Welsh World Cup Squad part 2

First topic message reminder :

Anyone else think Ll Williams and Anscombe did well when they came on? Would definitely take them over Phillips and Hook at the moment.

15 - L Williams
14 - Amos - More talent pace power and intelligence than Cuthbert
13 - Given
12 - Given
11 - North
10 - Given
9 - Davies
8 - Given
7 - Tipuric (Wales's form player)
6 - Lydiate
5 - AWJ
4 - Charteris
3 - Lee/Francis
2 - Baldwin (slightly better all round for me)
1 - Jones/James

Very good side and as good as any we can put out IMO even without injuries.

Assuming your givens are Scott Williams, Jamie Roberts, Gareth Davies and Talupe Faletua, then replace Amos with Walker, and I agree, that is if anything, an even stronger side than what we would normally put out.

Who do you think the Givens are Dowlais a set of brothers from Merthyr who have just been launched on the national scene:

Dai Givens
Bryn Givens
Maldwyn Givens
Rhys Givens
Rhodri Givens

Amos over Walker everyday for me especially is height, defense and boot

RubyGuby wrote:Who do you think the Givens are Dowlais a set of brothers from Merthyr who have just been launched on the national scene:

Dai Givens
Bryn Givens
Maldwyn Givens
Rhys Givens
Rhodri Givens      

All Irish qualified! Ha! Maldwyn has a good turn of foot but a little too slow on the straight. Bryn is a beast. Rhys could replace Payne. I'll talk to Joe.

Ah, the Givens family, I know them well, Bryn is a bit of a hot head though, I don't think it would be a good idea putting him in against the Saes. Also, every time we are down the club, and Maldwyn and Dai have one too many, they start scrapping with each other, so I do not think they would be good either.

On a serious note though, from what I have seen in the warm-up game. Eli looked a lot more assured than Hallam. So for that reason I would go with Eli, plus he is a bit quicker.

flyhalffactory wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:I believe that Anscombe's cameo was a more assured and more complete fly-half performance - that is total opposite to Priestland's performances in a Wales jersey for the last year! Don't you just love being bored to death for having a valid opinion Gwlad.

Provide actual instances because I cannae recall them

Well no wonder you cannae recall them. You admitted you didn't watch much rugby yet continue to bore the people who DO watch welsh rugby with some tedious rants. I've read all this before, you're just repeating what Scarlets' supporters have said. God knows why you're bringing up what Gats and Sean Edwards have said in reaction to Wales fans booing him during a live game - that is not relevant to this discussion.

Umm, it was Anscombe's first and only cap? Seeing as he managed to not drop the ball, make his kicks to touch, and kick his goals - he did a lot better than Priestland's last start in a Wales jersey - before you reply go and look for some highlights of that game then come back to us trying to state Priestland had a good game with a straight face .

munkian wrote:

bedfordwelsh wrote:

munkian wrote:North, Amos, Sanjay.

Not sure where there's even a debate about this...

munkian,

No debate off me.  In my mind and looking at the original squad I would say Amos is more along the path of development than Walker plus he can cover XV and hence why he was included originally over Eli.  If he doesn't pick Cuthbert (Pleaseeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee don't) then it has to be Amos.

Cuthbert and Walker for Uruguay maybe ? I guess Sanjay needs a game before England.  

If Amos is going to play against England, he needs to play against Uruguay. That's too big a game to go into cold.

flyhalffactory wrote:

Gwlad wrote:Priestland is not 'highly regarded'….he had a great RWC 2011 and then has gone off the boil, he is ponderous in possession and apt to lose the ball in contact. He is indecisive and lacks confidence. He also isn't a great kicker.

As soon as Anscombe shows his worth and has the chance he will overtake him at 10.

Who are these people?
Bath, Wasps, Clermont, Northants, off the top of my head all made serious bids for him in 2014, even considering he had a serious injury around that time, also Ryan Jones, Howley, Gatland, Rob Jones all called a small section of the Welsh crowd and the internet trolls a disgrace, so I would say to you who are these people who dont regard him highly.

