Euro 2016 Discussion

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Thats an awful pass from Kane

The entire second half Iceland looked comfortable. They weren't defending with their lives on the line - they didn't have to.

Eddie Howe needs to prove himself over a number of seasons before he gets considered for the England gig, surely?

FreekShow wrote:Eddie Howe needs to prove himself over a number of seasons before he gets considered for the England gig, surely?

In the days of old, perhaps! But the alternative is Gareth Southgate...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GWqmqGsTTBI

FreekShow wrote:Eddie Howe needs to prove himself over a number of seasons before he gets considered for the England gig, surely?

In fairness Hodgson failed at Liverpool and got the England job 16 months later.

Hammersmith harrier wrote:

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:Carroll, Townsend, Antonio, Noble, Drinkwater should all be in that squad. He had a look at two, and picked no option over Townsend and injured Henderson and really gambled on Wilshere. Milner needn't be there, Sterling was out of form and was our only pacey wide option.

He picked the wrong squad and that told me we'd fail from there.

Carroll and Townsend instead of Milner and Henderson would have made sense; despite his form Drinkwater simply is not good enough, if Wilshere was fit enough to go he should have been fit enough to start.

He has however had a good year and would be confident. Wilshere is class but having him and Henderson in was a gamble and clearly neither were fit enough for full games.

I'd have not taken Rashford, as good as he was he played as a winger and only looked good in comparison to the dirge before him. Townsend would have given us an option, although Antonio has been miles better than him this year, and Carroll would have been great when we were entrenched in a team's box and throwing in crosses.

Another manager with no balls who was embarrassed about using a strength like heading and crossing. Why we think we're above it I don't know, other teams hate England's physicality but we are scared to be ourselves. The nations who aren't afraid to use their strengths have all prospered.

It should be the best man available. Regardless of nationality.

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:Pardew would take it no questions.

But Howe would be my choice. Young, new ideas, no interest in reputations, has got a style and has an eye for a player. He'll know who he wants in his squad and will not fear youth. Philosophy, can clearly coach football too. That's key, he can make players better by playing to his style.

Would Howe take it? International football management tends to be an old man's game; puts his foot wrong and his reputation is ruined. I think he'd be better off sticking to Bournemouth, have another decent season and I can see a bigger club coming in for him; would be a better fit. 

Alan Pardew and Gareth Southgate seem most likely, I just can't see any others wanting to take it. I think Gary Neville will likely stay at Sky for a while now, think he got badly burnt at Valencia and his association with Hodgson at England won't be helpful. Of Southgate and Pardew, think Pardew is the better option but he's not great.

FreekShow wrote:Eddie Howe needs to prove himself over a number of seasons before he gets considered for the England gig, surely?

Sadly he doesn't. He's proved enough compared to the rest. He's never had a bad year yet, even when he got homesick with Burnley he brought in brilliant players before leaving.

And the alternatives are all failures. Pardew? Sacked by West Ham and Newcastle, his Palace side won about 2 games in 2016.

Southgate - well, Boro got rid in the Champ.

Allardyce - do we have to?

Neville - he's already managed to fail and he's had one job.

Brenda - imagine the press conferences alone. And he's been banished to Scotland, never a sign of managerial strength.

Will Grigg - is on fire

Rashford had to go but he had to be used more, I think people are reluctant to appreciate quite how good he is and could be.

Plan B of a big man is a given in major tournaments, playing so many minnows Carroll would have been more effective than say Vardy who relies to heavily on counter attacking football to be effective in that England team.

We'll have to disagree on Drinkwater though Dolph, his Leicester teammates flattered him all season and the game against Holland showed his limitations at that level.

Henderson did play 90 minutes against Slovakia to be fair and looked completely fit and comfortable. Remember he wasn't injured long and was on Liverpool's bench for the Europa League final.

Pardew left Newcastle to be fair, didn't get sacked.

I hate Allardyce but genuinely don't think he'd be out of place as England manager, he wouldn't produce great football but I'd put money on him producing better results than Hodgson. He's a simple manager, but I think that can work at international level.

Henderson was sh1t against Slovakia so I'd be worried if that was fit and comfortable.

The FA should follow the RFU's lead in hiring a cocky overseas manager, the confidence Jones has brought the rugby team cannot be underestimated, 9 wins out of 9 with a team in disarray when he took over.

Think Howe is better off staying at Bournemouth.

Really try and cement their place in the prem for a few years.

Martinez would interest me. Can't coach a defence and can't buy a defence, but the FA would force a coach on him and he wouldn't have to buy players. From there we know he can coach players to be better on the ball.

Emery has better things to do.

Give it Paolo, he'd kill the worst players anyway and it'd be fun.

I think we might be a year too early for Wenger sadly, but I do feel he'd be interested.

