Ireland 6 Nations chat

First topic message reminder :

Geoff on the Ulster thread created a clever analysis on squad depth and I am taking a crack at a similar one for Ireland in advance of the 6 nations:

My assumptions are based on a squad of 36 (not the 40 Joe named last year). Players categories into 4 ratings:

World class = top three in position in world, and/or Lions test starter
International class = would make the team for other tier 1 nations
Below international class - would not make the team for other tier 1 nations
Exciting prospect - show potential to be a real asset

Ideally we have one world class and 2 international class per position.

TH (3)
World class - Furlong
International class - Ryan
Exciting prospect - Porter

Assessment - Drop off after Furlong, but not as steep as with hooker

Hooker (3)
International class - Best, Cronin (instead of Tracy)
Below international class - Herring

Assessment - Our weakest forward position, with a big drop off after Best

LH (3)
World class - McGrath (Lions bench for all three tests, scrapes in here)
International class - Healy, Kilcoyne

Assessment - Most consistently strong position in front row, all three are great players and Healy may well rereach his world class heights in 2018. Add in Moore and its a great position for us

Lock (5)
International class - Henderson, Toner
Below international class - Dillane, Roux (instead of Treadwell)
Exciting prospect - Ryan

Assessment - good first team pair, with some exciting prospects coming through.

Flankers (6)
World class - POM
International class - VDF, Murphy (Instead of TOD, Ruddock and SOB out due to injury)
Exciting prospect - Leavy

Assessment - embarrasment of riches!

No. 8 (2)
International class - Stander, Conan
Assessment - Very strong, with multiple flankers also able to play there

Scrumhalf (3)
World class - Murray
Below international class - Marmion, McGrath

Assessment - big drop off after Murray. Marmion/McGrath neither have been able to fully translate provincial form to ireland

Flyhalf (3)
World class - Sexton
Below international class - Keatley
Exciting prospect - Carberry

Assessment - Sexton staying fit is essential to winning in Twickenham, the drop off after that is huge.

Centers (5)
International class - Henshaw, Aki,
Below international class -  Farrell
Exciting prospect -Scannell (Instead of Ringrose and McCloskey)

Assessment - strong, if not the most exciting group of players.

Wings (5)
International class - Earls
Below international class - Conway, McFadden (Instead of Byrne, Sweetnam)
Exciting prospect - Stockdale

Assessment - some exciting young players coming through, but think Earls will start

Fullback (2)
International class - Kearney
Exciting prospect - Larmour

Assessment - Kearney continues to show his class in the big games and will start 3/4 of the 6 nations, I think Larmour has a good shot of starting the others. TOH if not.

The ball carrier can.

Way round having to refine the law then. Ignore the transgression.

Well the laws are clear on the maul.
It is illigal to collapse a maul.
It is legal for the player with the ball to attempt to make it to the ground.
If the ball is available after the maul has gone to ground then play shall continue.
Now the ref has to decide why the maul went to ground, who was responsible and if the ball is playable.

Simple really

It is legal for a defender to tackle the ball carrier, if he had legally come through the maul. No difference in a choke tackle created maul as the tackler is legally tackling the ball carrier within the maul.

Possible Ireland team v Italy: R Kearney; K Earls, R Henshaw, B Aki, J Stockdale; J Sexton, C Murray; J McGrath, R Best (capt), T Furlong; I Henderson, D Toner; P O'Mahony, D Leavy, J Conan. Replacements: S Cronin/R Herring, C Healy, A Porter, Q Roux, CJ Stander, K Marmion, J Carbery, J Larmour.

The above team being touted in the Independent.

If true, despite being an relatively inexperienced back row it doesn't weaken the side appreciably and still shows respect to the Italians.

Would have liked to see Larmour on from the start.

Ryan has an injury apparently, anybody know what?

Heard Ryan has a groin strain

Looks like Schmidt will be making minimal changes during this 6N.

I thought, Earls apart, the back 3 didn't really function against France so would have liked to have seen changes there.

The midfield wasn't great either but obviously Schmidt sees that as his midfield going forward with Ringrose in the mix.

Ryan really impressed me against France, it's a shame he is out.

Conan will give us a bit more pace in the back row. POM's lack of pace and carrying is an issue with O'Brien out, the balance with VDF at 7 didn't work for me against France.