Gatland even said he had a decent game against Australia!, so how come Gats says one thing and a few of you on here says another.... perhaps Gats doesnt know what he is talking about.
http://www.southwalesargus.co.uk/sport/11594964.Warren_Gatland__Wales_fly_half_Rhys_Priestland_can_put_two_fingers_up_to_his_critics/

Opinions are great and I certainly think Priestland is a confidence player and if he could get back to the creative innovative 2011 form he is far away your best 10, but personally I dont think he will unless he doesn't read any social media whilst playing international rugby. Biggar is in outstanding form but Priestland if supported wont let you guys down.

Where is the evidence that all these teams put in serious bids for him? Even if they did, what is meant to be the implication of this? You still haven't shown us where Priestland has 'done well in training' therefore justifying his inclusion. His selection is not justified, we just don't have anyone else to fill in the role. That is what you can't seem to grasp.

What Australia game? If it's the most recent one he was on the field for like 3 minutes..... Assuming that I'm an internet troll rather than a paying supporter (I can assure you that I'm the latter) is rather ignorant and shows you can't really bring anything to this discussion other than a tedious rant at those who harbour a different opinion.

* From what I'm reading in that southwalesargus article, it reinforces my view that Priestland is not cut out for international rugby. Players get booed and slagged off on the internet all the time, yet they get on with it. Why the exception for the Welsh fly-half? He was on a downward spiral long before the live booing anyway.

mikey_dragon wrote:His selection is not justified, we just don't have anyone else to fill in the role.

You have just justified his selection yourself.

Gwlad wrote:ah i see its like that is it…post 3 times and it has more gravitas?!!

Joking aside i am sure you haven't met most Welsh fans either and there is no debate here because it has been polarized by silly assertions that one person's opinion is righter than another's

Fact is Gats persisted with him and finally gave up. Biggar has come into his own at 10 and is a country mile ahead of Priestland. i have no confidence in prietsland, nor does Gats and, worst of all, nor does he have confidence in himself…roll on Anscombe.

This is spot on.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:His selection is not justified, we just don't have anyone else to fill in the role.

You have just justified his selection yourself.

Thanks for making me look like an idiot.

mikey_dragon wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:His selection is not justified, we just don't have anyone else to fill in the role.

You have just justified his selection yourself.

Thanks for making me look like an idiot.

Sorry about that

I still think if Anscombe was not injured, there is a high likelihood Priestland would have still got the nod - he is Gats' man (not the only one).

Also Cuthbert is way off form and needs to be dropped, yet I don't see any Blues fans rushing to his defence.

mikey_dragon wrote:I still think if Anscombe was not injured, there is a high likelihood Priestland would have still got the nod - he is Gats' man (not the only one).

Also Cuthbert is way off form and needs to be dropped, yet I don't see any Blues fans rushing to his defence.

If Anscombe was fit I agree Priest would have still gone to the RWC, as would Anscombe, with Nipper missing out. And to be honest Anscombe would have taken Hooks traditional bench role of 10/12/15 cover, where as Nipper is only seen as a 15 (or poop hits the fan 10).

LordDowlais wrote:Ah, the Givens family, I know them well, Bryn is a bit of a hot head though, I don't think it would be a good idea putting him in against the Saes. Also, every time we are down the club, and Maldwyn and Dai have one too many, they start scrapping with each other, so I do not think they would be good either.

On a serious note though, from what I have seen in the warm-up game. Eli looked a lot more assured than Hallam. So for that reason I would go with Eli, plus he is a bit quicker.

Nice one Dowlais that made me laugh - In fact I agree Amos hasn't shown up well in the warm ups. Ive just watched him over a long period and I see him as the real deal. For me as good as JD in time to come (12 months) - Walker is class no doubt but at the moment Amos edges it. Have to agree with you about Bryn Givens though, the thought of him playing alongside Mike Phillips is not a good one and we'd be left with 13 on the field

So assuming Gats isn't gonna pick Cuthbert for the England game(which I fear he will), either Amos or Walker would start on the wing. So do you play them on the right, where as far as I can recall, neither play regularly, or the left with North moving over? Partly because he has more experience there, and partly to counter the threat of May!