Pellegrini might be interested too

GSC wrote:Henderson was sh1t against Slovakia so I'd be worried if that was fit and comfortable.

Who wasn't in the England side?

GSC wrote:Henderson was sh1t against Slovakia so I'd be worried if that was fit and comfortable.

Haven't agreed on much lately, but this couldn't be more true.

I can't see how taking Henderson or Milner can be defended right now. Both players were taking spaces that needed to be used better

In my humble opinion whoever comes in needs to look at the big picture of getting a system in place and then having that system used from grassroots to the national team.

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:

GSC wrote:Henderson was sh1t against Slovakia so I'd be worried if that was fit and comfortable.

Haven't agreed on much lately, but this couldn't be more true.

I can't see how taking Henderson or Milner can be defended right now. Both players were taking spaces that needed to be used better

Milner's inclusion in particular was beyond belief, he literally offers nothing whilst Henderson isn't very good either but both are favourites of Hodgson so had to go apparently.

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:

GSC wrote:Henderson was sh1t against Slovakia so I'd be worried if that was fit and comfortable.

Haven't agreed on much lately, but this couldn't be more true.

I can't see how taking Henderson or Milner can be defended right now. Both players were taking spaces that needed to be used better

I don't think it mattered personally, both played very little (Milner played 4 minutes) and their replacements would also have played little. Such a small issue. I wish they weren't taken though, both could do with a rest after such a long season.

Hero wrote:In my humble opinion whoever comes in needs to look at the big picture of getting a system in place and then having that system used from grassroots to the national team.

Howe should come in and, for all his problems, Hoddle showed after the England job that he had a fundamental understanding of development above anything anyone else in the country seemed to have. I'd have him as a lead above all the England set ups quite happily, and Howe would 100% fit into that way of thinking.

Crimey wrote:

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:

GSC wrote:Henderson was sh1t against Slovakia so I'd be worried if that was fit and comfortable.

Haven't agreed on much lately, but this couldn't be more true.

I can't see how taking Henderson or Milner can be defended right now. Both players were taking spaces that needed to be used better

I don't think it mattered personally, both played very little (Milner played 4 minutes) and their replacements would also have played little. Such a small issue. I wish they weren't taken though, both could do with a rest after such a long season.

So hypothetically speaking, you have James Milner sitting on the bench being as much use as a Chocolate Teapot, a place that Andy Carroll for instance could have had, you honestly believe that needing a goal against Slovakia and Iceland he gets played for 4 minutes?

Crimey wrote:

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:

GSC wrote:Henderson was sh1t against Slovakia so I'd be worried if that was fit and comfortable.

Haven't agreed on much lately, but this couldn't be more true.

I can't see how taking Henderson or Milner can be defended right now. Both players were taking spaces that needed to be used better

I don't think it mattered personally, both played very little (Milner played 4 minutes) and their replacements would also have played little. Such a small issue. I wish they weren't taken though, both could do with a rest after such a long season.

But, had they been replaced much earlier, we may have had useful players as the manager would have seen them in training, and even better we have had used Milner's space for a Townsend or Antonio and then had an option instead of just playing Sterling cos he can be fast out wide. Or Carroll got desperate times.

Hero wrote:In my humble opinion whoever comes in needs to look at the big picture of getting a system in place and then having that system used from grassroots to the national team.

If by "system" you mean formation and style of play, I think most people would acknowledge you need to be able to play more than one system (i.e. have a Plan B), in case your preferred system doesn't work.

I think Roy had the right idea in trying to get England comfortable with different systems, but he obviously executed his plan very badly, as we ended up with a team that couldn't play ANY system well.

I just don't think any replacement for Henderson or Milner was going to play much that's all. I agree that we took too many similar options, but I don't think Hodgson would have used whoever replaced those two. 

I also think Milner had a much, much better season than Townsend and on par with Antonio.

It's an old man's job, looking for a payday. Pellegrini or Moyes? Why would Howe ruin his career at this stage, he wouldn't. Southgate failed with the U-21's last year. Pardew looks best shout, for me.

dyrewolfe wrote:

Hero wrote:In my humble opinion whoever comes in needs to look at the big picture of getting a system in place and then having that system used from grassroots to the national team.

If by "system" you mean formation and style of play, I think most people would acknowledge you need to be able to play more than one system (i.e. have a Plan B), in case your preferred system doesn't work.

I think Roy had the right idea in trying to get England comfortable with different systems, but he obviously executed his plan very badly, as we ended up with a team that couldn't play ANY system well.

All decent sides have a system or identity though and they pick players to fit that identity. England pick players and then try and find a system to fit them.

Pardew would make me a bit sad. People have this idea of him, but he's got no guile. No savvy.

