Irish Autumn Squad-BOD AND BEST OUT!

First topic message reminder :

So Kidney announces his squad today, a 32 man panel against the boks and pumas. More players come into consideration for the Fiji game.

A 31 man Ireland squad including four uncapped players has been named by Ireland Coach Declan Kidney for the 2012 Guinness Series games against South Africa, Fiji and Argentina.

Centre Luke Marshall and forward Iain Henderson named in the panel and who were involved in the Ireland training camp in September are included in the squad as are prop David Kilcoyne and hooker Richardt Strauss, who is now eligible to play for Ireland based on his residency for the past three years.
In addition to the naming of the Ireland squad for the 2012 Guinness Series, there were also changes announced to the makeup of the national coaching staff with current Munster Assistant Coach and former international Anthony Foley joining the Ireland coaching team.

Foley will be now be leading the defence plans and systems allowing Assistant Coach Les Kiss to lead the attack shape for the team as well as continue to coach the backline. Foley will remain working with Munster Rugby outside of the international window. It was also confirmed that Leinster scrum coach, Greg Feek will continue providing his expertise to the Ireland team during competition time.

Commenting on the Guinness Series games and the addition of Anthony Foley, Ireland Coach Declan Kidney said: "We have three incredibly competitive games ahead of us in November and while there have been quite a few injuries and niggles in the early part of the season, it has opened up opportunities for other players to step into the squad. There are world ranking points on offer, so the underlying challenge for us is to work towards retaining and improving our ranking position ahead of the Rugby World Cup pool draw. While that is the end goal, our focus will be getting our preparations right to match the intensity of international games.

"I'm pleased that Anthony has taken up the offer of working with the squad to assist during this vital period in November. His previous experience of working with the team during the last RBS 6 Nations championship was important, but his own abilities and experience were central to bringing him onboard. I would like to thank Rob Penney and Joe Schmidt for being so positive and giving Anthony Foley and Greg (Feek) the scope to be part of the plans that we have."

Anthony Foley said: "I was delighted when Declan approached Rob and me about the possibility of working with the Ireland team again. I enjoyed the opportunity I got during the Six Nations working with the players and I felt once we were all comfortable with the balance between Munster and Ireland, I jumped at the chance. I certainly feel I can contribute positively and when you get the chance to coach with your country, you don't want to pass it up.

Ticket sales have reached over 46,000 for the South Africa game with only a limited number of categories available for purchase from IrishRugby.ie and www.ticketmaster.ie

While the Argentina game is a full month away, ticket sales are at just over 37,000 tickets and are selling quickly and have already surpassed the attendance the last time Argentina visited the Aviva.

rodders wrote:

red_stag wrote:

1F'sgonnagetya! wrote:
When are we going to phase the older players out? ie. ROG, DOC, BOD

When the provinces stop picking them.

...and the provinces will stop picking them when the IRFU stop giving them contracts....

Looks like our squad for 2015 is going to need walking sticks to get around the pitch then!

profitius wrote:

red_stag wrote:I don't understand people's problem with Denis Hurley. I think he is a very under rated player.

I don't think he is underrated. Hes a big, solid player who does the basics well for Munster. He is slow to turn and very slow acceleration.

Whats wrong with just always doing the basics well.

Ok its not good enough if your serious about racking up 50+ Ireland caps. But why do we need guys who can do a bit of everything.

Whats wrong with just having a guy come in during a period of injury who can do all the basics well when required?

Wouldn't be adverse to Hurley as back-up.

In response to the issue at 12, what about James Downey, the now Munster man?

I don't follow the Rabbo, but he was decent in the Aviva prem.

Sam he has done ok but nowhere near good enough for international.

Looked very sharp against the weaker Rabo teams (Dragons, Edinburgh, Treviso etc) - has looked a little bit less so as we have player tougher games.

Looked fairly ineffective in the Heineken Cup games this year.

There are better players.

Hookisms and Hyperbole wrote:
To leave out the best 7 in Irish rugby (with apologies to the Chris Henry who has been excellent for the past 18 months and deserves his call up) in Shane Jennings and include O'Mahony is bizarre. O'Mahony isn't good enough at provincial level let alone international level. He will be in time, he is an excellent prospect, but right now he shouldn't be in the squad.

