The Scottish International Rugby Thread

[R!skysports]

First topic message reminder :

As a die hard Scotland rugby supporter, over the years I have been dragged through the mill. Poor selections, poor coaches and poor players.

Through thick and thin I have bleed blue, but is it time to say, enough is enough.

The incompetence and down right corruption* at the sru means I have been supporting a system and structure that, is to be frank, not deserving of my support.

When is it time to say, enough is enough. You shall not take my support for granted, and I will not support that was of space that is the sru.

Can we evoke change and move away from the old blazers who are destroying our game

Should we stop watching our team who currently make a fool of themselves


I am getting close to saying yes. I am almost at the point I do not care about our team And will sod off to go shopping this weekend


Our continued passion means our support ratifies the sru. Is it time to go on strike to show our displeasure, even if that means we miss out of watching our passion.

Can we affect the outcome

Your a dispirited and depressed Scotsman




*no proof of real corruption, but certainly an ability to corrupt the supporter


BUT I SUPPORT SCOTLAND TO THE END - GO SCOTLAND

(edited text, as the super duper mix tape of threads needed a most positive intro :-)

[Nachos Jones]

Des never played rugby though.

Anyway, he's stuck here in Bulldog-land for a while now I would say. I did hear rumours that he might go to the Eels if anything but that seems to have fallen through. I'm not so sure he would give up the lifestyle & financial incentive to swap codes and set up digs in Edinburgh though.

The John Kirwan suggestion is a good one. How about him and Robbie Deans?  

I know that Hasler has never played rugby but I really like the way he coaches and I feel his discipline and motivation would do wonders for the Scottish side.

Its something that I have thought about for a while and I really think that it would be a great partnership. Will never happen though

[R!skysports]

I wonder if Blair will find positives this week?

[Pal Joey]

Oh OK. I'll pass your kind sentiments onto Des then.   

[kiakahaaotearoa]

You really are admirable turning up to support. Cotter must be champing at the bit to get to this lot! That said, I hope he turns strips off their hides much like strips should be taken out of SJ's hair at the back. That was a horrific display yesterday. This weekend it has been a shut out of both sides from Ireland and Scotland but really it's been two in a row for Scotland. Certainly bleak times and I feel sorry for the die hard supporters because yesterday I'm afraid I started playing pool during the match. I couldn't take the pain. The old man was probably turning in his grave at my cowardly abandon but it's difficult to retain a sense of humour when you see such lack of endeavour.

[mystiroakey]

I have much to say Kia

But I won't

[kiakahaaotearoa]

Thought you might oakey. Good man for not. That was heartbreaking stuff.   

[mystiroakey]

[RuggerRadge2611]

From one passionate fan to another Schiz , give Ford a break. Someone said on another thread a bit like Parks hen isn't asking to be picked and despite being gash he is still being selected.

Sending him out at half time and subbing him after a minute was almost a public execution and verging on a cruel and unusual punishment a bit like waterboarding the guy in public.

I have criticised his performance but it's not his fault he keeps getting picked.

Johnson on the other hand has undone whatever good work Robinson did. At least under his reign our pack was terrifying, they won ball, line outs and scrums. Problem is our backs were Jedi Knight, now our forwards couldn't win ball in their lives depended on it.

That is a coaching issue. Johnson should fall on his sword as Robinson did. We frankly don't deserve to be in the tournament. Georgia or Romania would probably get hammered too but at least they might look hungry

[TJ]

Ford clearly has the yips and needs to get out of the limelight to rebuild his career. he is a very good player undermined by confidence / mental issues IMO. He has needed a change of scne for a few years now - and to relearn to enjoy his rugby.

[TheMildlyFranticLlama]

That is a coaching issue.  Johnson should fall on his sword as Robinson did.  We frankly don't deserve to be in the tournament.  Georgia or Romania would probably get hammered too but at least they might look hungry

Unfortunately I have to agree with this, I can't imagine a Georgian or Romanian team that was given the chance to compete in the 6N would ever show such a lack of spirit as the Scotland team did yesterday. We don't have a divine right to be competing at this level, it is time we started earning the right to do so!

[MacKnocked-on]

Slightly different topic; what approach do people think Vern Cotter will take to improve the team?