It'll end in tears. But at least his ego means he'll play attacking pacey football. He might be fun for a while, I've just seen it all before with him.

Absolute shambles. I knew it was coming, Roy the clown should of gone post WC. Went into a tournament with no system, no plan & no settled side. Beyond a joke. Just glad clueless Roy has finally gone. Depressingly, it's come years to late.

Just been watching the highlights and seen Iceland's 2nd goal again.

How the feck does a player get a shot off (and score) with 3 defenders stood right in front of him?

Roy's gone but don't go getting to positive just yet people. We still have the clowns at the FA in place and that means we won't be hiring anyone with a backbone for quite some time just yet. Another yes man will come in on the highest paid job in international football and the usual candidates will be picked because they play for the bigger clubs regardless of fitness or form. At least 3 payers from West Ham should have been in that England starting XI yet not one made the squad, that tells you all you need to know about the national team and how it is.

Negative about our team I may well be but it's most definitely not without its reasons as shown tonight. However it doesn't mean I don't care because I do, mightily and quite clearly far more than some of those players. They should be ashamed to step foot on the pitch and I hope to God they get roundly booed up and down the country when the premier league kicks off.

Tonight showed that a good tactical manager who is passionate about his job, combined with a set of XI players who work hard, know what to do and love playing for their country will outweigh talent and big club players.

Best thing that could happen for our national team at the moment is to say Premier League players can't be picked....I think we'd have more success without them.

Southgate has been cut from 8/1 to 15/8 - so that looks a done deal then!

Hoddle maybe? He didn't lose the England job due to bad results. He might be a decent choice for now until the next world cup.

People saying that Howe wouldn't want to blow his reputation. What's so great about his reputation now and doesn't the England job pay millions? Wouldn't that soothe the hurt of losing his great reputation? I wouldn't pick him myself.

Ian Wright saying that we don't want a foreign manager is a disgusting comment.

Duty281 wrote:Southgate has been cut from 8/1 to 15/8 - so that looks a done deal then!

If Gareth Southgate is appointed as England manager I am never ever watching them again

Southgate would be a depressing hire, he already blew 1996 for us & Euro 2015, with the U-21's.

Dear God. The whole country has lost its nut. Southgate?! Why not make him pm while we're at it.

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:

Duty281 wrote:Southgate has been cut from 8/1 to 15/8 - so that looks a done deal then!

If Gareth Southgate is appointed as England manager I am never ever watching them again

I would rather chug a bag of thumbtacks then see England under Southgate.

Get a foreign manager it's clear we don't have the english talent managerially wise that's ready to take on the job.

Good Golly I'm Olly wrote:

Duty281 wrote:Southgate has been cut from 8/1 to 15/8 - so that looks a done deal then!

If Gareth Southgate is appointed as England manager I am never ever watching them again

Um...6/4 now. 5/4 on BetVictor.

It's happening. Sorry.

Nothing wrong with not wanting a foreign manager. I'm not against it, but I understand why you wouldn't. You don't pick foreign players so why are you allowed a foreign manager? It's an interesting point about international sport.

Southgate 6/4 with Paddy. I dunno, he's intelligent but is he gonna be bold? Use the first friendly to look at players who deserve some eyes on them. Play Stones every game now, pick Noble, try Antonio, play Vardy, give Barkley the chance.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uc6jd9P1X6w

Just listen to the pleasant music. Don't think about Gareth Southgate.

You've got the music in you
Don't let go
You've got the music in you
One dance left
This world is gonna pull through
Don't give up
You've got a reason to live
Can't forget
We only get what we give

https://www.skybet.com/football/manager-specials/event/16964117

Alan Shearer is second favourite with SkyBet.

There's always someone worse!

Go get Pellegrini please

I think what is even worse than the whole dire campaign is the fact that no one is shocked by it. The fact Hodgson kept the job after the world cup shows the FA don't have a clue. He was so obviously out of his depth.

That said, I don't think it's all Hodgson's fault. It's true that squad selection was dodgy. It's true that Hodgson didn't seem to have a tactical approach at all. It's also true that the preparation was appalling, with Hodgson having no idea of his best team by the time of the tournament. However, the players were simply inept. While some squad changes might have improved things, it wouldn't fundamentally change the fact that English players simply lack tactical and technical ability. They are only capable of running hard up and down the pitch. When you look at the premier league, how many teams have an English playmaker? Which English players are capable of genuinely dictating games? When English players come to international tournaments, they're screwed because they have no longer have a Spaniard alongside them to actually play the football.

Dolphin Ziggler wrote:Nothing wrong with not wanting a foreign manager. I'm not against it, but I understand why you wouldn't. You don't pick foreign players so why are you allowed a foreign manager? It's an interesting point about international sport.