POM was one of Munsters best players last season and he was again at the weekend. Hes not the most likeable character but if you can't say he isn't good enough.

Sin é wrote:
Well Paddy, use your cop on when you see a player going off injured that you are meant to be doing injury cover for, and bring your phone with you at least.

Well given that there was only one game to go and Cave, Earls and Trimble were already out there Paddy probably thought the same as the rest of us at the time.....

..... namely that no coach in their right mind would fly in a player from their holidays, who hasn't trained with the squad, or featured all season, across the world to start a test against by far the best side in the world with 2 days preperation, when there was already sufficent cover available.....

red_stag wrote:

profitius wrote:

red_stag wrote:I don't understand people's problem with Denis Hurley. I think he is a very under rated player.

I don't think he is underrated. Hes a big, solid player who does the basics well for Munster. He is slow to turn and very slow acceleration.

Whats wrong with just always doing the basics well.

Ok its not good enough if your serious about racking up 50+ Ireland caps. But why do we need guys who can do a bit of everything.

Whats wrong with just having a guy come in during a period of injury who can do all the basics well when required?

If Ireland want to move forward we'll need players who can do the basics well but who offers more.

Yes we have Rob Kearney and he isn't available. Therefore we look else where.

profitius wrote:

Hookisms and Hyperbole wrote:
To leave out the best 7 in Irish rugby (with apologies to the Chris Henry who has been excellent for the past 18 months and deserves his call up) in Shane Jennings and include O'Mahony is bizarre. O'Mahony isn't good enough at provincial level let alone international level. He will be in time, he is an excellent prospect, but right now he shouldn't be in the squad.

POM was one of Munsters best players last season and he was again at the weekend. Hes not the most likeable character but if you can't say he isn't good enough.

He isn't up to standard and his performances aren't up to Heineken Cup level never mind international. If Coughlan wasn't injured I don't see how he would even get into the Munster side. I am far more impressed with Sean Dougall than O'Mahony. He doesn't carry the ball well enough, he isn't big enough, he isn't physical enough and he is defensively poor from the back of the scrum. He can only tackle on one shoulder. Technically he isn't good enough yet. He will be I have no doubt, but he is nowhere near the standard required for international rugby. That Shane Jennings is left out and O'Mahony is in the squad is simply laughable. I really wonder if Kidney had actually watched a single minute of rugby this season to come to this decision.

If the coach was doing his job we wouldn't be looking elsewhere, he should already have the alternatives lined up.

The reason we don't is because Kidney ignored, or was oblivious to, the fact that Geordan Murphy wasn't going to be around forever.

Same mistake has been made with ROG, at TH and the midfield. There should be no debate, or very little, as to who comes in when there's injuries, we should have 2-3 players well bedded in in every position.

The fact that we don't only hilights the total incompetence of Kidney and the IRFU.

red_stag wrote:Yes we have Rob Kearney and he isn't available. Therefore we look else where.

Have to agree with this, better to have a backup who does the basics of the position well than a player who does the extras but is unreliable at the basics. Thats a failing we've had in the past. We picked Tony Buckley when he couldn't scrum because he was good around the park, we picked Court at tighthead despite his struggles out of position, we picked Tomas O'Leary because of his running game even when his passing and kicking was poor. These things can hurt a team.

On a brighter note, lets congratulate Luke Marshall, Dave Kilcoyne and Iain Henderson on their selection. Ulster Rugby have this on their facebook page;

Commenting on his call up, Luke Marshall said: "It's a bit surreal. I'm very surprised but delighted to have the opportunity. The games will be very tough, against some of the top ranked teams in the world, and if I get a chance to be involved in some of the games it'll be brilliant.

"I was down at the training camp last month which was great as it gave me the chance to meet all the guys. I've been enjoying my rugby so far this season; it was good to get a run of games for Ulster at the start of the season and I've kept my place in the match day squad even with all the big names coming back. The team have been going well and it is really good to have so many Ulster boys involved in the Ireland set up."

rodders wrote:If the coach was doing his job we wouldn't be looking elsewhere, he should already have the alternatives lined up.

The reason we don't is because Kidney ignored, or was oblivious to, the fact that Geordan Murphy wasn't going to be around forever.

Same mistake has been made with ROG, at TH and the midfield. There should be no debate, or very little, as to who comes in when there's injuries, we should have 2-3 players well bedded in in every position.