RubyGuby wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:Ah, the Givens family, I know them well, Bryn is a bit of a hot head though, I don't think it would be a good idea putting him in against the Saes. Also, every time we are down the club, and Maldwyn and Dai have one too many, they start scrapping with each other, so I do not think they would be good either.

On a serious note though, from what I have seen in the warm-up game. Eli looked a lot more assured than Hallam. So for that reason I would go with Eli, plus he is a bit quicker.

Nice one Dowlais that made me laugh - In fact I agree Amos hasn't shown up well in the warm ups. Ive just watched him over a long period and I see him as the real deal. For me as good as JD in time to come (12 months) - Walker is class no doubt but at the moment Amos edges it. Have to agree with you about Bryn Givens though, the thought of him playing alongside Mike Phillips is not a good one and we'd be left with 13 on the field

Ruby, there is no doubting Hallam Amos's talent, in years to come he will be a mainstay in the Welsh set-up, the kid has oodles of ability. Unfortunately, and please do not bash me for saying this my Gwent friends on here, I think that playing for Dragons has not exposed Hallam to the more intense games that Eli has been exposed to playing for Ospreys. This is why I think Eli is more self assured when he put on the Welsh jersey. As for ability, there is nothing between them, I just think Eli is less of a rabbit in the headlights than Hallam is. But that is not to say Hallam will not step up to the plate given the time though.

Hallam is a world class player in the making, but I think this is a WC too soon for him. But saying that, watch Hallam Amos rip this WC apart playing a blinder for Wales and proving me wrong in the process. To be honest, I would not mind that happening at all.

Not from what I've seen. Didn't we have this discussion some weeks ago? It sounded just as daft then as it does now (no offence).

You beat me to it, Mikey. Didn't we establish then that Walker hasn't featured in many of the Ospreys' big, 'intense' games?

Oh here we go, look, please do not take this offensively, but there is more expectation on the shoulders of Ospreys players than Dragons players. It is dealing with this expectation in every game that makes the difference.

*sigh*

No this again

Change of direction Liam Williams and Samson Lee have both taken part in full training, and are expected back for the start of the RWC

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/wales-trio-samson-lee-liam-10028028

ScarletSpiderman wrote:Change of direction  Liam Williams and Samson Lee have both taken part in full training, and are expected back for the start of the RWC

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-news/wales-trio-samson-lee-liam-10028028

Gatland has already said Liam is going to start the first game, looks like Samson could as well hopefully.

LordDowlais wrote:Oh here we go, look, please do not take this offensively, but there is more expectation on the shoulders of Ospreys players than Dragons players. It is dealing with this expectation in every game that makes the difference.

So Walker should get the nod by virtue of playing for the Ospreys?

SecretFly wrote:

RubyGuby wrote:Who do you think the Givens are Dowlais a set of brothers from Merthyr who have just been launched on the national scene:

Dai Givens
Bryn Givens
Maldwyn Givens
Rhys Givens
Rhodri Givens      

All Irish qualified! Ha!  Maldwyn has a good turn of foot but a little too slow on the straight.  Bryn is a beast.  Rhys could replace Payne.  I'll talk to Joe.

Their dad Don Givens was a handy winger for QPR but  Don settled in Merthyr and his lads were  born there. Unfortunately, they have that nasty Irish temperament that they're not used to in Merthyr.  

RubyGuby wrote:Their dad Don Givens was a handy winger for QPR but Don settled in Merthyr and his lads were born there. Unfortunately, they have that nasty Irish temperament that they're not used to in Merthyr. thumbsup

You should see them when they are all together. When one starts they all start. Best to let them carry on with it I say.

LordDowlais wrote:

RubyGuby wrote:Their dad Don Givens was a handy winger for QPR but  Don settled in Merthyr and his lads were  born there. Unfortunately, they have that nasty Irish temperament that they're not used to in Merthyr.  thumbsup

You should see them when they are all together. When one starts they all start. Best to let them carry on with it I say.

That'll be the steroids

None of them can play well enough to ever be accused of taking steroids. That damn spud gene is stalling the Welsh gazelle in them.

Munkian - I just wet myself with the steroids reference - I shouldn't but I did. Pure Twin Town

SecretFly wrote:None of them can play well enough to ever be accused of taking steroids.  That damn spud gene is stalling the Welsh gazelle in them.

