England Squad for NZ Tour and 6N

First topic message reminder :

And I've posed it in that order for a reason. England have already said that their objective is to win the 6N (with France away first up, that's a pretty big ask...) but thy also have a 3 game tour to NZ coming up in which the first game will be played without the AP finalists.

So the challenge is - how do you put together the 6N squad so that whoever makes the final, you have enough players who've played together by the end of the 6N that England can field a half-decent side with players from the top two sides missing? I suppose the good news is that for once the EPS is a nice mix of players from various teams, but a Saints-Sarries final would be a serious hindrance.

The EPS on 1 Aug looked like this. Who would be your squad? And how would you prepare them?

England senior EPS:

Forwards: David Attwood (Bath Rugby), Dan Cole (Leicester Tigers), Alex Corbisiero (Northampton Saints), Tom Croft (Leicester Tigers), Dylan Hartley (Northampton Saints), Matt Kvesic (Gloucester Rugby), Joe Launchbury (London Wasps), Courtney Lawes (Northampton Saints), Joe Marler (Harlequins), Ben Morgan (Gloucester Rugby), Geoff Parling (Leicester Tigers), Chris Robshaw (Harlequins), Billy Vunipola (Saracens), Mako Vunipola (Saracens), David Wilson (Bath Rugby), Tom Wood (Northampton Saints), Tom Youngs (Leicester Tigers)

Backs: Chris Ashton (Saracens), Brad Barritt (Saracens), Mike Brown (Harlequins), Freddie Burns (Gloucester Rugby), Danny Care (Harlequins), Lee Dickson (Northampton Saints), Owen Farrell (Saracens), Toby Flood (Leicester Tigers), Ben Foden (Northampton Saints), Alex Goode (Saracens), Kyle Eastmond (Bath Rugby), Manusamoa Tuilagi (Leicester Tigers), Billy Twelvetrees (Gloucester Rugby), Christian Wade (London Wasps), Marland Yarde (London Irish), Ben Youngs (Leicester Tigers)

England Saxons:

Forwards: Calum Clark (Northampton Saints), Jordan Crane (Leicester Tigers), Paul Doran Jones (Harlequins), Will Fraser (Saracens), James Haskell (London Wasps), Tom Johnson (Exeter Chiefs), Graham Kitchener (Leicester Tigers), George Kruis (Saracens), Kearnan Myall (London Wasps), David Paice (London Irish), George Robson (Harlequins), Ed Slater (Leicester Tigers), Henry Thomas (Sale Sharks), Thomas Waldrom (Leicester Tigers), Luke Wallace (Harlequins), Rob Webber (Bath Rugby), Nick Wood (Gloucester Rugby)

Backs: Anthony Allen (Leicester Tigers), Luther Burrell (Northampton Saints), Elliot Daly (London Wasps), George Ford (Bath Rugby), Jonathan Joseph (Bath Rugby), Jonny May (Gloucester Rugby), Ugo Monye (Harlequins), Stephen Myler (Northampton Saints), Jack Nowell (Exeter Chiefs), Charlie Sharples (Gloucester Rugby), Joe Simpson (London Wasps), David Strettle (Saracens), Mathew Tait (Leicester Tigers), Joel Tomkins (Saracens), Richard Wigglesworth (Saracens)

http://www.express.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/445531/England-s-Chris-Ashton-blames-Stuart-Lancaster-s-strategies-for-being-easy-prey

Interesting what Ashton says about Stuart Lancaster's gameplan not utilising him enough.

England have been quite poor at utilising the back three in general too.

I mention this because Ashton has been in decent club form this season - especially in the HC.

Quite a few posters here have pointed out that the gameplan - whatever it is supposed to be - doesn't play to Ashton's strengths.

I'd rather see us run moves which do suit him but you'd hope a top winger could still be effective in a different set-up. The problem with Ashton, is that he has sometimes looked plain bad when things haven't gone his way (less so this season).

Not sure it's wise of him to be airing this in public, even though what he actually says doesn't seem to be meant as a criticism of Lancaster.