The fact that we don't only hilights the total incompetence of Kidney and the IRFU.

Well said Rodders!

rodders wrote:

Sin é wrote:
Well Paddy, use your cop on when you see a player going off injured that you are meant to be doing injury cover for, and bring your phone with you at least.

Well given that there was only one game to go and Cave, Earls and Trimble were already out there Paddy probably thought the same as the rest of us at the time.....

..... namely that no coach in their right mind would fly in a player from their holidays, who hasn't trained with the squad, or featured all season, across the world to start a test against by far the best side in the world with 2 days preperation, when there was already sufficent cover available.....

Earls missed that game because he was injured, so Paddy wouldn't have known that he would be fit enough. Paddy had played for the Ba-Bas and he must have known that Cave has never played 12 in his career (and it was highly unlikely he would be used against the ABs, considering his cameo in the first test.

Paddy was on standby. He should not have been on a beach in Portugal. Fullstop.

Sin é wrote:Paddy was on standby. He should not have been on a beach in Portugal. Fullstop.

There's plenty more that could be said about this, but its irrelevant to the topic at hand. Would you ever just stop.

Hardly anyone is having a pish attack about Strauss being in the squad…

…must be some very unhappy rugby fans out there.

I’m not a bit shocked or disappointed with the squad, it’s exactly as short sighted and mediocre as I expected.

And as for taking Les Kiss off defense (his original role) and putting Axel (ligind) Foley in there, well it just gets better every season!

While Sin derails yet another tread with his nonsense there seems to be one thing that people have forgotten about with the squad. I really, really, really, really, really, really don't like the selection of Strauss. He is a good player and in form would push Best for selection and I genuinely believe will be a bolter for the Lions in a pretty weak position for the side. I hate Ireland capping 'project' players like this. It's no reflection on him. He's a good player, and he maybe feels as Irish as any Irish supporter. But he isn't Irish. He shouldn't be in the panel.

rodders wrote:If the coach was doing his job we wouldn't be looking elsewhere, he should already have the alternatives lined up.

The reason we don't is because Kidney ignored, or was oblivious to, the fact that Geordan Murphy wasn't going to be around forever.

Same mistake has been made with ROG, at TH and the midfield. There should be no debate, or very little, as to who comes in when there's injuries, we should have 2-3 players well bedded in in every position.

The fact that we don't only hilights the total incompetence of Kidney and the IRFU.

Whats Stefan Terblanche up to at the moment - Kidney should get out the cheque book

Sin é wrote:
Earls missed that game because he was injured, so Paddy wouldn't have known that he would be fit enough. Paddy had played for the Ba-Bas and he must have known that Cave has never played 12 in his career (and it was highly unlikely he would be used against the ABs, considering his cameo in the first test.

Paddy was on standby. He should not have been on a beach in Portugal. Fullstop.

Which reminds me.. McFadden was there too.

You're right though Sin, Paddy shouldn't have been in Portugal....if he was the only flipping alternative that Kidney was prepared to entertain to D'arcy and Earls in midfield then he should have bloody been in NZ all along!

Notch wrote:

Sin é wrote:Paddy was on standby. He should not have been on a beach in Portugal. Fullstop.

There's plenty more that could be said about this, but its irrelevant to the topic at hand. Would you ever just stop.

Notch, you introduced the topic of Paddy Wallace's selection to the thread. Be careful what you start.

Hookisms and Hyperbole wrote:

profitius wrote:

Hookisms and Hyperbole wrote:
To leave out the best 7 in Irish rugby (with apologies to the Chris Henry who has been excellent for the past 18 months and deserves his call up) in Shane Jennings and include O'Mahony is bizarre. O'Mahony isn't good enough at provincial level let alone international level. He will be in time, he is an excellent prospect, but right now he shouldn't be in the squad.

POM was one of Munsters best players last season and he was again at the weekend. Hes not the most likeable character but if you can't say he isn't good enough.

He isn't up to standard and his performances aren't up to Heineken Cup level never mind international. If Coughlan wasn't injured I don't see how he would even get into the Munster side. I am far more impressed with Sean Dougall than O'Mahony. He doesn't carry the ball well enough, he isn't big enough, he isn't physical enough and he is defensively poor from the back of the scrum. He can only tackle on one shoulder. Technically he isn't good enough yet. He will be I have no doubt, but he is nowhere near the standard required for international rugby. That Shane Jennings is left out and O'Mahony is in the squad is simply laughable. I really wonder if Kidney had actually watched a single minute of rugby this season to come to this decision.

