1872 Cup - Rugby's oldest derby fixture

by **RDW** Mon 22 Dec 2014, 9:43 am

First topic message reminder :

1872 Cup - Rugby's oldest derby fixture - Page 2 Glasgow-warriors

Glasgow Warriors V Edinburgh Rugby

History of the competition (Credit to Hugh Barrow of the Scotsman)

Hugh Barrow wrote:“Tradition is very, very important,” said Alan Solomons. “It’s the oldest derby and to be involved is an absolute privilege.”

Like many good yarns, including the William Webb Ellis story, that certainly has a degree of truth. There was certainly no cup to be won on the 23 November 1872 at Glasgow Accies ground Burnbank when Scotland’s two largest cities first met under the then 20-a-side Rugby rules.

Two of the Glasgow team, Tom Chalmers and Willie Cross, had an intriguing decision to make that week – should they play against Edinburgh at rugby or play against England in the first-ever soccer international a week later at Hamilton Crescent?

They chose the former so Queens Park took on the Auld Enemy on their own. A year earlier Cross had goaled the first points recorded in the history of international rugby at Raeburn Place in the famous first Scotland v England international.

Between 1872 and 1995 there was still no cup to contest, just the honour of winning, and for generations who played that annual match in early December that sufficed whether it was played at Burnbank, Hamilton Crescent, Hampden Park, New or Old Anniesland or Hughenden in the west.

The first real inter-city cup was contested in the 1995-96 season’s match, when it was donated by the match sponsors, Slater, Hogg and Howison. It had the sponsor’s name on it and that remained for the following season, but for 1997-98 a new sponsor came on board – Inter-City Trains. So it became the Inter-City Cup.

This initiative was very much driven by the Glasgow District Committee of the day, including the likes of Ken Crichton from Stirling County and Andy Little of Glasgow High Kelvinside. By then the Inter-District Championship had become Scotland’s qualifying competition for Europe, and it is intriguing that qualification looks set to return next season.

However, in late March 1998 came the SRU decision to condense from four teams to two for European competition and that sounded the death knell for the Inter-District Cup. Glasgow and Edinburgh played a one-off match in 1998-99 and such was the popularity among supporters that the IDC was resurrected for season 1999-2000. That lasted only three seasons, ending in 2001-2002 and thereafter the Inter-City Cup languished in the Glasgow District office in Somerset Place for a few years.

It found a new life when the professional teams revived it in 2007 and has since become the major draw in the Scottish rugby calendar with crowds of close to 14,000 registered at Murrayfield and limited only to 10,000 in Glasgow, at the old Firhill venue, because of stadia capacity.

Scotstoun housed the 1997-98 fixture and was Glasgow’s first home in the Heineken Cup, though the home matches in the European Challenge Cup the previous season (the four Scottish teams’ first season in Europe) had been played at Hughenden.

What the players of bygone times would make of the international make-up of the current teams filling the jerseys is anybody’s guess but the influx of foreign players was commented on as long ago as 1891 when it was noted that Edinburgh fielded some “aliens”.

What remains constant is that those who now play in Glasgow and Edinburgh shirts wherever they hail from have the privilege to bear the cities’ names and that is not an honour to be taken lightly.

Previous results

2013-2014
Glasgow 37 - Edinburgh 34
Edinburgh 16 - Glasgow 20
Aggregate - Glasgow 57 - Edinburgh 50

2012-2013
Edinburgh 17 - Glasgow 21
Glasgow 23 - Edinburgh 14
Aggregate - Glasgow 44 - Edinburgh 31

2011-2012
Glasgow 17 - Edinburgh 12
Edinburgh 23 - Glasgow 23
Aggregate - Glasgow 40 - Edinburgh 35

2010 - 2011
Edinburgh 22 - Glasgow 15
Glasgow 25 - Edinburgh 12
Aggregate - Glasgow 40 - Edinburgh 34

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2009 - Edinburgh won!!! Yahoo