I bet they float over the ruck though

mikey_dragon wrote:

flyhalffactory wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:I believe that Anscombe's cameo was a more assured and more complete fly-half performance - that is total opposite to Priestland's performances in a Wales jersey for the last year! Don't you just love being bored to death for having a valid opinion Gwlad.

Provide actual instances because I cannae recall them

Well no wonder you cannae recall them. You admitted you didn't watch much rugby yet continue to bore the people who DO watch welsh rugby with some tedious rants. I've read all this before, you're just repeating what Scarlets' supporters have said. God knows why you're bringing up what Gats and Sean Edwards have said in reaction to Wales fans booing him during a live game - that is not relevant to this discussion.

Umm, it was Anscombe's first and only cap? Seeing as he managed to not drop the ball, make his kicks to touch, and kick his goals - he did a lot better than Priestland's last start in a Wales jersey - before you reply go and look for some highlights of that game then come back to us trying to state Priestland had a good game with a straight face .

Do I bore only you? or are you once again speaking on behalf of "everyone".

It wasn't a rant it was just attempting to understand "your mindset", as all my rugby friends down south who actually are regional season ticket holders and actually watch live international matches seem to all agree that The Priest had an ok-to-good 2014/15 season not a fantastic season but certainly not a rubbish one, and guffaw at the suggestion that every rugby fan thinks he is utter trash and shake their head at anyone who can seriously suggest that the WRFU and coaching staff have given up on him and yet are taking him to the WC as backup 10.
 
The reason I brought it up re:Gatland/Edwards/Ryan Jones etc etc was the statement by a couple of you that it is a "FACT" that every single rugby supporter thinks that Priestland is rubbish and Gatland had given up on him.... Well I am showing you that Edwards though in 2014 against Australia he actually had a great defensive game 9 out of 9 tackles, and Gatland stated he thought he actually overall had a good game.

The only fact is Mr Gatland actually hasn't given up on him (like Adam Jones, Hook, Phillips), he picked him for the original WC squad and he is still in the 31. I mean isn't that the actual fact?

By the way
I am an Edinburgh season ticket holder and even go to the odd away match when my and the missus are both available, I watch or try to watch EVERY 6Ns Scotland match home and away, I have been on two Lions tours. When I was in Wales for four years 2006-2010 purchased an Ospreys season ticket and if I couldn't see them in Swansea I went down to the Scarlets. I will be going to every Scotland WC game and hope to go to the Wales v Fiji match. So yes I get see the Dragons/Blues/Scarlets/Ospreys at least once maybe twice a year EVERY YEAR, and watch the Welsh team at least once maybe twice EVERY YEAR.

What about you?

I agree with ScarletSpiderman (you have justified the inclusion yourself).

Anyway bit of closure on this one as I think that Biggar is far and away your best 10 and am excited to see a Davies/Biggar half back combo

flyhalffactory wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:

flyhalffactory wrote:

mikey_dragon wrote:I believe that Anscombe's cameo was a more assured and more complete fly-half performance - that is total opposite to Priestland's performances in a Wales jersey for the last year! Don't you just love being bored to death for having a valid opinion Gwlad.

Provide actual instances because I cannae recall them

Well no wonder you cannae recall them. You admitted you didn't watch much rugby yet continue to bore the people who DO watch welsh rugby with some tedious rants. I've read all this before, you're just repeating what Scarlets' supporters have said. God knows why you're bringing up what Gats and Sean Edwards have said in reaction to Wales fans booing him during a live game - that is not relevant to this discussion.

Umm, it was Anscombe's first and only cap? Seeing as he managed to not drop the ball, make his kicks to touch, and kick his goals - he did a lot better than Priestland's last start in a Wales jersey - before you reply go and look for some highlights of that game then come back to us trying to state Priestland had a good game with a straight face .

Do I bore only you? or are you once again speaking on behalf of "everyone".

It wasn't a rant it was just attempting to understand "your mindset", as all my rugby friends down south who actually are regional season ticket holders and actually watch live international matches seem to all agree that The Priest had an ok-to-good 2014/15 season not a fantastic season but certainly not a rubbish one, and guffaw at the suggestion that every rugby fan thinks he is utter trash and shake their head at anyone who can seriously suggest that the WRFU and coaching staff have given up on him and yet are taking him to the WC as backup 10.
 