Hookisms is only worried his widdleLeinster buddies will be left out especially Heaslip (hasnt had a good game for Ireland in about 2+ years) and Jennings who is just never ever going to make the International set up in any shape or form. Good for Leinster, mediocre at best for Ireland.

Sin é wrote:

rodders wrote:If the coach was doing his job we wouldn't be looking elsewhere, he should already have the alternatives lined up.

The reason we don't is because Kidney ignored, or was oblivious to, the fact that Geordan Murphy wasn't going to be around forever.

Same mistake has been made with ROG, at TH and the midfield. There should be no debate, or very little, as to who comes in when there's injuries, we should have 2-3 players well bedded in in every position.

The fact that we don't only hilights the total incompetence of Kidney and the IRFU.

Whats Stefan Terblanche up to at the moment - Kidney should get out the cheque book

Sin é, I had no idea you held Adam D'arcy is such high regard. I agree with you wholeheartedly that he could have been the backup Ireland 15 if only he had gotten regular gametime last season...

+1

Mickado wrote:Hardly anyone is having a pish attack about Strauss being in the squad…

…must be some very unhappy rugby fans out there.

I am not happy. I think its a dark day to let that mercenary into the team. If he applied for Irish citizenship they'd tell him feic off that he is barely here half the length of time needed to be considered Irish.

Heaslip was immense in the second test against the ABs.

Himself and Darcy were sorely missed the following week.

I'm delighted with the new guys in the squad but have a feeling all or most will be back with their clubs for the Rabo games.

A couple of ponderables.

Will McFadden be the utility "cover all" back therefore be guaranteed the 22 jersey?
Earls has said he only wants to play 13 so why do we need three of them?
If Jones comes through Munster's next game unscathed and makes the squad, should he be first choice 15.
Why has Kidney only chosen two scrum halves? Must be the first squad he has ever picked with just two.
At least one of the (3) young future 10's should be in the squad for experience, even at the expense of one of the back three.

Mickado wrote:Hardly anyone is having a pish attack about Strauss being in the squad…

…must be some very unhappy rugby fans out there.

I'm grand with it. Strauss has payed his dues and is a Leinsterman now. If hes here for the long haul then he should be treated like everyone else.

Bottom line for me is that he's easily the second best Hooker in the country. Cronin, Varley, Sherry et al need to step up to the plate and shouldn't get preferential treatment because they were born here.

Sin é wrote:Notch, you introduced the topic of Paddy Wallace's selection to the thread. Be careful what you start.

BTW my issue is more with the whole Project Player system. As Strauss is the face of it he takes the brunt of my criticisms. Its nothing personal.

red_stag wrote:

Mickado wrote:Hardly anyone is having a pish attack about Strauss being in the squad…

…must be some very unhappy rugby fans out there.

I am not happy. I think its a dark day to let that mercenary into the team. If he applied for Irish citizenship they'd tell him feic off that he is barely here half the length of time needed to be considered Irish.

Its going to be embarrassing if we're losing and he comes into the side off the bench for his first cap against the nation he wasn't considered good enough to get a provincial contract in.

Rava wrote:I'm delighted with the new guys in the squad but have a feeling all or most will be back with their clubs for the Rabo games.

A couple of ponderables.

Will McFadden be the utility "cover all" back therefore be guaranteed the 22 jersey?
Earls has said he only wants to play 13 so why do we need three of them?
If Jones comes through Munster's next game unscathed and makes the squad, should he be first choice 15.
Why has Kidney only chosen two scrum halves? Must be the first squad he has ever picked with just two.
At least one of the (3) young future 10's should be in the squad for experience, even at the expense of one of the back three.

There's always a cynic.....

DOD wrote:

Hookisms and Hyperbole wrote:

profitius wrote:

Hookisms and Hyperbole wrote:
To leave out the best 7 in Irish rugby (with apologies to the Chris Henry who has been excellent for the past 18 months and deserves his call up) in Shane Jennings and include O'Mahony is bizarre. O'Mahony isn't good enough at provincial level let alone international level. He will be in time, he is an excellent prospect, but right now he shouldn't be in the squad.