Fixtures

Glasgow V Edinburgh
Saturday 27th December
Scotstoun Stadium
14:40 kick off
Live on Sky Sports

Edinburgh V Glasgow
Friday 2nd January
Murrayfield Stadium
19:35 kick off
Live on BBC 2

Teams for Second Leg

Glasgow Warriors
1872 Cup - Rugby's oldest derby fixture - Page 2 Gimli10

1872 Cup - Rugby's oldest derby fixture - Page 2 Gimli10

15. Peter Murchie
14. Sean Maitland
13. Alex Dunbar
12. Peter Horne
11. Tommy Seymour
10. Finn Russell
9. Niko Matawalu

1. Gordon Reid
2. Dougie Hall
3. Jon Welsh
4. Jonny Gray
5. Al Kellock (Captain)
6. Ryan Wilson
7. Tyrone Holmes
8. Josh Strauss

16. Fraser Brown
17. Alex Allan
18. Euan Murray
19. Leone Nakarawa
20. James Eddie
21. Ali Price
22. Richie Vernon
23. Stuart Hogg

Edinburgh Rugby
1872 Cup - Rugby's oldest derby fixture - Page 2 Taurie10

1872 Cup - Rugby's oldest derby fixture - Page 2 Taurie10

15 Jack CUTHBERT
14 Dougie FIFE
13 Matt SCOTT
12 Phil BURLEIGH
11 Tim VISSER
10 Greig TONKS
9 Sam HIDALGO-CLYNE

1 Alasdair DICKINSON
2 Ross FORD
3 John ANDRESS
4 Anton BRESLER
5 Ben TOOLIS
6 Mike COMAN (Captain)
7 Roddy GRANT
8 David DENTON

16 Neil COCHRANE
17 Rory SUTHERLAND
18 WP NEL
19 Fraser McKENZIE
20 Hamish WATSON
21 Sean KENNEDY
22 Tom HEATHCOTE
23 Sam BEARD

by **RDW** Tue 23 Dec 2014, 10:50 am

JonnyEdinburgh wrote:
RDW_Scotland wrote:
JonnyEdinburgh wrote:I see Glasgow missed both conversions and never scored any points from the boot, didn't realise Finn Russell was playing....

I do think Russell is a good kicker - and am confident he will become a great kicker - but his flakiness recently has been a worry.

Stuart Barnes talks a lot of crap, but he was spot on when he said that Russell didn't seem to have a set routine, and commented that you didn't see Jonny Wilkinson and Ronan O'Gara dancing about with headphones on when they were doing kicks at goal during the warm up - you don't wear headphones during a game after all.

Of course he could answer all his critics and nail all his kicks against Edinburgh, but the last few weeks have certainly shown why Scotland need Laidlaw at 9 kicking goals just now.

I didn't see Barnes saying that but it is a really good point now you mention it. I studied sports coaching a few years ago and that really is page one stuff in terms of finding that extra few percent of consistency at elite level. Things like visualisation all span from getting that set routine as close to identical each time, and mentally placing equal importance on every kick whether it is in the World Cup final, before a league game or in training. Hopefully someone can weave that into his mindset in training etc, but preferably without an irritating head tilt or Jackie Stallone pout added in.

The showed him during the warm up and he was listening to music and singing along while kicking his goals - he did nail them all to be fair!

They also commented that he seemed to take a different length of time preparing for each kick - you could probably have timed Wilkinson to the millisecond.

Apparently he's been working with Mossy so hopefully that will do him good - Mossy had a fairly distinctive style (i.e. every kick looked like it was struck badly) but they all went over.

by MacKnocked-on Tue 23 Dec 2014, 10:55 am

JonnyEdinburgh wrote:
RDW_Scotland wrote:
JonnyEdinburgh wrote:I see Glasgow missed both conversions and never scored any points from the boot, didn't realise Finn Russell was playing....

