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by **Ozzy3213** Thu 30 Aug 2012, 10:59 pm

First topic message reminder :

Leicester Tigers top table with 100% record after the first phase of league matches

Homepage - Page 13 Aviva-Premiership-Trophy-e1306508139154

2011/2012 – Newcastle Falcons
2010/2011 - Newcastle Falcons
2009/2010 - Saracens
2008/2009 - London Irish

POS	Aviva Premiership	PLAYED	WON	DREW	LOST	P F	P A	P D	T F	T A	TBP	LBP	POINTS
1	Leicester Tigers	6	6	0	0	153	118	+35	16	9	0	0	24
2	Newcastle Falcons	6	5	0	1	149	136	+13	14	12	0	1	21
3	Northampton Saints	6	4	0	2	161	143	+18	19	14	2	2	20
4	London Irish	6	4	0	2	162	145	+17	18	15	2	2	20
5	Harlequins	6	4	0	2	150	138	+12	16	14	1	2	19
6	Sale Sharks	6	3	0	3	151	143	+8	16	14	1	3	16
7	Gloucester	6	3	0	3	144	143	+1	15	14	0	2	14
8	Bath Rugby	6	2	0	4	132	147	-15	11	16	0	3	11
9	London Wasps	6	2	0	4	133	149	-16	13	16	0	3	11
10	London Welsh	6	1	0	5	132	142	-10	13	13	0	5	9
11	Worcester Warriors	6	1	0	5	132	147	-25	12	17	0	3	7
12	Saracens	6	1	0	5	123	161	-38	10	19	0	2	6

Fixture List
European Homepage

Waiting List
1. pullthestrings
2. Bathite

Welcome to Season 5 of the Aviva Premiership fantasty rugby game. Below are the rules of the game which must be adhered to. If there are any situations that arise in the course of the game which are not covered by the rules, a final decision will be made by the RFU (Ozzy3213) as to how the situation will be resolved.

Senior Squads wrote:
The maximum squad size is 40 senior players. If a team has more than 40 players in their squad then they will be fined £1 million per player over the permitted amounts per day for the first seven days. If after 7 consecutive days a team still has more than the permitted number of players then the team will be fined £2 million per player per day, and fined 1 league point per player per day for the next seven days. If after this time a team still has more than the permitted number of players in their squad, the RFU (me) will remove players at it’s discretion to bring them back under the permitted numbers. There will be no right of appeal to players being removed.

Be aware that all tier one international matches which are played during the season will count in the game, and players selected in the matchday 22's for those matches will not be eligible to play for their clubs on that weekend, therefore you must give due consideration to the make up of your squad.

Academy Rules wrote:
Each team will be allowed to have a listed senior academy squad of 20 players. Players who are in the senior academy must be under 22 years of age as of 1st September 2012 (therefore must have been born on or after 1st Septmber 1990). Players who are under the age of 20 (so born after 1st September 1992) AND are in the academy of the club that you are managing in real life, DO NOT need to be listed as senior academy players as part of your 20, but are available to you in this game and cannot be poached by other clubs without paying you a fee.

Should a player not listed in your 20 senior academy players, but part of the clubs academy in real life move clubs in real life, then you will have first option of promoting him to your listed senior academy. If you choose not to take this option he will become property of the club that he moves to in real life in this game.

Transfers wrote:

Domestic (other AP Teams)
Each team has a budget to use in the purchase of players. Domestic transfers between AP clubs, regardless of nationality of player, should be negotiated between the respective managers, and then confirmed on the Domestic Transfer Confirmation Page.

Domestic (Championship and below)
Each team may during the season purchase no more than 3 players from the Championship or the National Leagues. These players must be bid for on the Championship/National League bidding page, and each bid will be considered by me on it's own merits before being accepted or rejected. No bid will be accepted until a minimum of 24 hours has elapsed from the time the bid was made, in order to afford other managers the opportunity to make a counter bid.

