Welsh Squad for Autumn Tests?

I'm not 100% sure of how many players are allowed in the team. I think it's about 35 though. So whilst considering injuries and and choosing players on form, this is what i think the team should be:

Props:
Gethin Jenkins
Paul James
Rhys Gill
Adam Jones
Samson Lee
Scott Andrews

Hookers:
Hibbard
Ken Owens
Matthew Rees

Locks:
Alyn Wyn Jones
Ian Evans
Bradley Davies
Andrew Coombs

Flankers:
Dan Lydiate
Sam Warburton
Justin Tipuric
Ryan Jones
Aaron Shingler

Number 8:
Toby Falateu
Morgan Allen

Scrum Half:
Mike Phillips
Richie Rees
Gareth Davies

Outside Half:
Dan Biggar
Rhys Priestland
Rhys Patchell

Centres:
Johnathan Davies
Ashley Beck
Scott Williams
Andrew Bishop

Wings:
George North
Alex Cuthbert
Eli Walker

Fullback:
Leigh Halpfenny
Liam Williams

Not Available (so far):
Craig Mitchell
Jamie Roberts

I think players like Morgan Allen, Andrew Bishop, Rhys Gill and Samson Lee all deserve at least a start against Tonga.
Rhys has been sharing the one jersey with Vunipolo but i have watched him once and he was solid, I hear he has been part of a strong Saracens scrum though. Plus Ryan Bevington hasn't really done much for the Ospreys so far this season.
8 for me with Wales is a big worry at the moment because with Toby injured and Ryan seen ore a a versatile substitute, however that's still only 1 cover for our starting 8. Morgan is young, fresh, strong and a great talents who is in form with the Ospreys. We need to start bringing youny 8's like Allen and Baker into the set up for the future. I mean Ryan isn't going to last much longer, we need someone know to start to challenge Toby and be a descent back up.
Bishop - is one of the most under rated players in Britain. Such a strong defender, on par with Barett in my eyes. A great player who is safe and has that experience.
Samson Lee -Been the best tightheads out of all the regions so far this season  (Adam has only just come back). A strong scrummager and would give the Tongan a good run for their money. Surly the successor for Adam when he retires. Obviously Adam to start against South Africa, Argentina and Australia but would rather Scott on the bench for those games. As much as i want Samson to shine NOW, he still needs to be bled into the set up first. SO one appearance against Tonga would be great.
Lastly, Patchell like Samson is still young and needs small steps into the set up. I think one appearance of the bench for Tonga would be nice for him. However we all know what can happen when we rush a young 10 into the spotlight. So even though i want him in the team for the experience, i hope were not forced to play him too much this Autumn.

fwiw, Charteris is expected to be back playing in a week or 2.

Rhys Gill, as far as I know, has made a good contribution to the Sarries' scrum over the past few seasons so no issue whatsoever with him being in the squad. Samson Lee I'm not so sure about, perhaps still a bit early. I notice he's starting more regularly this season but having limited access to Scarlets games, how is his scrummaging coming along? He was a beast for the U20s. Think Easterby ought to reunite him with Rob Evans soon enough, if they combine as strongly as before the Scarlets pack might just become a force.

Allen has been in the Ospreys' books for a couple of years and has only recently started breaking into the first XV. Still not significantly ahead of Bearman imo so not sold yet on the idea of him playing for Wales.

Can't say I've ever seen Richie Rees as a sustainable long-term option. He's become more of a journeyman than ever. Decent enough at club level, not so much the case internationally. Why not Dragons teammate Jonny Evans? Younger and seen by many as first-choice 9 at Dave Parade.

The rest it's difficult to argue with. Have been particularly impressed with Sanjay and Eli Walker of late.

Rees has been really good for the Dragons this season, really bosses our forwards and is very scrappy.

Gatland needs to have a look at our young cnetres too, Jack Dixon in particular

Whocares:
I know Luke is a good lock and have wondered when he was going to play back. however, he now like James Hook and Lee Byrne will start to drift away from the welsh set up and only be covers. Andrew Coombs is in good form with the Dragons know and at the helm of the team there. Plus Luke hasn't been playing so I can't see him being in the team. I can't see look being anywhere near the team at the moment.
I know what you mean about Morgan but he has been playing better than Bearman so far this season. He is still young as well (unlike Bearman) and has that time to develop. He has the size, strength and skill set, I think we should give him a shot.