I do think Russell is a good kicker - and am confident he will become a great kicker - but his flakiness recently has been a worry.

Stuart Barnes talks a lot of crap, but he was spot on when he said that Russell didn't seem to have a set routine, and commented that you didn't see Jonny Wilkinson and Ronan O'Gara dancing about with headphones on when they were doing kicks at goal during the warm up - you don't wear headphones during a game after all.

Of course he could answer all his critics and nail all his kicks against Edinburgh, but the last few weeks have certainly shown why Scotland need Laidlaw at 9 kicking goals just now.

I didn't see Barnes saying that but it is a really good point now you mention it. I studied sports coaching a few years ago and that really is page one stuff in terms of finding that extra few percent of consistency at elite level. Things like visualisation all span from getting that set routine as close to identical each time, and mentally placing equal importance on every kick whether it is in the World Cup final, before a league game or in training. Hopefully someone can weave that into his mindset in training etc, but preferably without an irritating head tilt or Jackie Stallone pout added in.

Getting Russel's kicking routine sorted out is definitely a project for Chris Paterson, he should probably start by confiscating the Beats by Dre.

by JonnyEdinburgh Tue 23 Dec 2014, 11:16 am

RDW_Scotland wrote:
JonnyEdinburgh wrote:
RDW_Scotland wrote:
JonnyEdinburgh wrote:I see Glasgow missed both conversions and never scored any points from the boot, didn't realise Finn Russell was playing....

I do think Russell is a good kicker - and am confident he will become a great kicker - but his flakiness recently has been a worry.

Stuart Barnes talks a lot of crap, but he was spot on when he said that Russell didn't seem to have a set routine, and commented that you didn't see Jonny Wilkinson and Ronan O'Gara dancing about with headphones on when they were doing kicks at goal during the warm up - you don't wear headphones during a game after all.

Of course he could answer all his critics and nail all his kicks against Edinburgh, but the last few weeks have certainly shown why Scotland need Laidlaw at 9 kicking goals just now.

I didn't see Barnes saying that but it is a really good point now you mention it. I studied sports coaching a few years ago and that really is page one stuff in terms of finding that extra few percent of consistency at elite level. Things like visualisation all span from getting that set routine as close to identical each time, and mentally placing equal importance on every kick whether it is in the World Cup final, before a league game or in training. Hopefully someone can weave that into his mindset in training etc, but preferably without an irritating head tilt or Jackie Stallone pout added in.

The showed him during the warm up and he was listening to music and singing along while kicking his goals - he did nail them all to be fair!

They also commented that he seemed to take a different length of time preparing for each kick - you could probably have timed Wilkinson to the millisecond.

Apparently he's been working with Mossy so hopefully that will do him good - Mossy had a fairly distinctive style (i.e. every kick looked like it was struck badly) but they all went over.

Cheers for that, I never knew that was his approach before games.

The fact he nailed all the warm up kicks but missed the pressure kicks is the most worrying part! The very definition of choking. Hopefully Mossy has his feet up and has a nice rest for a couple of weeks and gets to work on him in the New Year.

For someone near the top of the game, he will be getting almost no benefit from farting about with his warm up kicks even if he hammers them home every one. He might as well just be practicing doing the YMCA. The whole point of it is to get yourself mentally in the zone - imagine you are actually taking that potentially match winning kick every time then in the most high pressure environment you have already "been there" before, loads of times.