[RDW]

He's just got to get Scotland doing the basics again - set piece and defence. Can't do anything else until they are in place.

[TheMildlyFranticLlama]

Not spend all week thinking of amusing turns of phrase for his pre match interviews and actually do some coaching?

[RuggerRadge2611]

Slightly different topic; what approach do people think Vern Cotter will take to improve the team?

Hopefully he can start by doing something no other Scottish coach has done before. Pick players in their positions and play a specialist in every position.

It's not brain surgery.

He also might pit some rockets up some erses .

Also less time in the gym and more time in the paddock learning ball skills.

How a team of professional rugby players lost more than 50% of their line out ball is a mystery. The English like the Irish last week didn't even have to compete. They just waited for us to coque it up.

[offload]

I'm sure that coaching Scotland is a challenge for anyone - no disrespect intended.

When SJ was appointed I posted my sympathy for Scots as I have not seen any coaching ability from this Australian buffoon. He was a shambles in Wales - never uttering one inteligent word. Whatever difficulties Scotish rugby is facing, they will be better off without Johnson.

[21st Century Schizoid Man]

From one passionate fan to another Schiz ,  give Ford a break.  Someone said on another thread a bit like Parks hen isn't asking to be picked and despite being gash he is still being selected.  

Sending him out at half time and subbing him after a minute was almost a public execution and verging on a cruel and unusual punishment   a bit like waterboarding the guy in public.

I have criticised his performance but it's not his fault he keeps getting picked.

Johnson on the other hand has undone whatever good work Robinson did.  At least under his reign our pack was terrifying,  they won ball,  line outs and scrums. Problem is our backs were Jedi Knight,  now our forwards couldn't win ball in their lives depended on it.  

That is a coaching issue.  Johnson should fall on his sword as Robinson did.  We frankly don't deserve to be in the tournament.  Georgia or Romania would probably get hammered too but at least they might look hungry

Radge,   point taken and accepted and I am backing off the guy (Ford).    My ire is going to Johnson, Humphreys and the SRU as it seems is everyone else including the players.

[aucklandlaurie]

I have thought for a long time that John Kirwan would make the ideal coach for Scotland. Him and the former Aussie RL coach Des Hasler would be a great combination for Scotland.

 Now thats an interesting combination, not only would it be very amusing, but bluddee hell just imagine the lesson in attitude the Scots would get from Dessy and JK.
And then theyd all go surfing.

I really believe that it would work. Des would get the defence sorted and will inject some much needed discipline while Kirwan would develop some back play that would really suit the Scottish backs. Win win as far as I am concerned.

Not sure about the surfing though, did it once myself and damn near drowned

Des never played rugby though.

Anyway, he's stuck here in Bulldog-land for a while now I would say. I did hear rumours that he might go to the Eels if anything but that seems to have fallen through. I'm not so sure he would give up the lifestyle & financial incentive to swap codes and set up digs in Edinburgh though.

The John Kirwan suggestion is a good one. How about him and Robbie Deans?  

If memory serves me right one of the first things Robbie did when he took over the Wallabies was to get rid of...................Scott Johnson.

[George Carlin]

Slightly different topic; what approach do people think Vern Cotter will take to improve the team?

Hopefully  he can start by doing something no other Scottish coach  has done before.  Pick players in their positions and play a specialist in every  position.

It's not brain surgery.  

+1

I think that some people are misunderstanding why Scots posters are annoyed at Johnson. Nobody is suggesting that if the team that you coach cannot become world beaters in 2 years, then you are a de facto poor coach. However, Johnson: (a) did not drill the forwards the way that Robinson did, (b) insists on picking players out of position and then dropping them for not demonstrating a skillset that they never professed to have in the first place, (c) has changed a running and offloading game plan that did very well at times over the past 2 years for an utterly, unremittingly negative one of kicking the thing away and hoping that the opposition makes mistakes in possession, (d) chose captains of players whose names on the teamsheet were not guaranteed and (e) crucially, did not seem to be able to be consistent in his treatment of younger players.

All of this means, in simple terms, that Scotland did not get every chance to show the best version of itself. And fans are absolutely justified in being p!ssed about that. SJ does control that.