Knowsit 17:
I understadn when you say it could be a bit too eraly and thats why im scared and it i a risk. I mean if he started agaisnt Tonga and had a bad day it could knock it confidence back a few miles. However he has been great so far ths season, ask anyone else. He has had stiff competition and stepped up every time. Am i 100% sure he is readt? No, but i am would be willing to take that risk because he shows so much promise at such a young age.
As for Richie, i have always rated him and think he is a safe scrum half option to have, better than Lloyd Williams and Rhys Webb. He has been in good form especially against the Scarlets (so i slightly hate him at the moment) and has been ok in the past for Wales (hasn't really done anything wrong); as for johnny Evans he isn't first choice at Dragons at the moment and if the welsh coaches were going to look to bring though a young scrum half, im pretty sure they would go for Rhodri Williams instead because he has only just come from Wales U20's age grade

Fair enough about Lee, I'd expect that's most people's assessment of him.

Rees has not done much wrong in a Welsh jersey no but hasn't looked that spectacular either. Personally I rate him more as impact off the bench, not been overly impressed on the few occasions Gatland has decided to start him. Like I said he's been around and not often managed to make the starting 9 berth his own. He was ousted by Lloyd Williams at the Blues (at the time Williams was playing much better than now) and last season was playing for what is currently one of the bottom Rabo sides (no offence intended to Edinburgh) so I stop short of endorsing him as a Welsh international. If he did start and have a stormer I might eat my words. If, as I consider more likely, he looked rather average for Wales it would only corroborate much of what I've just said.

I agree with almost all of it, you've clearly selected on form. However we will need Roberts as he's the glue that holds us together. He should be back for the autumn series, and I'd pick him over Bishop/Beck. I would also pick Dixon over those two. Some may think it's too early but I've watched him regulary and he looks ready; he's Gatland's type of ball-player, he's playing well and he hardly ever makes an error (which is a lot more than some can say). We'll only pick two 10's most likely, Priest and Biggar. If there is a third then it should be Tovey over an erratic Patchell. I'd also only consider Liam Williams a winger. We're clearly a bit light at 15 but I'd be willing to put faith in Dan Evans again, who has excelled during his time at Gwent. Apart from that, you're pretty much spot on.
  

Knowsit17 wrote:Rhys Gill, as far as I know, has made a good contribution to the Sarries' scrum over the past few seasons so no issue whatsoever with him being in the squad. Samson Lee I'm not so sure about, perhaps still a bit early. I notice he's starting more regularly this season but having limited access to Scarlets games, how is his scrummaging coming along? He was a beast for the U20s. Think Easterby ought to reunite him with Rob Evans soon enough, if they combine as strongly as before the Scarlets pack might just become a force.

If you've watched the Scarlets this season then you'd see Samson has been bossing his opponents, with perhaps a little help from John and Owens. I would also like to see him reunited with his U20's partner, we may get our wish tomorrow as Rob is on the bench.

*Just noticed that Lee isn't playing tomorrow...

Jhamer25 wrote:I'm not 100% sure of how many players are allowed in the team. I think it's about 35 though. So whilst considering injuries and and choosing players on form, this is what i think the team should be:

Props:
Gethin Jenkins
Paul James
Rhys Gill
Adam Jones
Samson Lee
Scott Andrews

Hookers:
Hibbard
Ken Owens
Matthew Rees

Locks:
Alyn Wyn Jones
Ian Evans
Bradley Davies
Andrew Coombs

Flankers:
Dan Lydiate
Sam Warburton
Justin Tipuric
Ryan Jones
Aaron Shingler

Number 8:
Toby Falateu
Morgan Allen

Scrum Half:
Mike Phillips
Richie Rees
Gareth Davies

Outside Half:
Dan Biggar
Rhys Priestland
Rhys Patchell

Centres:
Johnathan Davies
Ashley Beck
Scott Williams
Andrew Bishop

Wings:
George North
Alex Cuthbert
Eli Walker

Fullback:
Leigh Halpfenny
Liam Williams

Not Available (so far):
Craig Mitchell
Jamie Roberts

I think players like Morgan Allen, Andrew Bishop, Rhys Gill and Samson Lee all deserve at least a start against Tonga.
Rhys has been sharing the one jersey with Vunipolo but i have watched him once and he was solid, I hear he has been part of a strong Saracens scrum though. Plus Ryan Bevington hasn't really done much for the Ospreys so far this season.
8 for me with Wales is a big worry at the moment because with Toby injured and Ryan seen ore a a versatile substitute, however that's still only 1 cover for our starting 8. Morgan is young, fresh, strong and a great talents who is in form with the Ospreys. We need to start bringing youny 8's like Allen and Baker into the set up for the future. I mean Ryan isn't going to last much longer, we need someone know to start to challenge Toby and be a descent back up.
Bishop - is one of the most under rated players in Britain. Such a strong defender, on par with Barett in my eyes. A great player who is safe and has that experience.
Samson Lee -Been the best tightheads out of all the regions so far this season  (Adam has only just come back). A strong scrummager and would give the Tongan a good run for their money. Surly the successor for Adam when he retires. Obviously Adam to start against South Africa, Argentina and Australia but would rather Scott on the bench for those games. As much as i want Samson to shine NOW, he still needs to be bled into the set up first. SO one appearance against Tonga would be great.
Lastly, Patchell like Samson is still young and needs small steps into the set up. I think one appearance of the bench for Tonga would be nice for him. However we all know what can happen when we rush a young 10 into the spotlight. So even though i want him in the team for the experience, i hope were not forced to play him too much this Autumn.

Couple of queries if I may?

i. Why is only one player, 'Hibbard', referred to solely by his surname in this list? and
b. Is 'Andrew Bishop' a predicted spelling/typing error?

Come on Cas, FFS, he has taken the time to write all that and you pick him up on two mistakes. We all know who he means so why be so pedantic, unless you are extracting the urine, lighten up, god forbid you ever type anything thats not in the queens english. Please tell me you are teasing him.

I was teasing. I am sorry. I'm bored and I'm waiting for the game to start. I feel bad now.

Casartelli wrote:I was teasing.  I am sorry.  I'm bored and I'm waiting for the game to start.  I feel bad now.

Aaaargghhh damn it, you have made me feel bad now for not noticing the banter, perhaps it's me who needs to lighten up a bit, anyway, it's kick off. Back to the match thread.

Going on form, Bishop is ahead of Beck. And it wasn't a typo he was getting at LD. He was raising a point of Bishop being selected in the first place.

Not sure would have Bishop in there possibly would have Jordan Williams in there and use North as centre option.

Also now hes in Wales possible S Shingler to

I think most of the side picks itself but for me there are a few spots up for grabs mainly Nos 1, 9 & 12.

Jenkins plays his first game this weekend I think and for me James should start.

Phillips had a poor LIons tour and haven't heard what his form has been like this season and I would like to see G Davies given a shot.

Roberts is currently injured though hoping to be fit so if not then theres the 12 slot to fill. With Gatland always keen to favour established pairings we could see 2 of the 3 Scarlets centres filling the 12 & 13 shirt, either JD and Sc Williams or S Shingler and JD.

bedfordwelsh wrote:Not sure would have Bishop in there possibly would have Jordan Williams in there and use North as centre option.

Also now hes in Wales possible S Shingler to

Good shout actually. I do wnat to see him play centre at one point, i hope Northampton try it first to be honest.

Also
Yes well obviously Jamie would be in the team but I assumed he was out.
There are players like Dan Evans, Dixon, Shingler who all deserve shots.
My only query with Dixon is that he is still very very young and still with the U20's. I would just like him to play well for them first.
Isn't it great though we have the likes of Dixon, Allen and Owen Williams coming through.

Wait and see i guess but i if any of those players were in the squad, then i wouldn't have any problems with it.

Agree.

I havent stood on this soap box for a long while now but my opinion hasn't changed.

I still think we need the A Side back up and runing so thes youngsters can expeience the set up before getting maybe thrown in at the deep end.

Jordan Williams is a great talent. However his lack of experience and body language on the pitch, for me, rules him out of contention.

Bedford, it's just impractical to run an A Team.