Foreign
To make a foreign transfer (i.e from any club outside of the AP, regardless of whether the player is English) a bid should be made on the Foreign Transfers Page, which will be considered by me against the posted guidelines for purchase prices before being accepted or rejected. No bid will be accepted until a minimum of 24 hours has elapsed from the time the bid was made, in order to afford other managers the opportunity to make a counter bid.

Foreign transfers will unlimited during the off season and 2 during the season. The exact dates of the two transfer windows during the season is to be confirmed.

Player Releases wrote:
Managers may choose to release players from their clubs, for which they will be offered compensation

Compensation will be paid as follows

£2 million – current international (must have played international rugby in the previous 12 months)
£1.5 million – former international
£1m – top flight experience
£0.5m – other

If a released player plays in real life for a team outside of this game he will be deemed to have returned to that team. If not then he will be deemed to have signed for a Championship side. If another manager wants to pick a released player up, they will have to bid for him in the same way as for a foreign or Championship/National League player.

Retirements wrote:
There will be no compensation for retiring players. Should a player who retires decide to come out of retirement and play again, then he will automatically go back to the club who he was playing for in the game when he retired.

Fixtures wrote:
There will be 22 Aviva Premiership games per season, plus the play offs. There will also be Heineken Cup, Amlin Challenge Cup and Anglo Welsh Cup matches. These games will take place once a week. A thread will be put up for managers to name their teams on Thursdays, then on Fridays, managers will post the scores that they think will happen from these games (apart from games in which they are involved). An average of all predictions will be taken, and then 0.5 points added to each teams score for each prediction that had them as the winner, and that will then be the final score.

Teams wrote:
When naming your team, not only should you put the starting XV and replacements, but also tactics that your team will employ. Results will be affected by the tactics described.

In addition, each team must have the following:-

At least 10 England qualified players in your matchday 23, and at least 5 of those must be in your starting XV.

At least 2 props and 1 hooker on the bench.

All players must be eligible (not injured or banned).

Failure to comply with these rules will result in forfeiting the match and a 1 league point deduction.

If you fail to submit a team for a match, then the other team will be automatically awarded a 30-0 bonus point win. If both teams fail to submit a team, then it will be scored as a 0-0 draw.

Injuries and Suspensions wrote:
Injuries in this game do NOT reflect real life, they will be generated by me.

Players banned in real life will be ineligible for selection in this game for the duration of the ban.

Inclusion of injured/banned players will result in them being replaced by players on the bench, and the bench not having eight players, which may result in punishment if it concerns the front-row.

Punishment for fielding an ineligible player will be loss of one match point for a first offence, two for a second offence and so on.

Financial Rewards wrote:
There will be no rewards for the result of an individual match, instead the managers will receive cash for predicting.

£1.5m for descriptive predictions
£0.25m for scores on the doors predictions
If you fail to predict without first advising me that you are unable to do so that week, you will be fined £1m for a first offence, £2m for a second offence, £3m for a third offence etc.

AP finishing positions.

Champions: 8m
Runners Up: 6m
Playoff Semi Finalist Losers: 5m
5th: 4m
6th: 3.5m
7th: 3m
8th: 2.5m
9th: 2m
10th: 1.5m
11th: 1m
12th: 0.5m

Heineken Cup

Losing Quarter Finalists - £2 million each
Losing Semi Finalists - £3 million each
Runners Up - £4 million
Champions - £5 million

Amlin Challenge Cup

Losing Quarter Finalists - £1 million each
Losing Semi Finalists - £2 million each
Runners Up - £3 million
Champions - £4 million

Anglo-Welsh Cup

Losing Semi Finalisst - £1 million each
Runners Up - £2 million
Champions - £3 million

If your budgets falls below minus £10 million for any reason, the administrators (ozzy3213) will step in and players from within your squad will be released for the relevant financial compensation in order to bring your budget back above minus £10 million.

by dammit_chris Sun 23 Sep 2012, 5:07 pm

But look at how he played in the French game - think with Farrell you have to have a distributor at 12, I still think Farrell is better suited to playing inside centre.