Cotter was a loose forward himself and was forwards coach to the Crusaders in 2 championship winning seasons. Nathan Hines has given interviews where he said that VC is a master tactician in forward play and he has learned more from him than from any other coach. So I am expecting a galvanized pack, a good selector of players, a staunch disciplinarian and a strong leader. I hope to hell that he can persuade Franck Azema to come with him as we need a good backs coach desperately. Azema was the one who noticed that a young hyperactive kid playing youth grade for PUC called Wesley Fofana was worth taking a punt on.

[123456789]

Firstly Johnson is a complete muppet and a waste of time, he has taken the most talented group of young Scottish players I can remember to an incredibly low level, at least with his predecessor you could guarantee a competitive game against all but New Zealand (the fact it was competitive against everyone including Romania, Georgia and Tonga was part of the problem) however the team seemed devoid of, not only ideas, but passion, you have to question what on earth he's doing when he can't motivate, supposedly, Scotland's best to play England at Murrayfield.

Secondly, whilst the Dear Leader is a pretty awful coach, there isn't much he can do about the two most experienced players on the pitch, Lamont and Hamilton, giving away stupid penalties that ultimately resulted in us losing thirteen points. Also there isn't much he can do to teach Ford and Hamilton to work together seeing as they managed it for the first five years they played with each other. What he can do though is ensure that Lamont and Hamilton aren't on the pitch, all the other international players of their age are legends or were excellent in their prime; Lamont was decent in 2006, I'm not sure if Hamilton has ever been anything other than a big, fat man with lots of tattoos, lots to shout about and a complete and utter inability to comprehend the Laws of the game in which he is a professional.

Thirdly, this is not a bad team, in fact I think if thirteen of the guys starting were fit and on form we'd challenge for the title:

1. Grant
2. MacArthur
3. Welsh
4. Swinson
5. Gray
6. Brown
7. Rennie
8. Beattie
9. Laidlaw
10. Weir
11. Visser
12. Scott
13. Bennett
14. Maitland
15. Hogg

16. Dickinson
17. Welsh
18. Ford
19. Gray
20. Denton
21. Cusiter
22. Tonks
23. Dunbar

[tigertattie]

Welsh starting and on the bench??? Is he that good?

[123456789]

Welsh starting and on the bench??? Is he that good?

one of them was supposed to be Murray

[RuggerRadge2611]

Firstly Johnson is a complete muppet and a waste of time, he has taken the most talented group of young Scottish players I can remember to an incredibly low level, at least with his predecessor you could guarantee a competitive game against all but New Zealand (the fact it was competitive against everyone including Romania, Georgia and Tonga was part of the problem)  however the team seemed devoid of, not only ideas, but passion, you have to question what on earth he's doing when he can't motivate, supposedly, Scotland's best to play England at Murrayfield.

Secondly, whilst the Dear Leader is a pretty awful coach, there isn't much he can do about the two most experienced players on the pitch, Lamont and Hamilton, giving away stupid penalties that ultimately resulted in us losing thirteen points. Also there isn't much he can do to teach Ford and Hamilton to work together seeing as they managed it for the first five years they played with each other. What he can do though is ensure that Lamont and Hamilton aren't on the pitch, all the other international players of their age are legends or were excellent in their prime; Lamont was decent in 2006, I'm not sure if Hamilton has ever been anything other than a big, fat man with lots of tattoos, lots to shout about and a complete and utter inability to comprehend the Laws of the game in which he is a professional.

Thirdly, this is not a bad team, in fact I think if thirteen of the guys starting were fit and on form we'd challenge for the title:

1. Grant
2. MacArthur  
3. Welsh
4. Swinson
5. Gray
6. Brown
7. Rennie
8. Beattie
9. Laidlaw
10. Weir
11. Visser
12. Scott
13. Bennett
14. Maitland
15. Hogg

16. Dickinson
17. Welsh
18. Ford
19. Gray
20. Denton
21. Cusiter
22. Tonks
23. Dunbar

Dropping Denton and Fusaro is a Johnson esque selection there numbers. You cannae drop our best players from Saturday. I'd bring Kelly Brown back in at 6 but Johnson is going to look like a grade 1 fudd if he does that.

Still absolutely apoplectic about Saturday.

[tigertattie]

I'd not drop fusaro but Denton would be binned. Why do folk say he had a good game?

He never passed or offloaded. He never made it over the gain line. Beattie did far more when he came on.