I too think Burrell should be given a shout in the 6N, preferably alongside 12Trees in the centres. I wouldn't mind seeing him slot in a 13 as his physical attributes seem like they could offer an able replacement for Manu although it would be interesting to see how he would respond to the slight variation of positional requirements.

On another note, I read in the telegraph today that Lancs will still have to name players who are injured in his revised EPS squad come Jan so that they maybe available for the summer tour. A case in point is Croft, who despite being out for the season may still be included on the chance he becomes available for NZ. Personally I don't see the point in taking Croft, or any of the other long term injured, on that tour even if they manage to get in a few games before the end of the season. Surely it would make more sense from a player welfare point of view to properly prepare and condition their bodies prior to the 2014/2015 season?

BS,

That report really concerns me. Every top team in the world have their wingers popping up all over...even at schoolboy level your encouraged to go looking for the ball when the opportunity arises...its called intelligence.

If lancaster is coaching this OUT of players then its a HUGE issue for me. I dont want my wingers just sitting on the wing waiting for the ball. I want them actively seeking opportunities to make plays, create overlaps, i want them on the shoulder of Morgan/ vunipola etc taking offloads.

Also makes you wonder what Owen Farrell is being told to do? i.e No risk, stand deep??

Wouldn't it be Mike Catt coaching this rather then Lancaster though?

Mike Catt who has almost zero coaching experience and is totally unproven...

Rugby fan I agree. Ashton perhaps shouldn't be airing it in public but he does make good points.

jamesandimac perhaps you are right about Burrell starting at 13 but not sure I agree someone getting their first cap out of position. Agree about Croft, you could see that with Lydiate for Wales and the Lions - Gatland undeservedly shoehorned him into the Lions squad when he had just come back from a long layoff. Guess what - he got injured again.

Players do need a rest - it's no coincidence that so many players who took part in the Lions tour have had injuries.

Geordiefalcon I agree with you.

I certainly believe Farrell Jr is being instructed to stand deep and take less risks. Only need to compare his play for England compared to Saracens.

It's difficult to know how much influence Farrell Sr has on this. I want to see more influence from Mike Catt. What does he do?

If this is genuine, then im very concerned where Lancaster is trying to take us.

Do you see Aussie, Kiwi, SA wings sitting waiting for the ball?
Look at players like Campese, Kirwin, Lomu, Robinson, Shane Williams, etc etc all classed as greats because they wanted the ball and werent prepared to sit and wait for it.

The other thing is that we cant say this is Farrells rugby league influence...as rugby league wingers are encouraged to go looking for the ball.

So are we looking at a regimented structure, that will create limited chances out wide so our wingers have to stay out there in case one of the few chances come about...

Also...Catt might not have any say in it...as Lancaster will dictate the overall play

We don't know for certain that the coaches are telling the wings not to roam.

It was evident that our defence in the Autumn was often quite narrow. We got away with it against the Wallabies but New Zealand constantly exploited it. It's possible that players have been told to not to cramp up in the middle and Ashton interprets that as being told to stay out more.

The big problem recently has been injuries have hit us and the replacements just haven't worked. Eastmond and Trinder would surely have got a run out at 13 if not for injuries and off field problems and Tomkins didn't have the best of times. The choice of Wade and Yarde would have provided something very different to what we got (different not neccessarily better). I'm fully expecting a more rounded performance in the 6N and I do think we should be looking to win it at the very least.

But to be fair to him, Ashtons interpretation would appear to be the same as what most England fans have been saying...and its what we are visibly seeing on the pitch.

But then in my head...i keep thinking .....surely the England international rugby coach along with Andy Farrell and Mike Catt wouldnt be so negative in their tactics / instructions?

no 7 and 1/2 I know people like to champion Eastmond and Trinder but are they really that good?

Eastmond has mostly been kept out of the 13 shirt by Joseph. Trinder has been part of an underperforming Gloucester side. I am just not convinced yet.