NL,

Why so, other Countries run them and there is still a 6 Nations A tournament.

bedfordwelsh wrote:NL,

Why so, other Countries run them and there is still a 6 Nations A tournament.

So few countries run A-sides I can't see it as being worth the expense unless everyone did it. Plus the u20s caps prevent out young talent being poached by other nations.

Think Lewis Evans deserves a squad place this Autumn. Has delivered pretty standout performances (covering the whole of the backrow) and has been on the fringes before.

Rev,

I would have included him before now over the likes of McCusker and Turnbull.

NL,

Its not about stopping them being poached its more once they are to old for the U20s and if they don't then get a full call up some tend to drift and as for expense I would rather the expense be used on the A Side than sending the 7s all over the world.

Risca Rev wrote:Think Lewis Evans deserves a squad place this Autumn. Has delivered pretty standout performances (covering the whole of the backrow) and has been on the fringes before.

We were all saying this last year, only for McCusker and Turnbull to get picked ahead of him . I agree that he deserves a call-up, but I don't think his heart could take that again!

Risca Rev wrote:Think Lewis Evans deserves a squad place this Autumn. Has delivered pretty standout performances (covering the whole of the backrow) and has been on the fringes before.

Well Lewis Evans should definitely be ahead of Turnball, Mccusker, Pretorious. Really stood out as not just a good layer but a descent looking number 7 when i watched him against the Scarlet's.

Also i don't think I can see where Norfolk lass is coming from. But Bedford also makes a good case. I mean we have young stars like Dan Baker, Sam Davies, Nicky Thomas, Nicky Smith who  all aren't going to get enough game time for their regions this year.
This is why our regions need to work together to try and work out loan spells for these players to go to other regions who are struggling in those areas.
Like This
Nicky Smith and Thomas go on loan to the Dragons who are struggling for props
Sam Davies on loan to Cardiff Blues
Dan Baker on loan to Scarlet's
we have talent that isn't being used for the regions and these players need t come through quicker rather than later because of the current exodus of players. This mean these players need the game time at regional level to come along in development.

bedfordwelsh wrote:NL,

Why so, other Countries run them and there is still a 6 Nations A tournament.

Professional Rugby is barely sustainable in Wales. How could Wales afford a huge loss making A Team? How could the regions survive during the 6N with additional loss of players?

Bedford, there's hardly an A team comp. If they can afford to, they play each other once a year.

Jhamer25 wrote:

Risca Rev wrote:Think Lewis Evans deserves a squad place this Autumn. Has delivered pretty standout performances (covering the whole of the backrow) and has been on the fringes before.

Well Lewis Evans should definitely be ahead of Turnball, Mccusker, Pretorious. Really stood out as not just a good layer but a descent looking number 7 when i watched him against the Scarlet's.

Also i don't think I can see where Norfolk lass is coming from. But Bedford also makes a good case. I mean we have young stars like Dan Baker, Sam Davies, Nicky Thomas, Nicky Smith who  all aren't going to get enough game time for their regions this year.
This is why our regions need to work together to try and work out loan spells for these players to go to other regions who are struggling in those areas.
Like This
Nicky Smith and Thomas go on loan to the Dragons who are struggling for props
Sam Davies on loan to Cardiff Blues
Dan Baker on loan to Scarlet's
we have talent that isn't being used for the regions and these players need t come through quicker rather than later because of the current exodus of players. This mean these players need the game time at regional level to come along in development.

The best way for these guys to get exposure at a higher level, is entering Regional A teams into the B & I cup. Then we'll know who can step up.

Norfolklass wrote:

bedfordwelsh wrote:NL,

Why so, other Countries run them and there is still a 6 Nations A tournament.

Professional Rugby is barely sustainable in Wales. How could Wales afford a huge loss making A Team? How could the regions survive during the 6N with additional loss of players?

Don't play Regional games in International windows.

Squad size is generally around thirty rather than thirty five. Gatland has even selected small twenty eight man squads before. I guess larger as we will get mucked about by English clubs not releasing players for Australia.

Jenkins
James
Hibbard
Owens
Jones
Lee

AWJ
Evans
Davies
Coombs

Warburton
Tipuric
Lydiate
Faletau
Shingler
Jones

Phillips
Williams
Davies

Biggar
Priestland

Davies
Williams
Beck
Shingler

North
Cuthbert
Walker
Williams
Halfpenny

Is Jughead's injury going to be sorted by then? I thought he may be struggling with a nerve injury?