I use the same technique when entering a bar, whether with just one friend or in the high stakes environment of a larger group.
- On approach to venue, use the windows to try and sight out the direction of the toilets before entering.
- Worm your way to the front of your crowd
- Ensure there is conversation right up to the point of crossing the threshold. (Even a fraction of silence leaves a chance for someone to think whose round it is).
- Open door and during the first step turn and announce your need for the toilet
- Dart towards the previously sighted toilet. (If you fail to identify them on approach, and need to spend 5 seconds spinning your head - you will be caught by someone with the words "your round")
- Go to the toilet and return to a pint of ale, purchased by one of the suckers without a well rehearsed routine aka Finn Russell!

by funnyExiledScot Tue 23 Dec 2014, 11:31 am

JonnyEdinburgh wrote:
I use the same technique when entering a bar, whether with just one friend or in the high stakes environment of a larger group.
- On approach to venue, use the windows to try and sight out the direction of the toilets before entering.
- Worm your way to the front of your crowd
- Ensure there is conversation right up to the point of crossing the threshold. (Even a fraction of silence leaves a chance for someone to think whose round it is).
- Open door and during the first step turn and announce your need for the toilet
- Dart towards the previously sighted toilet. (If you fail to identify them on approach, and need to spend 5 seconds spinning your head - you will be caught by someone with the words "your round")
- Go to the toilet and return to a pint of ale, purchased by one of the suckers without a well rehearsed routine aka Finn Russell!

You and RDW would get on like a house on fire!!

by justified sinner Tue 23 Dec 2014, 12:20 pm

Yeah, but they'd both go thirsty as noone would get round to buying a round.

by **RDW** Tue 23 Dec 2014, 12:41 pm

funnyExiledScot wrote:
JonnyEdinburgh wrote:
I use the same technique when entering a bar, whether with just one friend or in the high stakes environment of a larger group.
- On approach to venue, use the windows to try and sight out the direction of the toilets before entering.
- Worm your way to the front of your crowd
- Ensure there is conversation right up to the point of crossing the threshold. (Even a fraction of silence leaves a chance for someone to think whose round it is).
- Open door and during the first step turn and announce your need for the toilet
- Dart towards the previously sighted toilet. (If you fail to identify them on approach, and need to spend 5 seconds spinning your head - you will be caught by someone with the words "your round")
- Go to the toilet and return to a pint of ale, purchased by one of the suckers without a well rehearsed routine aka Finn Russell!

You and RDW would get on like a house on fire!!

Apparently my reputation precedes me! Rolling Eyes

by tigertattie Tue 23 Dec 2014, 3:21 pm

The last time RDW and FES bought a round, RBS had to be bailed out by public funding!

by funnyExiledScot Tue 23 Dec 2014, 4:27 pm

tigertattie wrote:The last time RDW and FES bought a round, RBS had to be bailed out by public funding!

Or to be more accurate, that probably coincides with the last time I was able to make it to the pub...... Sad

By the way, it's my birthday tomorrow and high value gifts are most welcome.

by **RDW** Tue 23 Dec 2014, 4:37 pm

funnyExiledScot wrote:
tigertattie wrote:The last time RDW and FES bought a round, RBS had to be bailed out by public funding!

Or to be more accurate, that probably coincides with the last time I was able to make it to the pub......

By the way, it's my birthday tomorrow and high value gifts are most welcome.

Ah so this is the real reason you have a grudge for the messiah - he's always done one better than you since you were only born on Christmas eve! Very Happy

by funnyExiledScot Tue 23 Dec 2014, 4:43 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:
funnyExiledScot wrote:
tigertattie wrote:The last time RDW and FES bought a round, RBS had to be bailed out by public funding!

Or to be more accurate, that probably coincides with the last time I was able to make it to the pub......

By the way, it's my birthday tomorrow and high value gifts are most welcome.

Ah so this is the real reason you have a grudge for the messiah - he's always done one better than you since you were only born on Christmas eve!

Amusingly enough due to 606v2 being in some bizarre timezone I have apparently already turned 34!

I have no axe to grind with the Messiah these days. Now that's he's old enough to drink I'm perfectly happy to see him in Scotland colours. He's our most attack-minded 13 and now that we have a coach who can spell his own name, that may prove handy.

by Nematode Tue 23 Dec 2014, 4:49 pm

I'd like to see:

Dickinson
Ford (Cochrane)
Nel
Toolis
Gilchrist (Mckenzie)
Coman
Grant
Denton
SHC
Tonks
Visser
Scott
Fife
Brown
Cuthbert

Not sure on Hart or SHC, but as I've gone with Tonks I think you need SHC for kicking.

by **RDW** Tue 23 Dec 2014, 4:50 pm

funnyExiledScot wrote:
RDW_Scotland wrote:
funnyExiledScot wrote:
tigertattie wrote:The last time RDW and FES bought a round, RBS had to be bailed out by public funding!