POM was one of Munsters best players last season and he was again at the weekend. Hes not the most likeable character but if you can't say he isn't good enough.

He isn't up to standard and his performances aren't up to Heineken Cup level never mind international. If Coughlan wasn't injured I don't see how he would even get into the Munster side. I am far more impressed with Sean Dougall than O'Mahony. He doesn't carry the ball well enough, he isn't big enough, he isn't physical enough and he is defensively poor from the back of the scrum. He can only tackle on one shoulder. Technically he isn't good enough yet. He will be I have no doubt, but he is nowhere near the standard required for international rugby. That Shane Jennings is left out and O'Mahony is in the squad is simply laughable. I really wonder if Kidney had actually watched a single minute of rugby this season to come to this decision.

Hookisms is only worried his widdleLeinster buddies will be left out especially Heaslip (hasnt had a good game for Ireland in about 2+ years) and Jennings who is just never ever going to make the International set up in any shape or form. Good for Leinster, mediocre at best for Ireland.

I'm an Ulster fan who also questioned the place of Marshall in the squad as he isn't a starter for Ulster. Heaslip has been very good this season but I was calling for his head last season too as his performances were pretty poor. O'Mahony can't cut it at provincial level, he shouldn't be in the international set up. I'm terribly sorry pudding if that means one less Munster player is in the squad. But sure at least you have ROG in there because he 100% deserves his all up.

I have many thoughts on this squad but the majority would be filtered out and could earn me a ban. My biggest problem is this. Paul Marshall has had an outstanding start to the season and has arguably done enough to keep Pienaar on the bench at Ulster. Yet according to Kidney he isn't national squad material. Don't get me wrong I'm not saying he should start. But for the love of god Declan why isn't he even in the squad?

Strauss's inclusion indicates a worrying change in times and neither Luke Marshall or Henderson will see a minute of gametime.

Mickado wrote:Hardly anyone is having a pish attack about Strauss being in the squad…

…must be some very unhappy rugby fans out there.

I’m not a bit shocked or disappointed with the squad, it’s exactly as short sighted and mediocre as I expected.

And as for taking Les Kiss off defense (his original role) and putting Axel (ligind) Foley in there, well it just gets better every season!

If it had come as some surprise then maybe there would have been more about it. The fact he has been touted for a place for at least two years has softened the blow

I don't like it myself, but I wish him well and if he improves us then there is some justification in his selection. Feel sorry for the likes of Varley and Sherry.

Notch wrote:

red_stag wrote:

Mickado wrote:Hardly anyone is having a pish attack about Strauss being in the squad…

…must be some very unhappy rugby fans out there.

I am not happy. I think its a dark day to let that mercenary into the team. If he applied for Irish citizenship they'd tell him feic off that he is barely here half the length of time needed to be considered Irish.

Its going to be embarrassing if we're losing and he comes into the side off the bench for his first cap against the nation he wasn't considered good enough to get a provincial contract in.

He is good enough though. He should be in the SA squad. Strauss is one of the top hookers in europe imo.

rodders wrote:

Rava wrote:I'm delighted with the new guys in the squad but have a feeling all or most will be back with their clubs for the Rabo games.

A couple of ponderables.

Will McFadden be the utility "cover all" back therefore be guaranteed the 22 jersey?
Earls has said he only wants to play 13 so why do we need three of them?
If Jones comes through Munster's next game unscathed and makes the squad, should he be first choice 15.
Why has Kidney only chosen two scrum halves? Must be the first squad he has ever picked with just two.
At least one of the (3) young future 10's should be in the squad for experience, even at the expense of one of the back three.

There's always a cynic.....

What's cynical about asking questions? I'd rather read your answers.

Mickado wrote:Hardly anyone is having a pish attack about Strauss being in the squad…

…must be some very unhappy rugby fans out there.

I’m not a bit shocked or disappointed with the squad, it’s exactly as short sighted and mediocre as I expected.

And as for taking Les Kiss off defense (his original role) and putting Axel (ligind) Foley in there, well it just gets better every season!

I'd actually feel sorry for Straus. Imagine having your first cap against your own country (the cameras will be on him when they play the SA national anthem).