Risca Rev wrote:Think Lewis Evans deserves a squad place this Autumn. Has delivered pretty standout performances (covering the whole of the backrow) and has been on the fringes before.

Wasn't he selected for the Welsh training squad a season or so ago but got injured ?

munkian wrote:

Risca Rev wrote:Think Lewis Evans deserves a squad place this Autumn. Has delivered pretty standout performances (covering the whole of the backrow) and has been on the fringes before.

Wasn't he selected for the Welsh training squad a season or so ago but got injured ?

Tough call between the backrow. Lewis Evans is superb, in the best form I have seen him. If Ryan Jones hasn't recovered then he will surely be in. It's a close call between RJ, Shingler and Lewis Evans.

Another nice 'problem' to have. We only lack depth in quality 8s. No one is near Faletau

Again its the problem of how much do we experiment and risk losing games or do we go all out for victories with our full strength side etc.

Depends how much we care about meaningless one off games and IRB rankings compared to developing depth for the next RWC I guess  

I wouldn't make any left field selections but there are a few 'safe' options

munkian,

If the 6 nations this year ended up same as last after our disastorous AI series then who cares lol.

I agree nothing major and to be honest anything bar our 1st XV against the Boks and we will get hammered after what I saw on weekend.

I think decent gametime for a Gill or James, a No3, No9 and genuine cover for Roberts would be worth looking at.

After two rounds of the HC I suspect the squad will have a different group of players starting the AI's. Last year's AI's, the team was further decimated by the time we played Australia hence there is a chance for new players to come in (such as front row players).

Someone other than Mcusker would be nice, outplayed at the Dave Parade the other week but he'll still get more welsh caps as 'west is best'  
 
I'd tout some Dragons players as contendors but stuff it, I want a strong Dragon's squad

glamorganalun wrote:After two rounds of the HC I suspect the squad will have a different group of players starting the AI's. Last year's AI's, the team was further decimated by the time we played Australia hence there is a chance for new players to come in (such as front row players).

alun,

I can't see many changes regardless of HC results, the core of the squad is pretty much settled. There may be a few youngsters in there for the experience etc.

I was reffering to injuries with players being beaten up prior and during the AI's just like last year.

Anyone predict any new surprises?

Andrew Coombs was a great addition to the squad last year. Maybe Lewis Evans, Gareth Davies or Rhys Patchell could be similar this year?

Many more suggestions are possible.

glamorganalun wrote:I was reffering to injuries with players being beaten up prior and during the AI's just like last year.

Yh fair one Alun players are always carrying bumps n bruises these days and any little knock can aggravate them.

Maes,

I think we will see Patchell or Tovey in there as 3rd No10 I hope we see Lewis Evans in there and then either Davies or even Rees in as 3rd No9

bedfordwelsh wrote:

glamorganalun wrote:I was reffering to injuries with players being beaten up prior and during the AI's just like last year.

Yh fair one Alun players are always carrying bumps n bruises these days and any little knock can aggravate them.

Maes,

I think we will see Patchell or Tovey in there as 3rd No10 I hope we see Lewis Evans in there and then either Davies or even Rees in as 3rd No9

I am still not a fan of Rees. Good player but can't play at international level, he's just not bright enough.

Lewis Evans is having a great time this season. Could be better than Lydiate soon. And that's some accolade.

Rees has been on very good form this season and by my reckoning outside Phillips our other choices are Ll Williams, Knoyle and G Davies I would have Rees over Williams and Knoyle.

Is like to see more of Jonny Evans at the dragons. He was a great player last season...!

Agree Maes and was a shame he didn't go to Japan in the summer. Early signs are that Rees is starting more with Evans coming on later in the game so I guess we will have to see how the season goes.

To be fair to Rees, it does appear there is a noticeable difference when he doesn't play. Maybe that's partly to do with Tovey as well, but their game management has been good and that's probably where Rees has the edge over Jon Evs at the mo. He's probably a bit more bossy to his pack as well.

Him and Tovey have hit it off very well very quickly

Maybe they'll start Evans on Friday