Or to be more accurate, that probably coincides with the last time I was able to make it to the pub......

By the way, it's my birthday tomorrow and high value gifts are most welcome.

Ah so this is the real reason you have a grudge for the messiah - he's always done one better than you since you were only born on Christmas eve!

Amusingly enough due to 606v2 being in some bizarre timezone I have apparently already turned 34!

I have no axe to grind with the Messiah these days. Now that's he's old enough to drink I'm perfectly happy to see him in Scotland colours. He's our most attack-minded 13 and now that we have a coach who can spell his own name, that may prove handy.

Ah fair enough.

So will it be gold frankincense or myrrh? 1872 Cup - Rugby's oldest derby fixture - Page 2 3845856932

by funnyExiledScot Tue 23 Dec 2014, 4:51 pm

I realise Andries Strauss is injured, but I think Solomons will play him anyway.

Given my stapler weighs more than Cochrane, I've actually been quite impressed with him. His basics are good, not that Treviso tested him in the scrum, and he and Toolis made a good team in the lineout.

by funnyExiledScot Tue 23 Dec 2014, 4:56 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:
funnyExiledScot wrote:
RDW_Scotland wrote:
funnyExiledScot wrote:
tigertattie wrote:The last time RDW and FES bought a round, RBS had to be bailed out by public funding!

Or to be more accurate, that probably coincides with the last time I was able to make it to the pub......

By the way, it's my birthday tomorrow and high value gifts are most welcome.

Ah so this is the real reason you have a grudge for the messiah - he's always done one better than you since you were only born on Christmas eve!

Amusingly enough due to 606v2 being in some bizarre timezone I have apparently already turned 34!

I have no axe to grind with the Messiah these days. Now that's he's old enough to drink I'm perfectly happy to see him in Scotland colours. He's our most attack-minded 13 and now that we have a coach who can spell his own name, that may prove handy.

Ah fair enough.

So will it be gold frankincense or myrrh?

A bit of a no brainer. A precious metal, worth a fortune, or some smelly shrub resin. Good to know even in (fictional) old times there was still room for some duff presents.

by tigertattie Wed 24 Dec 2014, 10:22 am

Bloody annoying that the Glasgow leg is on sky sports!

by **RDW** Wed 24 Dec 2014, 10:23 am

Happy birthday FES! cake

by funnyExiledScot Wed 24 Dec 2014, 11:00 am

tigertattie wrote:Bloody annoying that the Glasgow leg is on sky sports!

Why? You just pick up the remote and change the channel to Sky Sports 1 Very Happy

by funnyExiledScot Wed 24 Dec 2014, 11:01 am

RDW_Scotland wrote:Happy birthday FES!

Thank you kind sir. BabyfES was generous and let me lie in to 6:40…....

by jimbopip Wed 24 Dec 2014, 11:08 am

Fes Hippo Birdie Two Ewes cake

by tigertattie Wed 24 Dec 2014, 1:51 pm

funnyExiledScot wrote:
tigertattie wrote:Bloody annoying that the Glasgow leg is on sky sports!

Why? You just pick up the remote and change the channel to Sky Sports 1

if I did that I'd just be watching a blue screen Crying or Very sad

by funnyExiledScot Wed 24 Dec 2014, 8:23 pm

tigertattie wrote:
funnyExiledScot wrote:
tigertattie wrote:Bloody annoying that the Glasgow leg is on sky sports!