Ireland top try scorers in the 6Ns with Kis in charge of attack, not to mention the near miss against NZ in the 2nd test. Then a complete breakdown in defence for the 3rd test.

Looks like to me they are trying to solve the problem areas. Whats your problem with Axel being defence coach?

Hookisms and Hyperbole wrote:

profitius wrote:

Hookisms and Hyperbole wrote:
To leave out the best 7 in Irish rugby (with apologies to the Chris Henry who has been excellent for the past 18 months and deserves his call up) in Shane Jennings and include O'Mahony is bizarre. O'Mahony isn't good enough at provincial level let alone international level. He will be in time, he is an excellent prospect, but right now he shouldn't be in the squad.

POM was one of Munsters best players last season and he was again at the weekend. Hes not the most likeable character but if you can't say he isn't good enough.

He isn't up to standard and his performances aren't up to Heineken Cup level never mind international. If Coughlan wasn't injured I don't see how he would even get into the Munster side. I am far more impressed with Sean Dougall than O'Mahony. He doesn't carry the ball well enough, he isn't big enough, he isn't physical enough and he is defensively poor from the back of the scrum. He can only tackle on one shoulder. Technically he isn't good enough yet. He will be I have no doubt, but he is nowhere near the standard required for international rugby. That Shane Jennings is left out and O'Mahony is in the squad is simply laughable. I really wonder if Kidney had actually watched a single minute of rugby this season to come to this decision.

POM is the same size as Heaslip and constantly gains ground when he has the ball. The other points you make is your opinion. The only one I agree with is his performance at the base of the scrum but then again that was just his second start of the season. Rory Best had a poor game against Castres but nobody was too critical considering it was his first start of the season.

Earls may have said he only wants to play 13 but looks like the national management are disagreeing and don't intend to pick him there.

If he was considered as a centre, the selection would be even stranger.

Strauss' inclusion is a joke. Its a sad day to see Ireland go down this road where they're picking foreigners to play for Ireland.

Connacht fans can feel a bit unlucky too that there backs have been overlooked. Maybe its not a bad thing that they along with Jackson, Madigan, Keatley, Gilroy, Sherry etc are not included. They can concentrate on playing for their provinces and they all need to play more games instad of sitting on the Ireland bench.

Rava wrote:

rodders wrote:

Rava wrote:I'm delighted with the new guys in the squad but have a feeling all or most will be back with their clubs for the Rabo games.

A couple of ponderables.

Will McFadden be the utility "cover all" back therefore be guaranteed the 22 jersey?

Probably

Earls has said he only wants to play 13 so why do we need three of them?

Good question. Earls will no doubt play one at 13 and one on the wing.

If Jones comes through Munster's next game unscathed and makes the squad, should he be first choice 15.

Hmm if he plays exceptionally well maybe. Madigan is the guy in form no reason to look past him for me

Why has Kidney only chosen two scrum halves? Must be the first squad he has ever picked with just two.
At least one of the (3) young future 10's should be in the squad for experience, even at the expense of one of the back three.

Because he's an idiot.

There's always a cynic.....

What's cynical about asking questions? I'd rather read your answers.

I was being ironic Rava .

Answers above....

profitius wrote:

Hookisms and Hyperbole wrote:

profitius wrote:

Hookisms and Hyperbole wrote:
To leave out the best 7 in Irish rugby (with apologies to the Chris Henry who has been excellent for the past 18 months and deserves his call up) in Shane Jennings and include O'Mahony is bizarre. O'Mahony isn't good enough at provincial level let alone international level. He will be in time, he is an excellent prospect, but right now he shouldn't be in the squad.

POM was one of Munsters best players last season and he was again at the weekend. Hes not the most likeable character but if you can't say he isn't good enough.

He isn't up to standard and his performances aren't up to Heineken Cup level never mind international. If Coughlan wasn't injured I don't see how he would even get into the Munster side. I am far more impressed with Sean Dougall than O'Mahony. He doesn't carry the ball well enough, he isn't big enough, he isn't physical enough and he is defensively poor from the back of the scrum. He can only tackle on one shoulder. Technically he isn't good enough yet. He will be I have no doubt, but he is nowhere near the standard required for international rugby. That Shane Jennings is left out and O'Mahony is in the squad is simply laughable. I really wonder if Kidney had actually watched a single minute of rugby this season to come to this decision.