Wade and Yarde seem to suit the way Lancaster wants to play more as they look to beat men one on one whereas Ashton is a very different player. I feel that England have not utilised Ashton well enough. Everyone knows his strengths and weaknesses yet he's not encouraged to go with his strengths, he's also less confident for England too because of the criticism.

It's just not Ashton that has suffered. The England back three overall for England hasn't really been used effectively as an attacking force throughout Lancaster's tenure. When you are putting full backs on the wing half the time........

Not sure until I see them in the team for a couple of games to be honest. I've read somewhere that Trinder was going to be tried before a knock and Eastmond was released to work through some personal issues. If that's true, and to be fair I haven't seen quotes from Lancaster, they would offer a very different option to Tomkins who didn't look at his best.

I wouldn't be surprised if someone new is tried in place of Ashton simply to build more depth and options.

Tomkins was poor I agreed but he was effectively thrown in the deep end.

It just doesn't feel me with confidence if those two of the favourites for the 13 shirt.

Agree someone new could well be tried instead of Ashton.

Ive defended Tomkins alot on here. Very harsh to single him out, when he received barely any decent ball and was playing his first 3 international games against...Australia, Argentina then NZ!
He did not bad considering.

Its all just too stagnant and predictable in the backs.

Look at the top sides...they have players running dummy lines, hitting angles, wingers popping up everywhere etc etc...for the defence its very unpredictable...but look at us and its so easy to defend...

Not really my intention to single him just to highlight the fact that I don't think he was 1st choice there, offers a different skill set to those who I believe were ahead of him so the game plan changes a bit. As beshocked says he was really thrown in there. That said he did not play well. Like I said I expect we'll see a more rounded performance in the 6N, or failing that a shuffling of the coaches.

I know it's early days but what do people think of Henry Slade at Exe Chiefs? I watched the Toulon game and was impressed. One for after 2015 but seems to be developing well.

I don't necessarily think Lancaster is telling the wingers to stay on their wing the whole game and await the ball. If you look at how England have progressed since the 6N, their attacking play has seen the blindside wingers coming into the lineoff on attacking play, specifically on strike moves, something Yarde and Wade did to good effect.

What i think he's getting at is when its on and the specific moves are being called then they join in. When its broken, unstrucutred play he wants them to keep their width and create space across the park by stretching the opposition defence. Also when the attack progresses on with the big ball carriers we now have in the pac, space will undoubtly open up out wide and we have the over lap, something which happened on numerous occasions during the autumn.

Where we have struggled compared to the southern hemisphere sides is our ability to take advantage of the space we've created for ourselves. The majority of the time the handing is too slow and inaccurate, with our 13 this autumn making only 4 passes the whole series, and none in the ABs game! When we have had the overlap we've wasted our best handlers by sending them on predictable decoy lines which have done nothing to fix the drifting defence and when the ball eventually does reach our wide men they are too flat and too lateral to make any effect against the opposition defence.

I don't think we're too far away from having a very good attacking team, there's only one or 2 pieces of the jigsaw which need looking at and we should be there, prodomendtly a balanced midfield and some genuine scorers on the wings. Had it not been for injuries i fully believe Lancaster and his cohorts would've rectified a lot of the questions we are asking.

Ashton may feel that he's not being utilised correctly, however he is a winger first and foremost and he had opportunities this autumn which he left on the field.

Not so sure James...

It seems that the whole system is dependant on Manu being there and has broken down with him missing. Simply cant have a team as reliant as that on one player.

Burrell might be a similar type on this seasons form...with Twelvetrees switching on plays...

Actually i fully expect to see a Barritt / Twelvetrees midfield with them swapping on attack and defence.

Actually if we think back to the last 6N's Manu was hardly getting used at all except as a flanker at the rucks.

He got very little ball with most of the ball from 10 being kicked, passed to Brad/36 to bash up the middle or going straight to the wings.

We all spent most of the 6N's complaining that Manu wasn't imposing himself on the game!