[Nematode]

Dickinson, Hall, Welsh, J Gray, Gilchrist, Harley, Fusaro, Beattie, Cusiter, Hogg, Lamont, Dunbar, Bennett, Seymour, Fife.

Reid, Macarthur, Cross, R Gray, Barlcay, Hart, ????

... why bother tbh.

[tigertattie]

Just stick out the Currie first XV I say. They'd at least bloomin try

Total lack of fire in the team right now. Get a nutter in to shape them up

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Pkp0hZfaPBM&feature=youtu.be&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DPkp0hZfaPBM%26feature%3Dyoutu.be#

[AsLongAsBut100ofUs]

I'd not drop fusaro but Denton would be binned. Why do folk say he had a good game?

He never passed or offloaded. He never made it over the gain line. Beattie did far more when he came on.

12 carries, 56m made, no offloads, 6 tackles made, 1 missed = Dozer

[TJ]

Denton - I assume he did what he was told to do. He looked hungry and carried hard and set up good ruck ball having taken out a couple of defenders. this creates space for others. He didn't lose the ball in tackles as he has in the past.

[RDW]

If Denton can learn to pass and offload he will be a real top class 8. Could be a real weapon too – the defence swarms around him as they know he is just going to charge into contact – if he had a support runner with him and actually popped it off to them before contact we could get real success out of it.

He is still only 24 though so has time to learn – my concern is whether the coaches are actually trying to coach this skill into him or if he is just being told to charge headlong into contact.

[R!skysports]

Stuart Hogg has said he is now ready to move to fly-half after another frustrating afternoon with Scotland denied him any real opportunities to attack from his customary full-back berth

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/international/scotland/10627270/Six-Nations-2014-Stuart-Hogg-wants-to-move-to-fly-half-for-Scotland-after-frustrating-start-to-campaign.html

I say, why the hell not - what is the point in having an attacking No 15 if we never get the ball

Wier showed that he is no where near International class on Saturday, and our other option is no better.

No 10 is one of the key positions in the team, so why not get a strong player there

If he does move, then he has to stay there for a couple of seasons at least - no mixing and matching

[TJ]

Wier looked OK to me. Not a lot of good ball to work with. I think Laidlaw didn't help him. However no doubt Hogg has that extra something and I see no harm in trying. I'd like to see him play some club games at 10 first tho

I think cus and Weir may be our best option now

[TJ]

I suspect he was told to go into contact with the aim of taking out 2 defenders and to set quick ruck ball

[Captain_Sensible]

If Denton can learn to pass and offload he will be a real top class 8.  Could be a real weapon too – the defence swarms around him as they know he is just going to charge into contact – if he had a support runner with him and actually popped it off to them before contact we could get real success out of it.

He is still only 24 though so has time to learn – my concern is whether the coaches are actually trying to coach this skill into him or if he is just being told to charge headlong into contact.

This. He played well, as did Fusaro. The odd man out in our backrow is Wilson. He's a good player for Glasgow, but I am struggling to see what he adds at 6 for the national team. His carrying was average, and his ruck work was poor.

Your point about offloads is important, RDW. On the few occasions when we had the ball on Saturday, there was no inventiveness, no willingness of gamble, and no apparent ability to get our most dangerous runner on the ball. It was just some huff and puff from the forwards, then a crappy kick from Laidlaw or Weir. My suspicion is that SJ is restricting us to this gameplan, which just doesn't work without an efficient breakdown effort and a non-functioning set piece.

[AsLongAsBut100ofUs]

If Denton can learn to pass and offload he will be a real top class 8.  Could be a real weapon too – the defence swarms around him as they know he is just going to charge into contact – if he had a support runner with him and actually popped it off to them before contact we could get real success out of it.

He is still only 24 though so has time to learn – my concern is whether the coaches are actually trying to coach this skill into him or if he is just being told to charge headlong into contact.

This. He played well, as did Fusaro. The odd man out in our backrow is Wilson. He's a good player for Glasgow, but I am struggling to see what he adds at 6 for the national team. His carrying was average, and his ruck work was poor.

