The Wales vs England bickering thread, 2012 - PONIES ALLOWED!

[TycroesOsprey]

First topic message reminder :

OK, every year we see threads that actually contain really good rugby discussion derailed by the ongoing Wales vs England bickering and WUMMING! I will name no names. I guess we have all been guilty .

Since most of the general bickering comes from the respective fans of Wales and England ; I thought I would create a thread for it in an effort to keep decent rugby discussion relatively WUM free in other threads.

So I will begin, An article in the Western Mail today pointed out how England are copying Gatlands youthful approach with a squad that has an average age of 25 and 428 caps between them.

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/rugbynation/rugby-news/2012/01/12/analysis-new-look-england-follow-youthful-wales-lead-91466-30105333/

Wales probable squad (once you have taken out Shane and Wellies from the World cup squad with their probable replacements) lines up at the same average age and about 820 caps between them. England are copying Wales' approcach but are way behind. Clearly all things point to a wales victory in HQ this year.

Discuss

post script

Please may I emphasise that this is a bickering and banter thread, whilst mild wumming and banter are allowed please try not to stray over the line of decency.

[Shifty]

Although, everyone in Wales expected England to demand the roof be open for last year's match. However, England agreed to have it closed much to every Welshman's surprise and they never recovered. Cauldron of hate, it was not.

26-19, thank you and goodnight.

Why is it every post you make is one to provoke people? You add nothing constructive to any rugby discussion.

[Cadair Idris]

Although, everyone in Wales expected England to demand the roof be open for last year's match. However, England agreed to have it closed much to every Welshman's surprise and they never recovered. Cauldron of hate, it was not.

26-19, thank you and goodnight.

Are you sure about that? I could have sworn Johnson insisted on it being open, saying it's an outdoor game etc. Maybe I'm thinking about 2009. Anyway, I was there and I do remember it was not a great atmosphere, not helped by being on a friday evening and us going 10 points down in the first 10 minutes...

Revenge at twickers will be sweet...

[mystiroakey]

Although, everyone in Wales expected England to demand the roof be open for last year's match. However, England agreed to have it closed much to every Welshman's surprise and they never recovered. Cauldron of hate, it was not.

26-19, thank you and goodnight.

Why is it every post you make is one to provoke people? You add nothing constructive to any rugby discussion.

to be fair it is the point of this thread- it is the rest of us that have gone of topic!!

[EnglishReign]

Although, everyone in Wales expected England to demand the roof be open for last year's match. However, England agreed to have it closed much to every Welshman's surprise and they never recovered. Cauldron of hate, it was not.

26-19, thank you and goodnight.

Why is it every post you make is one to provoke people? You add nothing constructive to any rugby discussion.

Are you joking? I'm only having a laugh and I think you'd be hard pushed to find another provocative post of mine...I'm actually offended!

[mystiroakey]

losing hurts them bad reign- they bite like yappy dogs, mentioning england winning is very politically incorrect to the welsh. you would get a better reception if you cussed a black, handicapped, mute girl

[Morgannwg]

Alyn was incorrect earlier, saying if we beat England it is by 1 or 2 points. If memory serves me well, we beat you by 10 points on the last encounter and you had all the flipping posession and territory!

[EnglishReign]

Although, everyone in Wales expected England to demand the roof be open for last year's match. However, England agreed to have it closed much to every Welshman's surprise and they never recovered. Cauldron of hate, it was not.

26-19, thank you and goodnight.

Are you sure about that? I could have sworn Johnson insisted on it being open, saying it's an outdoor game etc. Maybe I'm thinking about 2009. Anyway, I was there and I do remember it was not a great atmosphere, not helped by being on a friday evening and us going 10 points down in the first 10 minutes...

Revenge at twickers will be sweet...

You're correct, I'm pretty sure MJ did say it's an outdoor game and should be open, but a few days before the game he changed his mind. Some psychological tricks at work there!

[Guest]

Alyn was incorrect earlier, saying if we beat England it is by 1 or 2 points. If memory serves me well, we beat you by 10 points on the last encounter and you had all the flipping posession and territory!

It was a warm-up game. England went to Dublin after that and beat Ireland comfortably. It's not quite the same as a 6 Nations encounter!

[EnglishReign]

losing hurts them bad reign- they bite like yappy dogs, mentioning england winning is very politically incorrect to the welsh. you would get a better reception if you cussed a black, handicapped, mute girl

Well, I'm miles ahead of the lad in the 6n prediction leaderboard. So, irrespective of my apparent need to provoke and failure to add constructive comments, I clearly am more knowledgeable about rugby . Same goes for you Mysti.

[Morgannwg]

Winning in Dublin is overated anyway.