So Kearney does his thing and is mature and a team leader etc etc.   But Schmidt is really missing an edge when he continues to pick Kearney (even for Italy!) instead of letting Carbery have a crack.
The logic begins to disintegrate - if a player like Carbery isn't good enough to be let at Italy, if we're going to toy with Italy again in the middle of the park with endless phase play 'to tire them out' then yes, it's going to be a very tough championship of getting our few scores and clinging to them for dear life... ie. same as usual. Because again, it seems Schmidt doesn't want to change tactics even for Italy.

Kearney isn't going to be around forever and finally, one day, one of the younger players are going to be put in there.  Now let's say it's Carbery; if he's given licence to play 15 the way he wants to play it then Ireland, style wise, will become a very different beast.  So why not give every opportunity for the younger players, that will eventually be feeding in anyway, to play ball?  I mean it's Italy.  Is Carbery unworthy of Italy?

Schmidt is being too cautious again and if he doesn't start feeding in this newer generation earlier (and together) into these big Six Nations games we'll be caught again with our pants down when WC comes around.  We'll be exposed somewhere and we'll all head off into the sunset sadly dreaming about the next shower of young things in the pipeline who might improve our chances NEXT time round. The cycle will go on and on.

Too much caution from Joe.

rodders wrote:Looks like Schmidt will be making minimal changes during this 6N.

I thought, Earls apart, the back 3 didn't really function against France so would have liked to have seen changes there.

The midfield wasn't great either but obviously Schmidt sees that as his midfield going forward with Ringrose in the mix.

Ryan really impressed me against France, it's a shame he is out.

Conan will give us a bit more pace in the back row. POM's lack of pace and carrying is an issue with O'Brien out, the balance with VDF at 7 didn't work for me against France.

I felt that was down to the tactics and midfield, the ball just wasn't going wide enough to bring them into the game.

I have no idea how you can question Stockdale - he went looking for the ball a lot in the 1st half.
Bottom line is the game plan and the conditions means the wings were only ever going to get scraps.
To drop him after that would have been idiotic

Cronin on the bench as Herring released to Ulster

Team announced. McGrath, Toner, Leavy, Conan to start. Carbery and Larmour on the bench.

geoff999rugby wrote:I have no idea how you can question Stockdale - he went looking for the ball a lot in the 1st half.
Bottom line is the game plan and the conditions means the wings were only ever going to get scraps.
To drop him after that would have been idiotic

Cronin on the bench as Herring released to Ulster

Actually I was suggesting dropping Kearney, was just being diplomatic about it

I think the last 20-30 mins of the game will be great when that bench unloads

I'd prefer Joe to sometimes mix up that schedule and put a side on from the start with the potential to do a 'last 20-30 minutes' in the first 20-30 minutes.

It's fine to throw on the light weight (in experience terms) and fast buckos to mop up the remains of an Italian side beaten up physically in the first half.  But I always say, it's the beating up/tiring out process that also has a toll on our own important players.  
Against a side like Italy, I think we give them too much respect to say we have to play them exactly as we play all the other sides.  So why not the exuberance of pompous youth first to collect some wonderful, less attritional-style tries and then let the main older guys come on with 20 minutes to go to defend what we've gained but with a lot less effort against those tiring Italian bodies.
I think this kind of arrangement would save our first choice players for the considerably tougher assignments down the line.

Full team for Ireland on Saturday.

01 : McGrath
02 : Best
03 : Furlong
04 : Toner,
05 : Henderson
06 : O'Mahony
07 : Leavy
08 : Conan.
09 : Murray
10 : Sexton
11 : Stockdale
12 : Aki
13 : Henshaw
14 : Earls
15 : Kearney

Replacements : Healy, Cronin, Porter, Roux, Stander, Marmion, Carbery, Larmour.

Quite surprised to be honest, I would have thought Sexton and/or Murray may have been rested. I am not begrudging Conan getting the start, he has been in some good form. Toner seems to be in now simply to gain some line out domination.

Would have been nice to see Larmour be actually given a start but I feel he will be given a chance in the second half as the game should open up. I would have liked to see Cooney given a spot on the bench as well.

Schmidt on why Conan starts ahead of Stander :

“Which, while not attritional for CJ, he’s in great shape… it’s really probably rewarding some performances by Jack Conan in recent times as well.”

“And it’s also that opportunity to try to keep a freshness.”

“These Six Nations games, they do become, if nothing else- mentally attritional.”