If we play Burrell I'd personally put him at 12 with Twelvetrees at 13.

As said they can interchange when needed and Billy will likely spend some time at first receiver (hopefully anyway). I'd just rather have him in his preferred position for his first international games. Also Billy has spent a bit of time at 13 for the Tigers and looked good when he did.

I probably sound like a broken record at this stage but despite how impressive Burrell has been I still really want to see us try a nimbler and quicker 13 outside of Twelvetrees to try to offer a threat in the outside channels again. Trinder (or Daly if he wasn't being played at FB!) would suit that role well IMO.

Beshocked - Agree George is finally delivering on his promise now he's been given a run of games. Given how key a position hooker is and how well Webber is performing I'd like to 3 hookers in the EPS and Saxons. Whoever doesn't make the 23 from Hartley, Youngs and Webber can go back to their club then use the Saxons to let the youngsters show what they can do.

EPS

Props - Marler, Vunipola, Cole, Wilson, Brookes - Developing that third TH is vital and Brookes has really impressed when played
Hooker - Hartley, Youngs, Webber
Locks - Launchbury, Lawes, Attwood, Slater - Slater just over Kitchener for the option of some real bulk
Flanker - Robshaw, Wood, Kvesic, Haskell, Garvey - I know Garvey won't happen but still...
Number 8 - Billy V, Morgan

Scrum half - Youngs, Care, Dickson
Fly half - Farrell, Flood, Burns
Centre - Twelvetrees, Trinder, Burrell, Eastmond and one of Barritt/Allen - Whoever returns the stronger from injury
Wing - May, Nowell, Ashton
Full back - Brown, Watson and Tait if he returns strongly - Harsh on Goode but I want real pace in the back three again

Saxons

Prop - Mullan, Wood, Doran-Jones, Thomas, Knight - Again develop the THs
Hooker - Buchanan, George, Lindsay
Lock - Kitchener, Kruis, Myall, Barrow
Flanker - Johnson, Wallace, Fearns, Clark
Number 8 - Crane and Ewers? Can't say I know what's happening with him but he's playing extremely well!

Scrum half - Robson, Wigglesworth, Simpson
Fly half - Ford, Cipriani - Not his biggest fan but on form he deserves the spot
Centre - Allen/Barritt (whoever isn't in EPS), Joseph, Daly, AN Other?
Wing - Benjamin, Sharples, Walker, Strettle
Full back - Goode, Abendanon

Some out there calls in the EPS I accept with Watson/Tait over Goode and Brookes over Thomas/PDJ but those are the kind of squads I'd be looking at currently. Given the injuries to key players I'd say both actually look pretty strong if well utilised.

No Attwood?

Also, Brookes over PDJ isn't out there, it's definitely the right call

GeordieFalcon wrote:Not so sure James...

It seems that the whole system is dependant on Manu being there and has broken down with him missing. Simply cant have a team as reliant as that on one player.

Burrell might be a similar type on this seasons form...with Twelvetrees switching on plays...

Actually i fully expect to see a Barritt / Twelvetrees midfield with them swapping on attack and defence.

I have to agree here, I do think that we'll see a combo of Barritt and 12Trees come 6Ns time, providing Barritt completes his comeback. I have to say though that, as well as they did together against Scotland and Ireland last year, I think the partnership lacks balance, especially in attack.

When you say the whole system is dependant on Manu being there, that's because for the past 2 seasons he's been our main attacking outlet in the midfield and at 13 we don't have any depth. We need that balance from 9 - 13 in order to get the most out of our back three, and not just rely on 1 player to give us the go forward. This is something we've struggled with for some time. Now that we've got the pack sorted this autumn, with a good balance both in the line up and the way they play, we need to find a back line capable of making the most of the opportunities they create whilst still keeping the structure.

For me the Dickson, Farrell, Twelvetrees and Tomkins line up we saw in the autumn doesn't do this and never will. Neither will including Barritt. Defensively its very strong, but that's about all. We need to establish our best 9/10 partnership and the best midfield partnership. That should be Lancaster's next priority.