[Glas a du]

You had to be there.

[Shifty]

Anybody else think that Wales might be peaking too early anyway?

I see Wales now simiarly to Ireland in the last RWC cycle - a golden generation who fell just short of greatness.

They seem to have some fine finishers in the team at the moment, but as we know the impact of larger players tends to fade very quickly, speed is the first thing to go, injuries tend to plague these sorts of players which we may be witnessing already. Defenses get used to the one dimensional power game and can be countered simply by adding beef to the mid field.

Tight forward stocks are starting to age and there seems like not much depth to replace them looking at age group and A side results.

2015 is a long way off and whilst by contrast England are building a youthful side and dominating the development age group I worry that Wales might be left behind after a brief flirtation with success.

Interesting post, firstly Wales team is probably younger than Englands. The vast majority of the Welsh team are 24-25 or under. James Hook is only 26 still, the only player in the current Welsh squad who wont be at the next World Cup due to age is Stephen Jones, all the others should still be young enough.

Bevington whos 23, will replace Gethin Jenkins who is 31.
Bradley Davies is 25, Ian Evans is 27, Luke charteris is 28, Alun Wyn Jones is 26, I don;t really see any serious issues, apart from tight head prop but we will turn one up somewhere. Though I expect the bump and grind of the Aviva to toughen up Craig Mitchell anyway.

[Guest]

Wales did venture to France to join the rest of the teams once.

Try again.

[HERSH]

Is this still going on?

Come gentlemen lets have a day off and regroup before we scrum down for the big one.

I think the Welsh rugger shirts are lovely.

[miteyironpaw]

There's little point HERSH anyway, I've been convinced over the past three days that Wales are the best team on the planet by some distance. It's pointless any other team turning up. The IRB are set to scrub the rankings altogether and just declare Wales the only worthy team on the planet. All rugby will be cancelled and in it's place Sky and BBC will just broadcast homages to George North, Gethin Jenkins, Shane Williams and JPR Williams just to remind us how embarrassed we would be if they actually let another game of rugby go ahead.

[RubyGuby]

There's little point HERSH anyway, I've been convinced over the past three days that Wales are the best team on the planet by some distance. It's pointless any other team turning up. The IRB are set to scrub the rankings altogether and just declare Wales the only worthy team on the planet. All rugby will be cancelled and in it's place Sky and BBC will just broadcast homages to George North, Gethin Jenkins, Shane Williams and JPR Williams just to remind us how embarrassed we would be if they actually let another game of rugby go ahead.

I know where you are coming from Mitey but I still think we are behind New Zealand in the grand scheme - yes the world is turning as your post suggests but perhaps not at the pace your post alludes to

[HERSH]

For such a proud country it's a shame they have no Welsh coaches to take charge of their national team.

[miteyironpaw]

That also means, nothing further to discuss really.

Clearly the selection of the Wales team doesn't matter, because whomever their field will be too strong for us. And whomever we field won't be capable of anything more than humiliating defeat.

Discussion over really.

Oh well, I'm off for a coffee and maybe I'll start smoking to fill in time and bring the end of this futile life closer so that I may suffer only another 10 to 15 years of unbreakable Welsh rugby supremacy.

Bye all.

[HERSH]

The games off then.

I'd rather watch club rugby anyway.

[mckay1402]

For such a proud country it's a shame they have no Welsh coaches to take charge of their national team.

Having English coaches is working so well for you guys...

[Luckless Pedestrian]

And Sir Clive Woodward was born in Hafodyrynys.

[HERSH]

But it's sad you have to look to a Kiwi mercenary (who lets be honest wouldn't get any where near the NZ job) instead of developing home grown coaches.

Just look at Dai Young he was tipped to be the next Welsh coach, how low is his stock now?

[mckay1402]

We are developing home grown coaches and until we have the right one we're using someone with experience and expertise. seems a fairly logical approach to me

[Chunky Norwich]

Hersh, I couldn't give a toss if somebody from the Moon was Wales coach. As long as they progressed, played well and gave 100%.

[Guest]

For such a proud country it's a shame they have no Welsh coaches to take charge of their national team.

Having English coaches is working so well for you guys...

Current 6 Nations champions and unbeaten in this campaign. However, this is England though so we expect a bit more!

[HERSH]

We are developing home grown coaches and until we have the right one we're using someone with experience and expertise. seems a fairly logical approach to me

You'll have a long wait, how old is Gatland? He doesn't look the fittest of blokes!

[Glas a du]

See, that's your problem. Who cares how fit the coach is!

[HERSH]

Gareth Thomas does!

[Glas a du]

[munkian]

For such a proud country it's a shame they have no Welsh coaches to take charge of their national team.