England don't use Foden enough, when you watch him against Saints they get him in as a strike runner, but the backs moves for England just don't use him properly - Twelvetrees imperssed me yesterday, he could be worth a try?

by Sgt_Pooly Sun 23 Sep 2012, 5:10 pm

A 12 needs some sort of running game, Farrell struggles here.

Farrell is a 10 but just not a complete one at present

by dammit_chris Sun 23 Sep 2012, 5:27 pm

We just need a new Greenwood to emerge from somewhere!

I hope Lancaster sees how Quins are playing and starts trying something similar, as that style of play is so hard to defend against. It's very similar to how Leinster play.

I think we are pretty much sorted for positions apart from 10 and 12 where I see us as pretty weak at the moment.

by Sgt_Pooly Sun 23 Sep 2012, 5:31 pm

10's strong just nobody is pulling up trees.

2 & 4 are concerns for me.

by stnick88 Sun 23 Sep 2012, 5:41 pm

I'm satisfied with Hartley at 2 but could be better. 4 and 12 are more worryIng.

by dammit_chris Sun 23 Sep 2012, 5:58 pm

Hartley will be Lions starting no2 if he keeps his form up, last 4 games are the best I've seen him play - has lost a fair bit of weight over the Summer and seems to be carrying a lot better. Would say he's sorted out his temperament now too, do really like him now!

by **Ozzy3213** Sun 23 Sep 2012, 5:59 pm

For me, with England it's like this...

15. Loads of depth, nothing to worry about in this jersey.
11 & 14. Loads of players who look as if they could do something special, need a couple to really grab the chance and make the jersey their own.
13. See 15.
12. Struggling. Trying to shoehorn Manu in here is not the answer.

10. We are ok, but don't have a player to take our game to the next level right now.
9. See 15 and 13

6,7 & 8. Lots to choose from, need to work out our best combination as opposed to best individual players.
4 & 5. Very worried about where we are right now. Not inspired by either Botha or Parling and think we need to look at a more dynamic pairing.
3. Solid, but fecked if Cole gets injured.
2. Happy with Hartley, lacking depth though.
1. See 9, 13 & 15.

by stnick88 Sun 23 Sep 2012, 6:00 pm

He's not on better form than best. 4 good games in the AP won't bother Gatland

by **Ozzy3213** Sun 23 Sep 2012, 6:03 pm

Best has no form at present, he's not laced up a pair of boots yet this season.

Going on current and most recent for (so including summer internationals and end of last season), Best, Hartley and Ford will be the three hookers on the plane for the Lions.

by Sgt_Pooly Sun 23 Sep 2012, 6:05 pm

Hartley won't be Lions hook

by **Ozzy3213** Sun 23 Sep 2012, 6:07 pm

Who do you reckon will go ahead of him Pooly?

by Sgt_Pooly Sun 23 Sep 2012, 6:10 pm

Best, Ford and a Welsh hooker.

Hartley would need to step up massively on the Int stage to even travel never mind start imo.

Taking away I don't think he's a particularly strong player, Gatland dislikes him. He doesn't think he can scrummage and he's criticised him in public.

by **Ozzy3213** Sun 23 Sep 2012, 6:13 pm

Last interview I saw with Gatland, where he spoke about Hartley I didn't get the feeling that he disliked Hartley at all, and got the distinct impression than he is well in Gatland's thinking.

None of the Welsh hookers for me have even nailed down their own countries jersey, let alone the Lions one.

by dammit_chris Sun 23 Sep 2012, 6:14 pm

I could never stand Hartley after the whole eye gouging incidents on Dallagio and Haskell, but to me he's come back a reformed player, I rate him very highly as a good part of his game is what he does at the breakdown, disrupting opposition and generally upsetting the whole of Wales - basically means you are a very good player, last person who I've seen do that is Dallagio!