Just for confirmation, what's the number changes can Lancaster make for his EPS 6Nations Squad?

Corbisiero, Parling, Croft, Tuilagi, Wade, Yarde?

ChequeredJersey wrote:No Attwood?

In the EPS mate. He'd be on the bench backing up Launchbury and Lawes at the moment for me. Great player for the role as well as he offers the ability to run the line-out combined with real physicality in attack and defence - a player of his bulk could help sort out our frailties around the fringes no end.

Also interesting to hear someone in strong agreement about Brookes. Since slimming down a bit over the summer he has looked great whenever I've seen him play for the Falcons. Really can't work out why he's been in and out of the side much of the time. Some of it is down to injury but a lot of the time he's been left out with little information as to why from Deano etc. Similar situation with Grant Sheils (impressive whenever I've seen him) getting benched in favour of Rob Vickers as well.

Sorry I seem to be blind today!

Also interesting to hear someone in strong agreement about Brookes. Since slimming down a bit over the summer he has looked great whenever I've seen him play for the Falcons. Really can't work out why he's been in and out of the side much of the time. Some of it is down to injury but a lot of the time he's been left out with little information as to why from Deano etc. Similar situation with Grant Sheils (impressive whenever I've seen him) getting benched in favour of Rob Vickers as well..

Yeah all sorts of strange things going on. The falcons front rowers are looking very impressive - Brookes and Scott Wilson really looking impressive at TH, McGuigan looking like a potentially top hooker (represented Ireland u19s but born in England) and Shiells for Scotland.
I think Dean is just managing them well, giving them gametime in the development team and seniors. Dont forget brookes had a lot of injury problems and fitness issues, so probably just managing him wisely.

King carlos I must say I am quite confused by your options at prop. Particularly the Gloucester ones. I thought there was the common feeling that their frontrow is very weak hence their poor form. Also Paul Doran Jones has barely played for Quins has he?

Surely someone like Waller from Saints should be in the Saxons? Also how has Collier done recently for Quins?

Of course I am biased but another loosehead to watch out for is Richard Barrington of Sarries. Signed from Jersey last season, he's made good progress since trial by fire vs Saints. Shouldn't necessarily be in the Saxons yet but I would say he's done more than the likes of Wood and Mullan.


Perhaps you just picked the likes of Wood and Mullan because you've heard of them.

Tait is injured, it would be ridiculous to put him in the EPS.

Collier did OK against Saints and Sarries (despite having Easter behind him instead of a proper lock), had a tough time against Newcastle but went very well against Racing (with Charlie Matthews backing him up for the first time this season).

PDJ has been injured for most of the season until 2 weeks ago, and hasn't added much from the bench. However, it generally takes a while for a new prop to adapt to being in a new team, and John Kingston has a track record of producing decent props, so I expect him to improve.

All of which said, I stand by my prediction that by the end of the season Collier will be the first choice TH at Quins.

Poorfour do you think Collier deserves to be in the Saxons?

Too soon for Collier, let him have a full season at first choice

Who would you select for the Saxons BS

Maybe, but then I'm biased. In the normal run of things, I'd want to see if he could sustain it for a season and take a look over the summer. But given we're 2 years from a world cup and a bit light on tight heads, I think Lancaster may need to look at some new options.

I'd like to see at least one new TH trialled in the Saxons. I think Collier's a contender but it will depend on how the other young THs are going and I am not close enough to know. Brookes probably has the edge in experience, but Collier seems to have the kind of resilience and engine that Marler has, which is handy in a prop.

Geordiefalcon you mean in the props or in general? I'll just throw out a bunch of random suggestions of mine.

Kitchener should be in the EPS in my opinion as basically a replacement for Parling.

Would love to see a Slater-Kruis Saxons 2nd row partnership.

It's silly but 6 and 7 really worry me if Wood or Robshaw get injured. No other 6 or 7 fills me with confidence.