POM is the same size as Heaslip and constantly gains ground when he has the ball. The other points you make is your opinion. The only one I agree with is his performance at the base of the scrum but then again that was just his second start of the season. Rory Best had a poor game against Castres but nobody was too critical considering it was his first start of the season.

Did best have a poor game against castres, the line out was solid, the scrum was dominant and he had good go forward ball in the loose. And it was his second game back, he stared against Connacht the week before.

Prof, none of them would have made the bench so perhaps they are better starting for thier provinces.
The team and the replacements is staring out of the page. Same old, same old guaranteed. It won't change until Kidney has gone.

BelfastDickVet wrote:
Did best have a poor game against castres, the line out was solid, the scrum was dominant and he had good go forward ball in the loose. And it was his second game back, he stared against Connacht the week before.

Bollix he did, based on what? I thought he had a brilliant game and he was MOTM last week(although should have been Henry).

Hookisms and Hyperbole wrote: O'Mahony can't cut it at provincial level, he shouldn't be in the international set up. I'm terribly sorry pudding if that means one less Munster player is in the squad. But sure at least you have ROG in there because he 100% deserves his all up.

If he can't cut it at provincial level, its kind of strange that he took over as Munster captain when Dougie went off last weekend. Not something you'd get if you can't cut it at provincial level.

rodders wrote:

BelfastDickVet wrote:
Did best have a poor game against castres, the line out was solid, the scrum was dominant and he had good go forward ball in the loose. And it was his second game back, he stared against Connacht the week before.

Bollix he did, based on what? I thought he had a brilliant game and he was MOTM last week(although should have been Henry).

Sorry that was meant to say "Did best have a poor game?" I left out the question mark. The rest of my statement was backing the point that he had a fantastic game which is contrary to what profitius said in a previous comment.

Hookisms. I dont want ROG in the side, I would like to see Madigan. Also how do you know what POM is like, or if he is likeable or not, do you know him? Oh and POM will be captain of ireland.

rodders wrote:

BelfastDickVet wrote:
Did best have a poor game against castres, the line out was solid, the scrum was dominant and he had good go forward ball in the loose. And it was his second game back, he stared against Connacht the week before.

Bollix he did, based on what? I thought he had a brilliant game and he was MOTM last week(although should have been Henry).

The lineout was iffy (lost a couple on Ulster's throw). It was better against Glasgow.

This is the team I think will start. It isn't the one I would pick but as I said above, same old....

Healy
Best
Ross
POC
Ryan
Ferris
Henry
Heaslip
Murray
Sexton
Zebo
Darcy
BOD
Bowe
Earls

Court
Cronin
DOC
POM
Reddan
ROG
McFadden

(Standby McLaughlin & Trimble, the rest back to their provinces)

Sin é wrote:

Hookisms and Hyperbole wrote: O'Mahony can't cut it at provincial level, he shouldn't be in the international set up. I'm terribly sorry pudding if that means one less Munster player is in the squad. But sure at least you have ROG in there because he 100% deserves his all up.

If he can't cut it at provincial level, its kind of strange that he took over as Munster captain when Dougie went off last weekend. Not something you'd get if you can't cut it at provincial level.

Chris Henry was Ulster captain before Muller arrived and when Henry's place in the Ulster side was marginal at times. I'm terribly sorry that I don't think a Munster player cuts the mustard. O'Mahony has been poor at 8 this season, and at 6 I don't think he would be in Munster's first XV. Even if he was he isn't as good as Ferris, McLaughlin or O'Brien. In fact would he be as good as Muldoon? O'Brien can cover all three positions better than O'Mahony, thought thankfully for POM he isn't fit. He shouldn't be in the squad. A talented player for the future not good enough at present.

Sin é wrote:

rodders wrote:

BelfastDickVet wrote:
Did best have a poor game against castres, the line out was solid, the scrum was dominant and he had good go forward ball in the loose. And it was his second game back, he stared against Connacht the week before.

Bollix he did, based on what? I thought he had a brilliant game and he was MOTM last week(although should have been Henry).

The lineout was iffy (lost a couple on Ulster's throw). It was better against Glasgow.

Absolutely correct but one of those was caused by a mistiming of the lift which had Muller almost horizontal.