1872 Cup - Rugby's oldest derby fixture

Hugh Barrow wrote:“Tradition is very, very important,” said Alan Solomons. “It’s the oldest derby and to be involved is an absolute privilege.”

Like many good yarns, including the William Webb Ellis story, that certainly has a degree of truth. There was certainly no cup to be won on the 23 November 1872 at Glasgow Accies ground Burnbank when Scotland’s two largest cities first met under the then 20-a-side Rugby rules.

Two of the Glasgow team, Tom Chalmers and Willie Cross, had an intriguing decision to make that week – should they play against Edinburgh at rugby or play against England in the first-ever soccer international a week later at Hamilton Crescent?

They chose the former so Queens Park took on the Auld Enemy on their own. A year earlier Cross had goaled the first points recorded in the history of international rugby at Raeburn Place in the famous first Scotland v England international.

Between 1872 and 1995 there was still no cup to contest, just the honour of winning, and for generations who played that annual match in early December that sufficed whether it was played at Burnbank, Hamilton Crescent, Hampden Park, New or Old Anniesland or Hughenden in the west.

The first real inter-city cup was contested in the 1995-96 season’s match, when it was donated by the match sponsors, Slater, Hogg and Howison. It had the sponsor’s name on it and that remained for the following season, but for 1997-98 a new sponsor came on board – Inter-City Trains. So it became the Inter-City Cup.

This initiative was very much driven by the Glasgow District Committee of the day, including the likes of Ken Crichton from Stirling County and Andy Little of Glasgow High Kelvinside. By then the Inter-District Championship had become Scotland’s qualifying competition for Europe, and it is intriguing that qualification looks set to return next season.

However, in late March 1998 came the SRU decision to condense from four teams to two for European competition and that sounded the death knell for the Inter-District Cup. Glasgow and Edinburgh played a one-off match in 1998-99 and such was the popularity among supporters that the IDC was resurrected for season 1999-2000. That lasted only three seasons, ending in 2001-2002 and thereafter the Inter-City Cup languished in the Glasgow District office in Somerset Place for a few years.

It found a new life when the professional teams revived it in 2007 and has since become the major draw in the Scottish rugby calendar with crowds of close to 14,000 registered at Murrayfield and limited only to 10,000 in Glasgow, at the old Firhill venue, because of stadia capacity.

Scotstoun housed the 1997-98 fixture and was Glasgow’s first home in the Heineken Cup, though the home matches in the European Challenge Cup the previous season (the four Scottish teams’ first season in Europe) had been played at Hughenden.

What the players of bygone times would make of the international make-up of the current teams filling the jerseys is anybody’s guess but the influx of foreign players was commented on as long ago as 1891 when it was noted that Edinburgh fielded some “aliens”.

What remains constant is that those who now play in Glasgow and Edinburgh shirts wherever they hail from have the privilege to bear the cities’ names and that is not an honour to be taken lightly.

justified sinner wrote:

RDW_Scotland wrote:Really am raging that wasn't a card - clear one handed slap down

Poor call by Nigel, but at the end of the day we got the W . YES

RDW_Scotland wrote:One final note for this evening - if Russell had kicked his conversion Glasgow would have retained the cup!

Nematode wrote:Anyone else wonder if Glasgow should now focus on the Rabo instead of the European Cup?

VinceWLB wrote:Interesting to see 15000+ fans at Murrayfield last night, this contrast hugely with Glasgow's mere 6945 which is going to be the worst attended fixture of the festive period bar the Italian Derbies.
Can't help but feel Glasgow didn't see things big enough when they went with Scotstoun. They would have had a crowd close to 10k a the old Firhill.

BigGee wrote:
That's a bit unfair really. The move to Scotstoun has generally been seen as very successful and Glasgow are getting 6000 crowds regularly now, three times what they were getting at Firhill. That is actually far more important than a one off derby game. The size of crowd does show though that the interest is there though. Play some decent rugby in the right arena and Edinburgh should be getting 6000 + every week as well.

There is probably more scope for expanding Scotstoun as well if it can be justified on a regular basis.

justified sinner wrote:Edinburgh's run in is interesting now , ignoring Europe which I fancy us to do well in (mockers).

It is;

Connacht A
Ospreys H
Ulster H
Blues A
Treviso A
Scarlets A
Munster H
Zebre H
Dragons A
Leinster H

To make 6th we probably need 7 or 6 at a push wins out of that lot, we are going to have to play very well to do that, and if we don't start with a win in Galway it looks impossible to me.

Season looks like it was blown with the draw against Scarlets and the loss against Gary Conway, sorry Connacht.

justified sinner wrote:Edinburgh's run in is interesting now , ignoring Europe which I fancy us to do well in (mockers).

It is;

Connacht A
Ospreys H
Ulster H
Blues A
Treviso A
Scarlets A
Munster H
Zebre H
Dragons A
Leinster H

Scott also bemoaned the lack of attacking threat posed by either side for large parts of the match. Despite this, he relishes the opportunity to work more closely with Phil Burleigh, with whom he played together for the first time this season.

“It could have gone either way but I’m really pleased with the defensive effort. I remember saying to him [Burleigh] ‘we’re not really going to touch the ball’ and that’s the way it transpired.”

“He’s the type of player I’d like to play with, he’s a good distributer and he’s a smart player as well so I look forward to getting a string of games together with him.”
With Burleigh playing at inside centre and Scott an unaccustomed outside centre role, Scott believes the partnership has improved his game of late.