“By the time we got back from Paris on Sunday evening, you had some fairly sore, tired bodies. And it’s just an opportunity to freshen the side up a little bit.”

If this is the case (as stated above, I feel Conan deserves a shot) why not look at Sexton or Murray for a break? These are both very much needed players against the better sides.

He don't trust Italy to be as bad as they are...so continuity and his two trump cards (Murray and Sexton) are dropped in again.  Which means that, barring injury, these two players will now more than likely play in all the 6N games.
Apart from that being risky, it means that if the alternatives had to come on in bigger games, that's a cold start........... against Wales, Scotland and England!

ps. I don't consider these last 20 minute run outs as a fair test/challenge/opportunity for the benchers. Larmour against an Italy falling away from fatigue is not and won't be any hint of how he might do as a starter against the three sides I mentioned above.

I do not think that it is a bad side to play Italy but Italy is a side that seem to play a more unstructured game and opposition players tend to get injured a lot more playing them as a result.

I am not saying that other players should be sent out as cannon fodder.

I just think it would have been nice to have started a few (would love to see Byrne given a shot at 10 for Ireland) players to give them experience and as SecretFly said, ensure that they are not 'cold' going into a big match if one of the senior players gets injured.

Ireland need a full strength team to see if they can start scoring tries.

"Would have been nice to see Larmour be actually given a start but I feel he will be given a chance in the second half as the game should open up. I would have liked to see Cooney given a spot on the bench as well."

Billy are you trying to lose this bet??

Scottrf wrote:Ireland need a full strength team to see if they can start scoring tries.

Ya bollix

Pete330v2 wrote:"Would have been nice to see Larmour be actually given a start but I feel he will be given a chance in the second half as the game should open up. I would have liked to see Cooney given a spot on the bench as well."

Billy are you trying to lose this bet??

Jaysus, it would appear so

Think he would fit into the side well and is deserved of a shot. Maybe he should go to Leinster to further his Ireland ambitions

Scottrf wrote:Ireland need a full strength team to see if they can start scoring tries.

"Yeah...right lads *yawn*.............. so we've had the easy game away to France. And thank God we didn't have to show the opposition what we're going to be doing later in the championship. We got away without scoring any tries. Now........ the English were saying this kid Simmons was sensational against Italy, so Italy must be one of the really tough sides this year.
If we can win again without scoring tries that would be a bonus of course but if yis have to score some then let's decide now how many. I think 9 has a nice ring to it....but ONLY if you have to."

I don't think that backline really got a chance to do anything of substance last week so perhaps both for continuity and to get things clicking a little better, there are less changes than we'd expected. Don't forget also that Italy are hard enough to break down so a first half softening up before sending on the young guns. Larmour would devour the Italians if the game broke up in the second half.

eirebilly wrote:

Pete330v2 wrote:"Would have been nice to see Larmour be actually given a start but I feel he will be given a chance in the second half as the game should open up. I would have liked to see Cooney given a spot on the bench as well."

Billy are you trying to lose this bet??

Jaysus, it would appear so

Think he would fit into the side well and is deserved of a shot. Maybe he should go to Leinster to further his Ireland ambitions

Well it is the Natural home of winners...

Pete330v2 wrote:I don't think that backline really got a chance to do anything of substance last week so perhaps both for continuity and to get things clicking a little better, there are less changes than we'd expected. Don't forget also that Italy are hard enough to break down so a first half softening up before sending on the young guns. Larmour would devour the Italians if the game broke up in the second half.

So the guys who couldn't make themselves look good against a real Six Nations heavyweight team in Paris, are to be given a second crack at looking good against Italy?

Hmmmm....something doesn't seem fair in that equation.

eirebilly wrote:

Pete330v2 wrote:"Would have been nice to see Larmour be actually given a start but I feel he will be given a chance in the second half as the game should open up. I would have liked to see Cooney given a spot on the bench as well."

Billy are you trying to lose this bet??

Jaysus, it would appear so

Think he would fit into the side well and is deserved of a shot. Maybe he should go to Leinster to further his Ireland ambitions

Well they could lay claim to him I suppose but that would be reason enough to completely close the border and dig a trench.
Next year will be his year, I didn't think Joe would have picked him even if Ulster could have done without him. He's not a part of Joe's plans just yet, his structures and his formula......although how does that explain Larmour and Carberry suddenly parachuting into the matchday squad let alone the training squad?