Why? You just pick up the remote and change the channel to Sky Sports 1

if I did that I'd just be watching a blue screen

As an Edinburgh fan that'll probably be better.....

by **RDW** Fri 26 Dec 2014, 11:53 am

Team to play Edinburgh Rugby, GUINNESS PRO12, Scotstoun Stadium, Saturday 27 December (kick-off 2.40pm) – live on Sky Sports 1:
15. Stuart Hogg
14. Sean Lamont
13. Alex Dunbar
12. Peter Horne
11. DTH van der Merwe
10. Duncan Weir
9. Henry Pyrgos

1. Ryan Grant
2. Pat MacArthur
3. Euan Murray
4. Tim Swinson
5. Al Kellock (Captain)
6. Ryan Wilson
7. Rob Harley
8. Josh Strauss

Replacements

16. Dougie Hall
17. Alex Allan
18. Jon Welsh
19. Leone Nakarawa
20. Tyrone Holmes
21. Niko Matawalu
22. Richie Vernon
23. Sean Maitland

by **RDW** Fri 26 Dec 2014, 11:55 am

Delighted to see the reserve 2nd row pairing in there, and Russell is obviously being given a rest after waiting up late for Santa coming.

Bit more of a bish bash bosh team than one set up for running rugby, so will probably be a fairly physical affair.

by mckay1402 Fri 26 Dec 2014, 12:04 pm

Gutted this is on sky sports. I'm going to have to watch a stream now. Bloody Rupert murdoch

by jimbopip Fri 26 Dec 2014, 12:19 pm

A good set of backs, Tombola keeping faith with Hornee Furra Linee. God knows what will happen on he hour mark; Horne to 10, Dunbar to 12, Richie on at 13, Mata to 9 or all of back 3.
In the pack I'm disappointed that there is no Gray, but there is Cap'n Kelloc Yahoo

We may not get too many chances to see him in the flesh so let's enjoy it while we can.
Notsure about the balance in the back row. Is Harley a 7? If he says he is who would argue with him?

by justified sinner Fri 26 Dec 2014, 12:22 pm

Edinburgh

15            Jack CUTHBERT
14            Dougie FIFE
13            Matt SCOTT
12            Andries STRAUSS
11            Tom BROWN
10            Greig TONKS
9              Sam HIDALGO-CLYNE

1              Alasdair DICKINSON
2              Ross FORD
3              John ANDRESS
4              Anton BRESLER
5              Ben TOOLIS
6              Mike COMAN (Captain)
7              Roddy GRANT
8              David DENTON

Substitutes
16            Neil COCHRANE
17            Rory SUTHERLAND
18            Willem NEL
19            Fraser McKENZIE
20            Stuart McINALLY
21            Grayson HART
22            Tom HEATHCOTE
23            Phil BURLEIGH

Injury update
Players currently on the injured list are: Carl Bezuidenhout (knee), Wicus Blaauw (knee), Allan Dell (leg), Cornell Du Preez (leg), Jamie Farndale (knee), Hugh Fraser (knee), Grant Gilchrist (arm), Brett Thompson (shoulder), George Turner (hamstring) and Hamish Watson (jaw).

by **BigGee** Fri 26 Dec 2014, 12:29 pm

A big series of games coming up for Glasgow, so some rotation was always on the cards. Finn Russell and Johnny Gray definitely deserve a rest and Tommy Seymour has played more games an any of the other wingers. It would not surprise meif Weir starts both of these games. He deserves a little bit of a run. Russell has looked a little jaded in the last couple of games. Let Weir play the derbies and Russell can come back in for the scarlet's game and then the European fixtures.

The other Glasgow player who must be due a rest soon is Harley, if he does ever get tired? Strauss and Naka can get their rest when the internationals are on, but the Scotland players do need a bit of managing. Anyway , even with a few standing down, it is a pretty strong team. I am not expecting a massacre but I am expecting a Glasgow win.

by **BigGee** Fri 26 Dec 2014, 12:35 pm

The Edinburgh selection was reasonably predictable was it not. Looks like Tonks is going to get a bit of a run at 10, despite him not being overly impressive last week. They may miss the boot of Heathcote if the game becomes close, which it may be. I guess he deserves his chance.