No one is close to him in the AP who could play for England. I think he will start for the Lions, possibly only other two that will are Ashton and Tuilagi.

Agree with you Pete on your comments about England - who would you have as the locks? Definitely need more dynamism there, Botha and Parling offer nothing there - wonder what price Lawes and Launchbury being a pairing by the 6Nations - Lawes had a good game yesterday, think he might have got a try.

by dammit_chris Sun 23 Sep 2012, 6:16 pm

Oh I remember when Gatland criticised Hartley in public - pretty certain that HArtley put in a motm display after that and then Gatland getting massive criticism afterwards for it.

Is Gatland still involved with Wales, in the sense he will pick the teams in the AI's and 6Nations? Wasn't sure if he would be or not.

by Sgt_Pooly Sun 23 Sep 2012, 6:16 pm

I think Owens might step up.

We have a AI & 6N before Lions tour, Lions talk is completely pointless.

by Sgt_Pooly Sun 23 Sep 2012, 6:18 pm

I'll give £100 Launchbury & Lawes won't be starting pairing in the 6N. Launchbury doesn't start for his club side and neither are anything special in the lineout.

Where do you get this stuff from?????

I prefer Gray to Hartley although he needs to get a chance on Int stage.

by **Ozzy3213** Sun 23 Sep 2012, 6:21 pm

I like Lawes and Launchbury Chris, and long term they are potentially a second row partnership for England but I would be concerned about throwing them both in together right now.

I would have them both in the squad for the autumn series, but I am a firm believer in picking your pack as a unit rather than individuals, and at present we don't have a settled enough back row, nor do we have a lineout leader in the back row, to enable us to start the both of them.

by Sgt_Pooly Sun 23 Sep 2012, 6:34 pm

Gatland on Hartley:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/article-1350192/Dylan-Hartley-coward-says-Warren-Gatland.html

"He added: 'I saw him go to pieces at Leicester a few weeks ago and again on Saturday night. It just shows people can crack under pressure. It's another case of a Kiwi choking on the big occasion.' "

"Gatland said: 'Dylan Hartley always seems to have a lot to say for himself, but we will see what he's got next week. Some of what he said was responsible for Richie Rees being banned for a lengthy period, yet he wasn't prepared to step outside with Gareth Williams when he was invited to do so. So we'll see how he fronts up on February 4.'"

I know he shook Hartleys hand after the game but you have to think if somebody has slagged off a player to that extent he wouldn't involve him in one of his squads.

by dammit_chris Sun 23 Sep 2012, 6:50 pm

Launchbury has started every game when he hasnt been injured or carrying a knock lol.

I really like Palmer, but he is annoyingly inconsistent, one match he's a world beater and the next you barely see him. Does the same at Wasps.

Not sure what Gray has ever done to be honest - closest to Hartley in my opinion is Webber and he's a long way back. Hartley was a hot head and wound a lot of people up, think it is why a lot of people don't like him - I couldn't stand him, but really rate him now.

Personally thought Gatland was an idiot saying what he did - why would any professional rugby player step out for a fight lol.

by Sgt_Pooly Sun 23 Sep 2012, 6:54 pm

"Launchbury has started every game when he hasnt been injured or carrying a knock lol."

Why does he have a sub appearence then? If he either starts the game or is injured why would he be on the bench?

Gray is probably the form hook in the Prem in the best side, what else can he do??

by Sgt_Pooly Sun 23 Sep 2012, 6:55 pm

Webber is a fair bit behind Gray, Youngs etc

by **Ozzy3213** Sun 23 Sep 2012, 7:06 pm

Pooly, Gatland tried to rattle Hartley's cage before a big game, and it didn't work, as England won and Hartley played well. He's not the only player that Gatland has tried that with over the years. If Hartley is performing best of the qualified hookers come selection time, do you honestly believe that Gatland would cut off his nose to spite his face and not pick him, just because he may not like him as a person?