SecretFly wrote:

Pete330v2 wrote:I don't think that backline really got a chance to do anything of substance last week so perhaps both for continuity and to get things clicking a little better, there are less changes than we'd expected. Don't forget also that Italy are hard enough to break down so a first half softening up before sending on the young guns. Larmour would devour the Italians if the game broke up in the second half.

 So the guys who couldn't make themselves look good against a real Six Nations heavyweight team in Paris, are to be given a second crack at looking good against Italy?

Hmmmm....something doesn't seem fair in that equation.

Well yes

Pete330v2 wrote:

eirebilly wrote:

Pete330v2 wrote:"Would have been nice to see Larmour be actually given a start but I feel he will be given a chance in the second half as the game should open up. I would have liked to see Cooney given a spot on the bench as well."

Billy are you trying to lose this bet??

Jaysus, it would appear so

Think he would fit into the side well and is deserved of a shot. Maybe he should go to Leinster to further his Ireland ambitions

Well they could lay claim to him I suppose but that would be reason enough to completely close the border and dig a trench.
Next year will be his year, I didn't think Joe would have picked him even if Ulster could have done without him. He's not a part of Joe's plans just yet, his structures and his formula......although how does that explain Larmour and Carberry suddenly parachuting into the matchday squad let alone the training squad?

I have no idea. Carbery appears to be back up 10 although Byrne is playing there for Leinster more than he is so you could question he is being selected out of position...

Just on a completely different topic for a sec.  I was looking at the schedules for the 6N and I only now see that France and Italy have a Friday game on the third week I think?

Personally speaking, I wish the Six Nations would do away with Sunday games and have those 'sunday' games all on Friday.  The night time festival feel is much more marketable than those bloody Sunday games that always look an afterthought to the 'main event'.  And I've always liked dropping into my recliner on Friday nights, usually a wonderful entertaining prelude to the next 'main' day.

No Cooney? - He's only a year younger than Murray with Marmion and McGrath two and three years younger respectively. He wasn't able to displace Marmion at Connacht, and though now playing the best rugby of his career isn't noticeably superior. Marmion offers a different tempo and McGrath has the benefit of familiarity. Barring injury Murray, Marmion and McGrath will be the three Scrum Halfs to be selected for the RWC so Joe needs to give them the experience.

Oh and Cooney's surname doesn't begin with an 'M' - it's a Joe thing, where the pivot should have a surname roughly in the middle of the alphabet.

Sexton again? - If Joe is trying to progress and develop Ireland's strategy, and it didn't happen against France then the most obvious tactic is to try again. Practice, practice, practice. As a player Johnny is probably bursting to play against Italy, so why should Joe deny him that and only field him in the really tough Tests? Hardly fair on his most influential player. Neither would it be fair on Byrne to shoulder the responsibility of delivering a win and the pressure to set up tries with Murray whom he has had no partnership with. Through familiarity comes understanding, and flowing rugby will (eventually) ensue.

For me the pecking order is Sexton, Carbery, Keatley and then Byrne.

I agree with Guns.

On Scrum Half I think there is very little difference between McGrath, Marmion and Cooney but two points
1 - he can play 10 (he will cover 10 tonight) and can kick (he will kick tonight) - the others cant.
That makes him useful for the bench
2 - McGrath gets a easier ride behind the Leinster pack - it is always easier looking good behind a dominant pack.
It takes something special looking good behind a backrow of Ross, Deysel and a raw youngster

I was actually a bit disappointed with Murray in Paris. I think his passing needs to be better and it would help Ireland in attack if it was quicker. I think his pass is still a fraction too slow which helps defenses stop us getting over the gain line. To be fair to him he offers a lot in other parts of his game but if he could improve the pass he would be unplayable.

I don't think it was his best game and I feel he shares the blame for the Thomas try as he rushed up and missed his tackle on Dupont which fractured our defense. Only shares the blame though as there was other bad defending from Kearney and to a lesser extent Stockdale and Aki.

I see that fantastic coach, Bernard Jackman is trying to keep our spirits up as a Nation by servicing the myth that we only play the very blunt structured game that we play because, unlike other sides, we don't have the players to create something from nothing.