The Edinburgh pack looks solid though and will be competitive. Interesting that Nel does not seem to start these days, he has looked pretty good when he has come on later in the games and certainly knows his way to the try line, which is more than you can say for a lot of the Edinburgh players.

by **RDW** Fri 26 Dec 2014, 12:41 pm

Looks like visser has been rested - he has played a number of games in a row now.

Plus he was probably crapping himself at the prospect of having to tackle Lamont!

by jimbopip Fri 26 Dec 2014, 12:58 pm

I've just noticed that Matt Scott(12) is playing 13 directly opposing Alex Dunbar(12). That should be tasty; the sub-plot being which one is back-up 13 to the Messiah come the World Cup. It seems strange for a Scotland supporter to say this but... they are both outstanding 12's (and I genuinely mean outstanding , Dunbar reminds me very much of O'Driscoll and Scott seems to have the potential to open any defence) and we could be heading into a World Cup with one of them pretty much a benchwarmer IF the Messiah is fit.
However, from the sublime to the ridiculous...Furra Linee at 12 has the job of attempting to outpace Lightning McStrauss. Laugh

Now I think I know why Big Bad Bob is at 7. He'll spend a large part of the day strolling over to the 10-12 channel and waiting till Lightning runs/ambles into him. Unless Tonks has been working on his mis-passes all week then Matt Scott(12) may not see too much of the ball. I think 12 could be your weak spot, with our back row "coming round the corner" and smashing into Lightning McStrauss thereby creating space for Hornee to attack Scott (12) and hopefully open up the outside channels for Dunbar(12).
Oh and Coman People is being the inspirational do nothing much captain. Perhaps Big Al should observe closely and see how it should be done.

by **RDW** Fri 26 Dec 2014, 1:06 pm

Jumping the gun a bit saying the messiah will be a starter come the world cup given his start to international rugby (albeit with an early injury in his 2nd game) and the fact that Scott / Dunbar work so well together.

I'd certainly say Scott / Dunbar is our 1st choice partnership just now, and will almost certainly play in the 6N.

Also, for all of Strauss' limitations, tackling is something he's fairly solid (if unspectacular) at.

If Glasgow are going to target anything it will be the set piece - Kellock has forgotten more about lineouts than toolis knows, and I'm not convinced by Andres' scrummaging.

by jimbopip Fri 26 Dec 2014, 1:52 pm

RDW, certainly the Glasgow front 5 looks the better, also the replacement front row looks pretty solid too. Glasgow won't just throw to Big Al: Harley and Wilson give good options at the tail. So yes the set piece looks solid for the home side. (if Clown shoes allows the game to be played rather than deciding to have one last domestic with Kellock just for old times' sake). And yes I may be premature, again, but I tend to like playing 12's at 12 and 13's at 13. I agree that Dunbar-Scott has worked well for Scotland but do we lose something playing a player out of position? Up till now probably not: Dunbar was probably the best 13 available but now we have Bennett who is arguably the best 13 Scotland have had in a long time. I also get the feeling that Fern either really rates Bennett from their Clermont days or he doesn't at all. Picking him against the AB's would suggest Fern rates him. So then it's Dunbar or Scott at 12. Do we go with the very successful club pairing or the gifted 12 who is being played out of position at his club?
Just a thought; are the MFL playing Scott(12) at 13 just to accommodate journeymen NSQ's or is it because the buffties at HQ have told them Dunbar is the preferred 12 come the World Cup? Or is that level of forward planning beyond them?
Still this time tomorrow Tom the guitar, the Schizoid one and myself shall be discussing Aristotelian ethics and the essential moral bankruptcy that underpins all attempts at enforced Yuletide festiveness. Then laughing at the MFL and their silly face paint on their home page.

by **BigGee** Fri 26 Dec 2014, 2:58 pm

Matt Scott is probably the best 12 in Scotland, but does need to manage a run of games without getting injured. Dunbar seems equally at home at 12 or 13, as a lot of the best centres are. Scott can switch about as well to be fair. I like it when they can mix and match and keep the oppo guessing. Bennett is a different kind of player, a bit more subtle and not quite as physical but probably picks better lines and angles. There is room for all of them in an active squad.

