving (not just in this game), but he will lose us the Wales and Ireland games if he kicks at goal like that. Care is on top form and works well with OF. Burrell looks fairly comfortable, if a little slow – Manu should stroll back into the side when fully fit. 12T is ok-ish at playing Scotland – I definitely want him in the team (when we’re playing Scotland). IC is still very much a problem for us. The back 3 actually looked pretty good (if a little unpolished yet). But overall the finishing was rather average and support running (remember Ashton) was mostly poor.
I kind of like how Hartley’s niggle has now possessed Wood.
And a special thank-you to TY who did us all a favour by making the obvious… obviouser.
I’m afraid the pitch deserved a straight red. It reflects badly on NH test rugby that they use a pitch Cleethorpe’s 5ths would turn their noses up at (even for training). I thought RU had turned professional some time back.
Farrell, though, is improving (not just in this game), but he will lose us the Wales and Ireland games if he kicks at goal like that. Care is on top form and works well with OF. Burrell looks fairly comfortable, if a little slow – Manu should stroll back into the side when fully fit. 12T is ok-ish at playing Scotland – I definitely want him in the team (when we’re playing Scotland). IC is still very much a problem for us. The back 3 actually looked pretty good (if a little unpolished yet). But overall the finishing was rather average and support running (remember Ashton) was mostly poor.
I kind of like how Hartley’s niggle has now possessed Wood.
And a special thank-you to TY who did us all a favour by making the obvious… obviouser.
I’m afraid the pitch deserved a straight red. It reflects badly on NH test rugby that they use a pitch Cleethorpe’s 5ths would turn their noses up at (even for training). I thought RU had turned professional some time back.
Barney McGrew did it- Posts : 1604
Join date : 2012-02-23
Location : Trumpton
Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
Psw has however been very critical of England in recent weeks, and now is changing his tune to what everyone already knew.
The backs did ok yesterday.. Much better than before. So rather than saying they are still rubbish because they left a bit out there . Why not just understand that it was an improvement and understand you don't go from being a good team to a great team over night..
There is an upward curve in our performance..
The backs did ok yesterday.. Much better than before. So rather than saying they are still rubbish because they left a bit out there . Why not just understand that it was an improvement and understand you don't go from being a good team to a great team over night..
There is an upward curve in our performance..
mystiroakey- Posts : 32472
Join date : 2011-03-06
Age : 47
Location : surrey
Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
I think there are still four teams in the race. I would only write off Scotland and Italy as potential champions.Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler wrote:You also cant pretend it was a flawless victory. They dominated against weak opposition but to pretend that this makes England suddenly invincible is delusionary. As does pretending Ireland are suddenly invincible after one big game over a distracted Wales side.
What we do know is that theres 3 teams in the title race now.
Exiledinborders- Posts : 1645
Join date : 2012-03-18
Location : Scottish Borders
Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
To be fair Barney the weather has been freakish this year and the SRU have announced a major redevelopment of the ground.
Weve seen just as bad pitches from Twickenham falling apart after being relied several times and the carpet tiles they had in france last year or the games on ice a couple of years ago.
This is pretty much par for the course in NH rugby.
Weve seen just as bad pitches from Twickenham falling apart after being relied several times and the carpet tiles they had in france last year or the games on ice a couple of years ago.
This is pretty much par for the course in NH rugby.
Peter Seabiscuit Wheeler- Posts : 10344
Join date : 2011-06-02
Location : Englandshire
Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
To be fair we did all write Wales of to early last year
mystiroakey- Posts : 32472
Join date : 2011-03-06
Age : 47
Location : surrey
Re: Scotland v England, Murrayfield, Sat 8th Feb, 17:00
The scottish pitch has a parasite infection that has killed the root system
TJ- Posts : 8603
Join date : 2013-09-22
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