This is an ex-Leinster player and a current coach speaking? If that's what he thinks of the calibre of players in Ireland then he was right to choose France and Wales for his coaching career so far. If that's all he can string together from watching Ireland play blunt direct coached tactics, that pin down virtually all our creative players by mandatory process, not by natural talent, then I wonder how this man can be a coach at all.

I'm tired over the years of hearing about how Irish players aren't good enough to match Welsh players or English players or even now, I assume, Scottish players. Our teams have dominated contests 'domestically' and at European level, often playing a brand of rugby that is adventurous and explosive, viciously physical and smoothly beautiful - we have bloody evidence that we have players that very much can create something from nothing.
It's our tactics, Bernard *tapping that bald skull for a signal*...not our skill levels.

SecretFly wrote:I see that fantastic coach, Bernard Jackman is trying to keep our spirits up as a Nation by servicing the myth that we only play the very blunt structured game that we play because, unlike other sides, we don't have the players to create something from nothing.



This is an ex-Leinster player and a current coach speaking?  If that's what he thinks of the calibre of players in Ireland then he was right to choose  France and Wales for his coaching career so far.  If that's all he can string together from watching Ireland play blunt direct coached tactics, that pin down virtually all our creative players by mandatory process, not by natural talent, then I wonder how this man can be a coach at all.

I'm tired over the years of hearing about how Irish players aren't good enough to match Welsh players or English players or even now, I assume, Scottish players.  Our teams have dominated contests 'domestically' and at European level, often playing a brand of rugby that is adventurous and explosive, viciously physical and smoothly beautiful - we have bloody evidence that we have players that very much can create something from nothing.  
It's our tactics, Bernard  *tapping that bald skull for a signal*...not our skill levels.  

He's right though, we don't have the athletes or skill levels that some of the other countries do.

Our strengths are fitness, workrate and ability under the high ball - to this we've added a really solid set piece and we have arguably the 2 best half backs in the NH. The reason we have been so successful recently is we are playing to those strengths.

We put far too much emphasis on our provincial performances, where the standard of rugby is generally far lower and there is much more space.

I actually would like to see us kick a lot more, we seem far too determined to go through phases these days and only seem to kick as part of our exit strategy. If you look at that last few minutes against France, the key plays were the cross field kick to Earls and the restart to Henderson.

I think against Italy we'll create a lot more but once we get down to Twickenham it will be back to the attrition approach.

100% agree Rodders. You play to your strengths.

So Ireland do not have the athletes or skill levels that some of the other countries do rodders? Zebo, Sexton, Earls, Stockdale, Gilroy, TOH, Larmour (untried but buckets of potential), Carbery etc. do not posses the skill levels of players from other countries?

I think that is being a bit harsh on them to be fair.

eirebilly wrote:So Ireland do not have the athletes or skill levels that some of the other countries do rodders? Zebo, Sexton, Earls, Stockdale, Gilroy, TOH, Larmour (untried but buckets of potential), Carbery etc. do not posses the skill levels of players from other countries?

I think that is being a bit harsh on them to be fair.

Plus guys like Healy and Bowe have had with plenty of ability about them plus BOD, Henshaw, Marshall, Fitzgerald, Jones but Joe has stuck to a more rigid style

That's it settled then. Bernard Jackman as head coach after Joe exits! Bernard will keep the show on the road.... bang, bang, bang, bang.... coz it's all we can do, like...............................

marty2086 wrote:

eirebilly wrote:So Ireland do not have the athletes or skill levels that some of the other countries do rodders? Zebo, Sexton, Earls, Stockdale, Gilroy, TOH, Larmour (untried but buckets of potential), Carbery etc. do not posses the skill levels of players from other countries?

I think that is being a bit harsh on them to be fair.

Plus guys like Healy and Bowe have had with plenty of ability about them plus BOD, Henshaw, Marshall, Fitzgerald, Jones but Joe has stuck to a more rigid style

yeah...and Cronin ain't exactly a regular hooker either - gets a moment and zoom he's off too.

eirebilly wrote:So Ireland do not have the athletes or skill levels that some of the other countries do rodders? Zebo, Sexton, Earls, Stockdale, Gilroy, TOH, Larmour (untried but buckets of potential), Carbery etc. do not posses the skill levels of players from other countries?

I think that is being a bit harsh on them to be fair.

I think I'm being kind Billy, some of those fellas are bums .

SecretFly wrote:I see that fantastic coach, Bernard Jackman is trying to keep our spirits up as a Nation by servicing the myth that we only play the very blunt structured game that we play because, unlike other sides, we don't have the players to create something from nothing.