Plus 4 missed tackles - not ideal from your blindside flanker

[demosthenes]

Stuart Hogg has said he is now ready to move to fly-half after another frustrating afternoon with Scotland denied him any real opportunities to attack from his customary full-back berth

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/international/scotland/10627270/Six-Nations-2014-Stuart-Hogg-wants-to-move-to-fly-half-for-Scotland-after-frustrating-start-to-campaign.html

I say, why the hell not - what is the point in having an attacking No 15 if we never get the ball

Wier showed that he is no where near International class on Saturday, and our other option is no better.

No 10 is one of the key positions in the team, so why not get a strong player there

If he does move, then he has to stay there for a couple of seasons at least - no mixing and matching

So who goes to FB? Maitland, Tonks and Murchie are injured, so that leaves ... Cuthbert!!!!

Back ye to 15, Master Hogg!!!!

[AsLongAsBut100ofUs]

Can I suggest that we try him at hooker?

[Sam]

Can I suggest that we try him at hooker?

Can't be worse than Ford at the set piece can he?! Can't believe Ford is still in the match day 23...

[RuggerRadge2611]

NO FFS!

why do we insist on trying to batter square pegs into round holes!

[GLove39]

Can I suggest that we try him at hooker?

Can't be worse than Ford at the set piece can he?! Can't believe Ford is still in the match day 23...

Can I suggest we try him as head coach & director of rugby?
Couldn't be worse than Matt Williams(V2)...

[TJ]

Hogg could easily go to 10 - but not as a panic move nor in this 6N. He needs to play some club games at 10first

[nickj]

The lack of options at 15 shouldn't prevent Hogg moving to 10 in the long term. But he definitely needs game time at club level before any move happens at international level.

The only recent evidence for any proposed move is currently a dirt trackers game for the Lions.

Did anyone see Tommy Allan yesterday? I can't help but feel we've missed out on a decent 10 there.

Whatever anyone says about his handling of his move, he showed some good composure and game management in Paris.

[Captain_Sensible]

The Telegraph seem to think we don;t deserve to be in the 6N - http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/international/sixnations/10627088/Six-Nations-2014-Scotland-should-be-told-to-shape-up-or-ship-out.html

Hard to disagree with a lot of what's written in the article.

[RuggerRadge2611]

I have been a poster on these forums and the old Beeb 606 for about 7 years. A lot of my fellow Scottish posters have been here for about the same time, some longer and some are new guys. One thing that unites us as opposed to some other six nations posters is the realistic expectations we all have on here. From the moment Johnson announced the team I can’t think of one Scottish poster who said : “that’s a team that can beat Lancaster’s England Team” not a single one.

However in my long years of posting on here as a Scottish rugby fan I cannot ever remember our team being so cataclysmically woeful. Articles have already surfaced in the ever dependable “Torygraph” calling for Scotland’s involvement with the six nations to be called into question. Can any of us Scottish fans argue with that assessment. I spoke on another topic saying sure Romania or Georgia would have likely been cuffed too but at least they might have shown some endeavour or at the very worst some resistance.

Instead Scotland served up one of the most insipid, error strewn performances I have ever had the misfortune to endure.

Johnson is rolling over on the naïve card, this however is insulting my intelligence. Lamont, Hamilton and Ford are not naïve players they have over 150 caps between them but Ford and Hamilton gave away 7 points against Ireland, Ford all by himself gave away another 7 points against Ireland, Hamilton gave away a 3 point penalty and Lamont was responsible for the penalty and subsequent lineout that gift wrapped England’s first try.

Certain players were anonymous on Saturday, Wilson simply isn’t abrasive enough to play 6. Why Stroks, Brown or Harley didn’t start is a question only Johnson can answer.

What made Saturday worse is that I feel in my heart this is the best group of players that Scotland have produced for years. Compare Southwell to Hogg, or Weir/Jackson to Godman, Scott to Morrison, Dunbar to Henderson I could go on.

So what is going on in the Scotland camp? For all of his faults at least our pack were a ferocious unit who in some games looked like they would eat their own grandmothers if it meant they could turn the ball over, and they are the same pack that are playing for Johnson. Granted our backs in the Robinson era were limited but at least they had the ball.

So amidst the awful game at the weekend I have created this thread to look to the future, in the belief that we have a team that can not only be competitive but a team that can win the 6N next year.

Cotter will be coming in and lets be honest he’ll have the best pick of any of the Scottish coaches for the last decade.