Robshaw is deserved starter at 7 but after him the cupboard is quite bare. Ksevic doesn't seem to be doing the business for Gloucester. Fraser is long term injured. Bit of a risk but perhaps Wallace needs to be in the EPS if he's doing well.

At 6 there are plenty of potentially good candidates but none stand out above the rest. Garvey should definitely be in the Saxons though.

Again I feel another Sarries guy should at least be on the radar - Jackson Wray but don't expect him to be picked for the Saxons. Not a big fan of Clark so would pick Wray ahead of him. Wouldn't be upset or surprised if he misses out though.

Heres a few interesting ones im going to throw out there...

Mark Wilson our 6, easily our best and most consistant player for the last 3 years...worth a look in the Saxons?
(possibly seen as the same as Tom Johnson...fantastic for his club maybe not quite the next level)

And.....Andy Saull is back playing some great rugby after injury...is that a potential 7?

And on this seasons performances with us...Dom Barrow...worth a look in the saxons?

I agree Garvey MUST be in the squad now...if hes not then theres a definate personal clash there.

My Saxons side:

Mullan, Webber, Brookes
Slater, Kruis
Garvey, Wallace
Ewers
?
Ford
Nowell
Eastmond
Trinder
Walker
May

?,George, Collier, Matthews, Fearns, ?, Slade, Tait

Obviously that's not taking any of the current choices into account and all wishful thinking. But I think it is a good team thats rewarding the form youngsters and will at least give a few youngsters a chance to shine.

Dan Robson at 9!

And I'm hoping May will be starting on the wing, so maybe Watson at full back? Possible wishful thinking though

What about Daly?

GeordieFalcon wrote:Heres a few interesting ones im going to throw out there...

Mark Wilson our 6, easily our best and most consistant player for the last 3 years...worth a look in the Saxons?
(possibly seen as the same as Tom Johnson...fantastic for his club maybe not quite the next level)

And.....Andy Saull is back playing some great rugby after injury...is that a potential 7?

And on this seasons performances with us...Dom Barrow...worth a look in the saxons?

I agree Garvey MUST be in the squad now...if hes not then theres a definate personal clash there.

I know you and I have craiced about this before, but I genuinely believe that Dom Barrow should be looked at as a priority (as biased as I am ). He is one of few genuine young lineout locks around. Aside from him there is Geoff Parling, Graham Kitchener and Courtney Lawes (only just starting to call the lineouts) who else is there? It’s a genuine question because I can’t think of any right now.

G Robson, though I wouldn't pick him for England

Dom Barrow is a sensational young player and will hopefully develop really well under Deano. I just hope Falcons can keep hold of these young players (I know he came from Leeds) because getting regular game time in the Jeff is the best thing for them. As someone might have advised young Alex Gray, Micky Youngs, Kieran Brookes etc....

I think it's six general changes plus injury call ups can be made in Jan so we're potentially looking at quite a few players coming in.

Jonny May and Jack Nowell would be my wing choices at the moment although I think it's still a bit early for Nowell we don't have many other decent options. I can see Lancs calling up Watson to play on the wing though.

Kitchener finally deserves to be in the EPS and Parling might find it hard to get back in to the Tigers side when he returns from injury.

Ewers i'd like to see in the Saxons for Crane. If he'd accept that is. I remember Ben Morgan turned England down when he was offered a Saxons place.

Young Charlie Matthews has gone well in the couple of games he's played for Quins but too soon yet. Charlie Walker looks like he's really keen to stake a claim at Quins and is one to watch out for. Has played some wonderful stuff for the U20s mainly at 13.

Wallace could come in for Kvesic who hasn't hit the highlights at all this season.

Cumbrian wrote:

GeordieFalcon wrote:Heres a few interesting ones im going to throw out there...

Mark Wilson our 6, easily our best and most consistant player for the last 3 years...worth a look in the Saxons?
(possibly seen as the same as Tom Johnson...fantastic for his club maybe not quite the next level)

And.....Andy Saull is back playing some great rugby after injury...is that a potential 7?