This is professional sport, and personal differences are often left aside as all people want to do is win. As I said, I saw Gatland interviewed after he was appointed to the Lions, and as far as I could tell, the door is very much open for Hartley.

by Sgt_Pooly Sun 23 Sep 2012, 7:15 pm

Yes I believe that.

Squads are picked on character as well as just ability. I don't think Gatland likes or rates Hartley at all and I don't think he's a player that's rated or respected outside England.

I think he'd have be playing much better than the other candidates to even travel and I can't see that happening as I don't think he's ever really played well on the Int stage.

by **Ozzy3213** Sun 23 Sep 2012, 7:24 pm

Think we'll have to agree to disagree. As far as I can tell all Gatland wants to do is win, and he'll pick the blokes that he thinks can get the job done, whether he likes them or not. I think he will base his selections in the main on the AI's, 6N's and HC, so I do agree with you that it's a little bit early to be speculating on who will go just yet.

I know we are playing the Aussies this November, and I think the Welsh are as well. Are Scotland and Ireland? Performances against them by potential Lions candidates could have a reasonable impact on Gatland and who he selects.

Also, has his coaching team been confirmed yet? That will also have an impact on who gets on the plane next June.

by dammit_chris Sun 23 Sep 2012, 7:27 pm

I wonder if Gatland will end up going back and coaching Wales, must be very tough if he leaves out players who he normally picks for him.

Heard that he wants Rowntree as the forwards coach.

by 'Arry Spurs Sun 23 Sep 2012, 7:27 pm

All this Lions talk is making me very excited ahead of the tour. I reckon Robshaw will be captain. I just have a feeling that he is just going to get better and better.

by 'Arry Spurs Sun 23 Sep 2012, 7:28 pm

I've heard that Gatland wants the same make up of coaches that were involved in the 09 tour.

by CJB Sun 23 Sep 2012, 8:06 pm

Euan Murray, Louis Deacon, FDP, Maxime Medard can all leave

by **Ozzy3213** Sun 23 Sep 2012, 9:24 pm

Players available for cash

Andrew Trimble £6m
Matt Smith £3m

by stnick88 Mon 24 Sep 2012, 9:45 am

You go to the game Saturday Pete?
Wasn't too pretty, but a wins a win.
Unbelievable how much difference Garvey makes to our pack. The TOL/iHumph combo was good too.
That Yanuyanutawa wasnt great in the scrum, but he is absolutely massive.

by **Ozzy3213** Mon 24 Sep 2012, 10:00 am

No mate, have been working all weekend. Garvey is one of our best defensive players, so no coincidence that it was a much improved defensive performance this week.

iHumph could be massive for us this season.

by Sgt_Pooly Mon 24 Sep 2012, 10:07 am

End of Aus career for Cooper??

http://www.rugby365.com/article/49771

by Sgt_Pooly Mon 24 Sep 2012, 10:09 am

Bets on Cooper quiting union in the next 12 months??

by dammit_chris Mon 24 Sep 2012, 10:10 am

Good article about England's problems in the midfield:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/international/england/9560656/England-head-coach-Stuart-Lancaster-remains-in-the-dark-over-best-combination-at-centre-of-his-midfield.html

Gist that we havent got any top 10/12s around! If only Nick Evans was English!!!

by Sgt_Pooly Mon 24 Sep 2012, 10:32 am

"Gist that we havent got any top 10/12s around! If only Nick Evans was English!!!"

Or hookers, locks, wingers.....

by stnick88 Mon 24 Sep 2012, 10:35 am

I read an article saying about problems on the wing also.

They basically narrowed it down to Ashton on one wing and either Monye or Yarde on the other. Personally think its too early for Yarde but he has probably been Irish's best player this season.