Southgate 6/4 with Paddy. I dunno, he's intelligent but is he gonna be bold? Use the first friendly to look at players who deserve some eyes on them. Play Stones every game now, pick Noble, try Antonio, play Vardy, give Barkley the chance.

OK, then let's say we don't want a foreign manager. Who do we get that's got any experience with winning anything? As far as I know, no English manager has won the Premier League and the last English manager to win the FA Cup was Harry Redknapp back in 2008.

Hire an English manager then, but don't complain about tactical unawareness when we get beat.

All I said was there is nothing wrong with it. I'm personally not against it, but I just find it genuinely interesting that you're allowed to in sport.

Frankly Forest have had about 5 different managers be 1/5 on to take the job. At this stage the bookies are guessing and following the money. Southgate is the obvious in house replacement, doubt the FA have even made up their minds if they want to keep it in house.

England need a culture change. One plus of Allardyce is he could change that.

Ive seen many an England(yes including the 0-5 drubbing against Germany) and I've never seen such a pathetic England display as yesterday.

Hodgson is a weak manager and is blinded by the past reputations of many of his overrated players. Case in point is Rooney. He's a striker not a midfielder. His passing range is good enough to ever play as a playmaker.

Why on Earth did England select Wilshere and Henderson when both where clearly unfit? Look at Germany we left out Reus as he wasn't fit enough. Manager has to have a backbone...

The English premier league clearly isn't 'the best league in the world' pretty much all the best players are foreign eg not happy the English national team.

Why Vardy didn't start last night is another mystery. Kane had been embarrassing all tournament and Vardy, for my money, he's a very special player.

A bit of perspective is needed, Iceland may be a small nation but they beat Holland home and away, turkey, c republic in qualifying then made it through a very tough group.

Was always going to be a tough game and they were looked past.

Tournament ratings

Hart - 0 out of 10. Never liked the smug git. Embarrasing on the pitch & off it, by claiming 'nobody wants to play us'. Butland taking over.....Yes Please.

Kyle Walker 5 out of 10. Great going forward, some people & the media started creaming their pants over his performances, shame that we all knew as soon as he had to defend, we knew it would end in tears. Should hang his head in shame at that first goal.

Danny Rose 4 out of 10. Didn't really do much of anything

Gary Cahill 4 out of 10. Had nothing to do, but when he did, he failed to stop Iceland's striker getting the shot off. He & Jagielka got taught a lesson by Suarez, now it's happened again. John Stones to replace him

Chris Smalling 5 out of 10 - Failed to stop the second goal, but definitely should remains key player going forward, alongside John Stones

Raheem Sterling -100 out of 10. No technical ability, can't run properly, can't pass properly, can't cross property & can't shoot properly. Bewildering selection. Just an awful football player.

Adam Lallana - 7 out of 10. Can't hit a barn door & couldn't finish his dinner, but probably our best midfielder. Says everything about the rest.

Dele Alli 1 out of 10. The Dele Alli of Tottenham must have been kidnapped, because this Dele Alli had an absolute mare. Totally anonymous

Eric Dier 6 out of 10. Great freekick & some decent performances. Definite key player for England going forward.

Wayne Rooney 5 out of 10. Was made to look like Andrea Pirlo throughout the group stage, as the opposition couldn't be bothered to mark him. As the standard of opposition went slightly up, Wayne was exposed in midfield. That second half performance was utterly embarrassing, he simply failed to pass to a white shirt for 40 minutes. He literally offered nothing more, than what Gareth Barry could do. Definitely being sent into retirement, if he stays for WC qualifiers & keeps banging penalties against minnows, I will be fuming.

Harry Kane -200 out of 10. Quite frankly shocking all so many levels. Had an absolute mare of biblical proportions right from day 1. I literally have no idea what happened to Kane, it was like he was paid to fix the games & make sure he never had a shot on target. As for the corners & free-kicks......F*** me!

Jamie Vardy 6 out of 10. Great effort, injected good pace & scored a goal vs Wales. Probably should of scored vs Slovakia. Interesting future for him, is he a starter or an impact man?

Jack Wilshere 1 out of 10. Why on earth was this joke selected? Astonishing

James Milner 0 out of 10. Please retire & focus on Liverpool

Jordan Henderson 2 out of 10. Offers very little

Roy 'the clown' Hodgson -1,000,000 out of 10. Pathetic little weasel, who's got no management skills whatsoever & who was tactically inept. He's an absolute dinosaur, who is so out of touch with the modern game, it is actually scary. Three tournament wasted, had two years to plan this, but instead we turned up with no plan, no tactics or a settled side. Thank f*** he's resigned. How on earth he was being paid £3.5m a year, it's beyond sickening.

At least I can concentrate on just being disappointed by the one football team now