For such a proud country its a shame England have no English players for their national team

[Glas a du]

Are England that proud a country? Seems most are embarrassed of Morris Dancing.

[Luckless Pedestrian]

No, they're ashamed of Dewi Morris dancing. When he hits the dancefloor, he's Welsh again.

[HERSH]

For such a proud country it's a shame they have no Welsh coaches to take charge of their national team.

For such a proud country its a shame England have no English players for their national team

Are you really sure you want to go down that path?

[Glas a du]

Oi but look at me dancing by 'ere.

[munkian]

[Luckless Pedestrian]

Oh look, Scott Quinnell's doing the caterpillar.

[HERSH]

We can't let this one dry up!

Has this Welsh team already peaked?

2015 is long way off.

[english warrior]

If this is a peak, i'd hate to see the troughs for this Welsh side!!


Actually, i'm lying, because i'd absolutely love to see the lows for any Welsh Rugby side and have been quite lucky in that regard over the last 20 or so years , but before this i had a lot of years where wales truly had a very good side, and didn't they let us all know about it.

[eirebilly]

I really dislike the fact that the Welsh are scoring tries with the correct ball, leaves me nothing to whinge about

[Cowshot]

I always rather enjoy it that it makes absolutely no difference at all to the Welsh supporters how good or bad their team actually is - they say exactly the same thing year on year.

Think they might be right about beating us this year, though. Will be very funny if they don't!

[HERSH]

so true cowshot

[miteyironpaw]

I'd get ready to laugh then. All I see is the same old same old mediocrity blown out of all proportion from Wales.

They think they were the stars of the RWC, but came fourth and lost in the pool.

Then the talk was about "revenge" for Australia beating them into 4th place. Apparently when the unbeatable captain Warburton was back, nobody stood a chance. Of course Australia won, despite the full time celebrations for Shane Williams scoring a try.

Why? Because Wales' best attacking player had retired.

They couldn't beat us last year, and frankly without their talisman and record scorer Williams, why would they have a chance now?

Engand regularly beat Australia now, by contrast we should be confident.

In reality we're in a different class.

Wales have hardly set the world alight in struggling past Scotland and Ireland with the help of the referee.

England still have players to come back who can make a huge impact.

All in all I can't see past a comfortable home win by at least two scores.

Players like Aston, Foden, Strettle, Tuilagi can't be quiet forever. With some good conditions we can get the machine moving again.

Swing low!

[HERSH]

Land of hope and glory
la la la la lala laaaa....

My confidence was wavering, but thanks to Mitey i can only see an England win.

[miteyironpaw]

Aside from which, they struggle to keep 15 men on the park these days. You get away with that against Ireland and Scotland, but as France and Australia have shown a good side will punish your indiscipline. Ashton and co. will be licking their lips at the thought of all that space to weave their magic.

[mystiroakey]

you give me hope! an all.

[miteyironpaw]

It's a talent, what can I say. It's exhausting though.

The good news is that once we despatch Wales, the only real threat will come from France. And let's face it, they rarely beat us in competitive matches and they've had their turn recently.

I feel a grandslam in the air.

[Woodstock]

Aside from which, they struggle to keep 15 men on the park these days. You get away with that against Ireland and Scotland, but as France and Australia have shown a good side will punish your indiscipline. Ashton and co. will be licking their lips at the thought of all that space to weave their magic.

Magic and England .... nah they just do not go together. Now Ashton & Co weaving that does make sense, they could get the North of England back to industrious ways with a few Mill's here and there. Good job we are not playing a good side in our next game then

[Biltong]

losing hurts them bad reign- they bite like yappy dogs, mentioning england winning is very politically incorrect to the welsh. you would get a better reception if you cussed a black, handicapped, mute girl

Well, I'm miles ahead of the lad in the 6n prediction leaderboard. So, irrespective of my apparent need to provoke and failure to add constructive comments, I clearly am more knowledgeable about rugby . Same goes for you Mysti.

Or just lucky.

[EnglishReign]

losing hurts them bad reign- they bite like yappy dogs, mentioning england winning is very politically incorrect to the welsh. you would get a better reception if you cussed a black, handicapped, mute girl

Well, I'm miles ahead of the lad in the 6n prediction leaderboard. So, irrespective of my apparent need to provoke and failure to add constructive comments, I clearly am more knowledgeable about rugby . Same goes for you Mysti.

Or just lucky.

Definitely just luck biltong, but I was accused of being provocative in a thread designed for nothing but wummery. Had to hit back somehow

[Morgannwg]

Beat Australia regulary? Do you not need to play them regulary for that? Delusion is rife and some ego's will be hitting reality next saturday.

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