1. Grant, Dickinson, Reid (Nel)
2. MacArthur, McInally, Ford, Lawson, Brown
3. Welsh, Lowe, Murray
4. R Gray, Swinson, Low
5. J Gray, McKenzie, Gilchrist
6. Brown, Harley, Strockosch
7. Rennie, Barclay, Fusaro, Grant, Cowan
8. Beattie, Denton, Wilson, Hogg (du Preez, Bluto)
9. Laidlaw, Cusiter, Pyrgos, Hart
10. Tonks, Jackson, Weir, Heathcoate
11. Visser, Seymore, McGuigan
12. Scott, Horne, Taylor, Grove
13. Dunbar, NDL, Bennett, Vernon
14. Maitland, Fife, Evans
15. Hogg, Cuthbert, Murchie

Maybe I’m an idiot, maybe I’m a complete clown….

But that is better than the rubbish Robinson and Hadden had to work with isn’t it?

Can Cotter get this lot smacking into rucks, doing the basics and most important of all get this lot playing like Scotland of the 90s with passion, pride and aggression.

We saw none of it on Saturday but as the title says… perhaps now we are at the darkest time of night, just before the dawn.

  

[RuggerRadge2611]

The Telegraph seem to think we don;t deserve to be in the 6N - http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyunion/international/sixnations/10627088/Six-Nations-2014-Scotland-should-be-told-to-shape-up-or-ship-out.html

Hard to disagree with a lot of what's written in the article.

I can't help but think Romania or Georgia would have done better, they certainly would have tried harder.

[EWT Spoons]

Don’t think he should be moved to 10.  He’s barely played there and throwing him in at international level to play there would be a mistake.  I mean look at Tonks, he’s been playing at 10 for the last few months for Edinburgh and he was tested in the A game first.  So to go straight in at International level at 10 would be a mistake for Hogg.  Plus given our forwards are totally useless at the moment, he would be under constant pressure and would have to deal with that.

Also as pointed out earlier, the only other option we have at FB currently is Cuthbert or at a push Tom Brown (who’s just back from injury)

[TJ]

I agree this is the best group of players for a long time. Maybe 1990 were better?

Coaching is clearly the issue. I suspect the SRU thought Cotter would get out of his contract and I really hope he will be the man to do it. He is certainly the type of coach I have been wanting to see take on Scotland.

If We had Lancaster as a coach we would be playing better if a bit stuctured and unimaginative. If we had Shmidt we would maybe have the tactics for the opposition.

Instead we have a team who play well below their potential and good players who appear to have lost hope. Laidlaw for example seems to have no confidence.

Waht we should do now is remove Johnson. Bring in Solomans as caretaker with jeffries to add bite.

[rodders]

However in my long years of posting on here as a Scottish rugby fan I cannot ever remember our team being so cataclysmically woeful.  

I agree you've been a bloody disgrace and its not lack of quality players either. Hogg, Gray, Hamilton, Maitland, Laidlaw ...there enough talent there to be putting up more resistance than that. It's the same at club level.

You lot are depressing me and I'm not even Scottish! Buck up your ideas for flip sake!   

[Taffineastbourne]

I know that folk get jingoistic about Lions selection so I could understand the Scots posters banging the drum for their favourites.
Results and performances do not lie.
How many of your players would make the starting XV of the other 6N's?Even Italy would graciously decline most.
SJ cannot work miracles.He is a plank,mind!

[tigertattie]

nice try Radge but I'm afraid the gloom is still hovering over my head!

I agree that Cotter could make some vast improvements but I have real concern that SJ will still be fannying around as DoR

[TJ]

Taff - the players are better than the way they have played. There is no doubt about that. A decent coach would have us where we should be - mid table like last year. A top coach would have us challenging for the title.

Which players would grace other teams? Both Grays, Laidlaw, Hogg, Swinson, Scott. WHEN IN FORM

[tigertattie]

I'd not drop fusaro but Denton would be binned. Why do folk say he had a good game?

He never passed or offloaded. He never made it over the gain line. Beattie did far more when he came on.

12 carries, 56m made, no offloads, 6 tackles made, 1 missed = Dozer

and most of those metres were made from him getting the ball deep and legging it up to the opposition.

How many metres did he make over the gain line - Zero

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