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/rugby/rugby-union/club-rugby/lancaster-left-with-headaches-by-string-of-wing-injuries-8163776.html

by Guest Mon 24 Sep 2012, 11:04 am

I would have Monye to start currently with May on the bench

Interesting how that article did not even realise Johnny May was playing wing this week.

Independent not the greatest for rugby. much prefer times and telegraph.

by dammit_chris Mon 24 Sep 2012, 11:10 am

Wings we have lots coming through at most clubs now - Sharples needs to get back to fitness, but think we are ok there. Need to find an out and out attacker I think who gives the back line a bit of a x factor.

Locks we could be alright with Lawes&Launch provided that either Wood or Croft play - preference for Wood who could lead the line. Like the look of Garvey too.

Twelve trees has impressed me so far this season, hope he continues as v good defence and a good play maker. Want to see Burrell continue to get games with Saints, if he can defend then he's a good player.

by Guest Mon 24 Sep 2012, 11:14 am

Sharples is in the EPS but got injured a few weeks ago and is making his way back after an operation at the end of last season.

Needs games and fitness

by stnick88 Mon 24 Sep 2012, 11:16 am

Burrell looks solid but not sure he would be any more effective than Barrett, early days though. 12T I have hopes for as he is a strong defender, has a good boot and attacks reasonably we..

Locks we have some good individuals like Lawes, Launchbury, Parling, Robson and Garvey, but it is about getting the right blend. The way Quins are going I would be tempted to give Robson a go. looks awesome for them, carries well and very good lineout player.

by dammit_chris Mon 24 Sep 2012, 11:35 am

Burrell I think has much more in attack than Barritt, looks a solid carrier and think he's got 3-4 tries in his 3 games so far. But I don't think his defence is up to much.

I'd like to see 12T given some gametime, but not sure if he's in the EPS or not? COuld be ideal foil for Tuilagi, and might work with Flood at no10 there too.

Lawes has to start for England, think he offers a lot and something that we've been missing in our second row - an excellent defender too and gets all over the pitch for the whole 80mins.

I'm not sure about Robson, I think he's a very good AP player but I don't think he has the attributes to make a very good international, similar to me of Parling and Botha.

by stnick88 Mon 24 Sep 2012, 11:53 am

He deserves a chance though, shines week in week out for the AP Champions. Dont see the point in persisting in Botha who cant carry and probably wont be around for the next WC.

by dammit_chris Mon 24 Sep 2012, 11:58 am

Agree with you there Nick, think Botha has a very high work rate, but don't really see what else he brings.

Mat, how old is Tom Savage? He looked pretty good at the weekend for you - was best lock on display I thought, apart from Wentzel, who has to be up there with Evans as one of the best players in the league - he's been brilliant for Wasps

by Guest Mon 24 Sep 2012, 12:06 pm

Savage is about 23. only started playing at 18 or something daft. really good play i was loathe to relase him and prop got a good deal with him. Backrow or second row and nails tackler.

been excellent this year

by dammit_chris Mon 24 Sep 2012, 12:18 pm

Was very impressed with him - I think this is the first year where a lot of youngsters are getting a lot of game time - you look at the Gloucester backline on Saturday and it was all English, imagine that all but 12T came through the academy too?

Wasps seem to be producing some real quality youngsters, or helping them develop - am amazed at how much Vunipola is coming on, becoming a very good carrier for Wasps from the bench - would be tempted to get him in the Saxons set up.

by Driver Mon 24 Sep 2012, 1:36 pm

Looking for a war hardened wet weather 6.

by Sgt_Pooly Mon 24 Sep 2012, 1:40 pm

Robson has been great this season, as has Parling. I thought Robson outplayed him at the weekend though (like most of Quins players)

by Driver Mon 24 Sep 2012, 1:59 pm

ESPN Scrums transfer page reporting Racing Metro are set to offer Ben Foden a monster deal to join them at the end of the season.

by stnick88 Mon 24 Sep 2012, 2:01 pm

cant see him going there.

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