The reason I brought it up re:Gatland/Edwards/Ryan Jones etc etc was the statement by a couple of you that it is a "FACT" that every single rugby supporter thinks that Priestland is rubbish and Gatland had given up on him.... Well I am showing you that Edwards though in 2014 against Australia he actually had a great defensive game 9 out of 9 tackles, and Gatland stated he thought he actually overall had a good game.

The only fact is Mr Gatland actually hasn't given up on him (like Adam Jones, Hook, Phillips), he picked him for the original WC squad and he is still in the 31. I mean isn't that the actual fact?

By the way
I am an Edinburgh season ticket holder and even go to the odd away match when my and the missus are both available, I watch or try to watch EVERY 6Ns Scotland match home and away, I have been on two Lions tours. When I was in Wales for four years 2006-2010 purchased an Ospreys season ticket and if I couldn't see them in Swansea I went down to the Scarlets. I will be going to every Scotland WC game and hope to go to the Wales v Fiji match. So yes I get see the Dragons/Blues/Scarlets/Ospreys at least once maybe twice a year EVERY YEAR, and watch the Welsh team at least once maybe twice EVERY YEAR.

What about you?

I agree with ScarletSpiderman (you have justified the inclusion yourself).

Anyway bit of closure on this one as I think that Biggar is far and away your best 10 and am excited to see a Davies/Biggar half back combo

Ah I see so it was opinion based on other opinion then. You can believe that and continue to not watch games with Welsh teams all you want. I'll stick to my own opinion based on what I can see/have seen for the last few years .

I'm sorry but where did I state it as a fact? I spoke based on ear and again, what I can see. Why are you telling me he made 9/9 tackles in a particular game? Does that make him amazing? Apart from tackling it seems he had another poor game. What makes me laugh is people bringing that up when there was probably a number of other players who made more tackles and did a lot more in addition to defence. Where's their praise, or do they not need any through not being a 'confidence player'?

He is Gats' boy, like some others. It makes sense to retain them both as he and Biggar have been the only outside-halves in the last couple of squads. I still don't think he's a good fly-half. If he was he would be a better goal-kicker, he wouldn't drop the ball, he wouldn't mess up his punts, he wouldn't get turned over a lot. Go back his last start in a Wales jersey - that has been his form throughout 2013-15.

So you don't watch Wales' matches and you presume I don't watch any either; or the games that I do attend I just sit there booing Priestland? Least that was the impression you have been giving since yesterday. I merely cleared up that I wasn't what you assumed me (and Glwad) to be. You shouldn't be so presumptuous of people who are better placed to judge a players capabilites than you are. And instead of apologising for your ignorance there you type more irrelevant info (about attending Scotland games). Yawn.

munkian wrote:

SecretFly wrote:None of them can play well enough to ever be accused of taking steroids.  That damn spud gene is stalling the Welsh gazelle in them.

I bet they float over the ruck though

Sounds like Cuhbert's attempt at scoring on the weekend...

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:Oh here we go, look, please do not take this offensively, but there is more expectation on the shoulders of Ospreys players than Dragons players. It is dealing with this expectation in every game that makes the difference.

So Walker should get the nod by virtue of playing for the Ospreys?

Definitely. In fact, I've heard Cai Griffiths is next in line if Samson does break down again.

Risca Rev wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:Oh here we go, look, please do not take this offensively, but there is more expectation on the shoulders of Ospreys players than Dragons players. It is dealing with this expectation in every game that makes the difference.

So Walker should get the nod by virtue of playing for the Ospreys?

Definitely. In fact, I've heard Cai Griffiths is next in line if Samson does break down again.

LOL.

WTF happens if Sanjay crocks his toenails again? Anscombe back in or Amos? Morgan?!!!

God we're thin now

Samson Lee is going to be starting the first game:-

http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/rugby-union/34212309

Another question the WRU need to ask themselves is what the feck are players like Mathew Morgan and Ian Evans doing playing in the 2nd tier of English rugby. Now I know there's a financial factor involved but can we really not accommodate such potentially key players. It just doesn't seem right that our regions accommodate some inferior overseas players at the expense of these 2 and more like them.