This is an ex-Leinster player and a current coach speaking?  If that's what he thinks of the calibre of players in Ireland then he was right to choose  France and Wales for his coaching career so far.  If that's all he can string together from watching Ireland play blunt direct coached tactics, that pin down virtually all our creative players by mandatory process, not by natural talent, then I wonder how this man can be a coach at all.

I'm tired over the years of hearing about how Irish players aren't good enough to match Welsh players or English players or even now, I assume, Scottish players.  Our teams have dominated contests 'domestically' and at European level, often playing a brand of rugby that is adventurous and explosive, viciously physical and smoothly beautiful - we have bloody evidence that we have players that very much can create something from nothing.  
It's our tactics, Bernard  *tapping that bald skull for a signal*...not our skill levels.  

Its a bollox article from Jackman on many levels. We heard the same bolloxology a few years ago about not being able to produce props.

1. He is plainly wrong about not having the athletes. In fact Schmidt has basically playing a highly physical, attritional gameplan that cannot work without having good athletes!!!
2. Its clear he is just defending Schmidt.
3. The way Schmidt plays is the opposite to how BJ's teams play. So BJ thinks the Dragons have the athletes but Ireland don't.
4. I have read a few quotes from BJ this season where is says his Dragons team isn't good enough and they need more players over the summer. Nice way to motivate your team!
5. And probably the most important point. You don't need Freak athletes to play good quality rugby. Look at the ABs pack, are they all freak athletes? I don't think so.

I think saying we don't have the skill level of others is Love sacks

NZ are on a higher level for a number of reasons but not necessary more skill
its fitness, attitude and organization that work for them.
Skill is important to them but it is their superiority in those other attributes that give them the edge

Saffers, England, Wales or indeed Australia - nonsense

The way I see it is we do have plenty of good players but Schmidt/the IRFU looked at our playing population as a whole and what we are trying to achieve in the long term, coupled that with law variations and trends in the game and came up with a game plan that not only suits our strengths, its good enough to maintain a consistently high ranking, contend in the six nations and as I see it its quite a good style for knock out rugby.

All that said, yes there are really good players that don't really fit with the plan but to that I would say....TOUGH

Collapse2005 wrote:

All that said, yes there are really good players that don't really fit with the plan but to that I would say....TOUGH

That's a whole different argument though and not the one Jackman was using. Plus, I'd say it's many of the really good players (that don't really fit with the plan) that are right now either playing or training to play that plan.
If Larmour comes on in the second half against Italy and lights up the day with two scintillating quick-fire tries - IS THAT going to be the same Larmour that turns up for perhaps the Welsh, Scottish or English game? Or will his role in those more 'attritional' games be modified to suit the plan? Because that is what has been happening with the plan. Players that look so promising playing an anti-plan version of rugby are drafted in to be schooled in how to adapt their more creative influences to the plan. And when all creative players in the team are schooled to follow a rigid and bland plan, then there is no real opening for the special moments of individual brilliance.

You might be right fly but I doubt Jackman really means we don't have good players here.

Its like what Rog once famously said "people think the English players are better than the Irish players. I don't believe that for a minute."

Neither do I.

I don't care what plan is in place as long as its successful. It isn't about individuals whatever plan it is. I'm glad Schmidt has the nads to do what he wants and not what Paddy down the pub wants.

Collapse2005 wrote:You might be right fly but I doubt Jackman really means we don't have good players here.

Its like what Rog once famously said "people think the English players are better than the Irish players. I don't believe that for a minute."

Neither do I.

I don't care what plan is in place as long as its successful. It isn't about individuals whatever plan it is. I'm glad Schmidt has the nads to do what he wants and not what Paddy down the pub wants.

Well I'd agree with most of that.  Joe Schmidt has his plan and he's made inroads with it, and he has us hovering around the 3rd ranked side in the world for a while and even up to 2nd for a period.  If players want to play International under him then he's the boss.  I'd fully agree with that.

But from what I read.... Jackman was saying we don't have the class of players to play that more opportunistic, freeform, instinctive brand of rugby.  That was my criticism of him - that he has the nerve to say that and call himself a coach, knowing the calibre of players  in Ireland and knowing only too well that Joe Schmidt's plans require creative players to rein in their 'game changer' instincts.