And on this seasons performances with us...Dom Barrow...worth a look in the saxons?

I agree Garvey MUST be in the squad now...if hes not then theres a definate personal clash there.

I know you and I have craiced about this before, but I genuinely believe that Dom Barrow should be looked at as a priority (as biased as I am ).  He is one of few genuine young lineout locks around.  Aside from him there is Geoff Parling, Graham Kitchener and Courtney Lawes (only just starting to call the lineouts) who else is there? It’s a genuine question because I can’t think of any right now.

Kearnan Myall is in the Saxons, a good line-out caller. Christian Day has played for the Saxons and runs an excellent line-out. George Kruis is learning from Borthwick so should be a top line-out lock next season.

Isnt Ewers Zimbabwean...so whats the chance of him wanting to play for England? Could he make the SA team like Beast etc have?

Chjw131 wrote:

Cumbrian wrote:

GeordieFalcon wrote:Heres a few interesting ones im going to throw out there...

Mark Wilson our 6, easily our best and most consistant player for the last 3 years...worth a look in the Saxons?
(possibly seen as the same as Tom Johnson...fantastic for his club maybe not quite the next level)

And.....Andy Saull is back playing some great rugby after injury...is that a potential 7?

And on this seasons performances with us...Dom Barrow...worth a look in the saxons?

I agree Garvey MUST be in the squad now...if hes not then theres a definate personal clash there.

I know you and I have craiced about this before, but I genuinely believe that Dom Barrow should be looked at as a priority (as biased as I am ).  He is one of few genuine young lineout locks around.  Aside from him there is Geoff Parling, Graham Kitchener and Courtney Lawes (only just starting to call the lineouts) who else is there? It’s a genuine question because I can’t think of any right now.

Kearnan Myall is in the Saxons, a good line-out caller. Christian Day has played for the Saxons and runs an excellent line-out. George Kruis is learning from Borthwick so should be a top line-out lock next season.

Also obviously Borthwick is retiring next season so George Kruis is bound to be given more responsibility, in all likelihood in the lineout.

GeordieFalcon wrote:Isnt Ewers Zimbabwean...so whats the chance of him wanting to play for England? Could he make the SA team like Beast etc have?

He would have to have 3 years living there to do so. Qualifies for England through residency at least and I think 1 set of grandparents.

I have to say Lawes impressed me alot in the AI's. If he can put those type of performances out consistantly for England then he's going to be hard to move from that spot...as he'll continue to improve in the lineout...but his physicality gives him the edge as a lineout guy.

Him and Launchbury looked a very good combo...but it could equally be with a big lump like Attwood or the younger Matthews etc etc.
Add in Garvey at 6...then the pack takes on a new level of power and physicality.

GeordieFalcon wrote:I have to say Lawes impressed me alot in the AI's. If he can put those type of performances out consistantly for England then he's going to be hard to move from that spot...as he'll continue to improve in the lineout...but his physicality gives him the edge as a lineout guy.

Him and Launchbury looked a very good combo...but it could equally be with a big lump like Attwood or the younger Matthews etc etc.
Add in Garvey at 6...then the pack takes on a new level of power and physicality.

Hopefully Attwood will get a start in the 6N. I'd also like to see someone else come onto the flank so that if Wood or Robshaw are out there's a viable alternative. My preference would be for a 6, be that Garvey, Fearns or Haskell. I'd be equally happy to see Wallace come in for a start however. For the Italy game i'd like to see a pack of 1. M Vunipola 2. D Hartley 3. D Wilson 4. D Attwood 5. C Lawes 6. C Fearns 7. C Robshaw 8. B Morgan - that is a really heavy duty pack spoilt for carriers. Might need some of Dan Cole's breakdown work over Wilson's carrying but would be nice to see some alternatives get some game time leading into a tough summer tour and AIs.

No doubt we're more likely to see Clark now he's started one game for Saints. He actually played very well against Leinster as pointed out above. One good game in two seasons though doesn't seem enough to keep an England spot to me thugh.