RubyGuby wrote:Another question the WRU need to ask themselves is what the feck are players like Mathew Morgan and Ian Evans doing playing in the 2nd tier of English rugby. Now I know there's a financial factor involved but can we really not accommodate such potentially key players. It just doesn't seem right that our regions accommodate some inferior overseas players at the expense of these 2 and more like them.

I believe the Dragons and Blues attempted to get hold of Nipper, and the Scarlets tried to get Ianto. So it is the players choice to sod of to lower level rugby, not the regions ignoring them

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

RubyGuby wrote:Another question the WRU need to ask themselves is what the feck are players like Mathew Morgan and Ian Evans doing playing in the 2nd tier of English rugby. Now I know there's a financial factor involved but can we really not accommodate such potentially key players. It just doesn't seem right that our regions accommodate some inferior overseas players at the expense of these 2 and more like them.

I believe the Dragons and Blues attempted to get hold of Nipper, and the Scarlets tried to get Ianto.  So it is the players choice to sod of to lower level rugby, not the regions ignoring them

Also, Ianto and AWJ broke into the Ospreys team at around the same time, in the period since Ianto played aprox 170 times for either us and TW and Lions, AWJ in the same period played around 280 times, this was due to Ianto either being injured, SUSPENDED, or not even selected because of his attitude, as for Nipper it was well documented that yes other Welsh Regions were in for him, but he wanted out of the Welsh Rugby goldfish bowl.

wayne wrote: as for Nipper it was well documented that yes other Welsh Regions were in for him, but he wanted out of the Welsh Rugby goldfish bowl.

Also, add in the fact that there is no salary cap in the English second tier and the very wealthy owners can pay the players what ever they like.

Well that explains that then - I would suggest that if our Regions had been more competitive we might have held on to Nipper - If Ianto wants an "easy" pay day its his choice, still a shame though watching him just drift away but like its been said, it's his choice - I guess once a snake always a

If the regions could afford to bid more for players, I'm sure they would.

Or if the WRU advised that leaving would hamper international selcetion chances, it can't all be carrot!

Except everyone knows it won't hamper Test selection if you're a good enough player.

But in the case of Morgan I really don't think he's that good a player that someone home based such as Eli Walker, or Patchell wouldn't warrant the call up.

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:Except everyone knows it won't hamper Test selection if you're a good enough player.

Until we have the danglers to actually drop someone. Post RWC, we will be in a 'rebuilding' phase so we can go down that route. Especially with the likes of 1/2p, Foxy and North coming out of contract in the summer.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:Except everyone knows it won't hamper Test selection if you're a good enough player.

Until we have the danglers to actually drop someone.  Post RWC, we will be in a 'rebuilding' phase so we can go down that route.  Especially with the likes of 1/2p, Foxy and North coming  out of contract in the summer.

Quite right SS, I advocated that stance just after Roberts and Halfpenny went originally, to come into being after this WC. Unless you have the North contract.

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:Except everyone knows it won't hamper Test selection if you're a good enough player.

Until we have the danglers to actually drop someone.  Post RWC, we will be in a 'rebuilding' phase so we can go down that route.  Especially with the likes of 1/2p, Foxy and North coming  out of contract in the summer.

Are you suggesting dropping all 3 plus Morgan, Preistland, Roberts etc?

If so I like it! Short term harm for long term production of gains, force North 1'2p and Foxy to return

wayne wrote:

ScarletSpiderman wrote:

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:Except everyone knows it won't hamper Test selection if you're a good enough player.

Until we have the danglers to actually drop someone.  Post RWC, we will be in a 'rebuilding' phase so we can go down that route.  Especially with the likes of 1/2p, Foxy and North coming  out of contract in the summer.

Quite right SS, I advocated that stance just after Roberts and Halfpenny went originally, to come into being after this WC. Unless you have the North contract.

To be honest I think we need to keep it clear, play in Wales or don't play. Regardless of loopholes etc. I think I would say that Roberts, Priestland and Francis should all be ruled out post RWC for signing (or re-signing) out of Wales.