The difference in this game coming up is surely in the benches. Glasgow can bring on some genuine game changing options in Niko, Naka amd Miatland, players with genuine impact potential. If it is close going into the last 20 minutes then you have got to pick Glasgow on that basis.

Edinburgh will go into the game hoping they can win, Glasgow however will be expecting to win. Unless their confidence gets ahead of them, them that is what you have got to expect.

by funnyExiledScot Fri 26 Dec 2014, 9:12 pm

I agree with that assessment BigGee on the Scotland centre options. Scott and Dunbar seem able to play both roles, with Bennett a specialist 13. Worth noting that Duncan Taylor, also able to play both inside and outside, is on good form at Sarries.

I'm delighted that Glasgow have gone with Kellock, Toolis will run rings around him, but the quality of the Glasgow bench scares me. A lot of impact there.

Still, we have a slim chance, provided our forwards front up.

by jimbopip Fri 26 Dec 2014, 9:30 pm

funnyExiledScot wrote:
I'm delighted that Glasgow have gone with Kellock, Toolis will run rings around him,
Still, we have a slim chance, provided our forwards front up.

So that would be no chance then. Whistle

by funnyExiledScot Fri 26 Dec 2014, 10:02 pm

jimbopip wrote:
Still this time tomorrow Tom the guitar, the Schizoid one and myself shall be discussing Aristotelian ethics and the essential moral bankruptcy that underpins all attempts at enforced Yuletide festiveness.

Sounds like a long winded way of saying you'll be talking Poopie!!

by funnyExiledScot Fri 26 Dec 2014, 10:05 pm

jimbopip wrote:
funnyExiledScot wrote:
I'm delighted that Glasgow have gone with Kellock, Toolis will run rings around him,
Still, we have a slim chance, provided our forwards front up.
So that would be no chance then.

I should have also mentioned how pleased I was to see fat kid at 10 and the slowest winger of all time at 14. Would love to see Schlong race Strauss.

I have a good feeling about tomorrow. Glasgow overwhelming favourites but Toonie has certainly chucked us a bone by picking Kellock, Weir and Lamont. Just a shame that Gilchrist and Du Preez are out. They make a huge difference to our pack.

by **BigGee** Fri 26 Dec 2014, 11:04 pm

Lamont actually played pretty well against Munster. Every time I try to write him off he surprises me. He does not try to go around anyone anymore, but he can still go through them. The Edinburgh backs better be prepared to make some tackles tomorrow!

by funnyExiledScot Sat 27 Dec 2014, 9:09 am

Well tackling is just about the only thing Strauss can do, and the rest of our backs are pretty solid. I'm pleased we don't have to face Seymour.

by **RDW** Sat 27 Dec 2014, 9:27 am

So all joking aside, can anyone actually see an Edinburgh win today?

Realistically I think the best we can hope for is a respectable performance and still having a chance of the cup and something to aim for next week - I.e. a losing bp.

by funnyExiledScot Sat 27 Dec 2014, 9:43 am

I'd settle for a lbp to keep the cup alive for the return leg. Despite Toonie picking some reserve players, Glasgow are still comfortably better in almost every position.....sadly.

by TJ Sat 27 Dec 2014, 12:32 pm

RDW_Scotland wrote:So all joking aside, can anyone actually see an Edinburgh win today?

.

Of course its possible. Edinburgh are not a weak team. Tonks has a stormer, Matowalo has a couple of brainfarts, edinburgh back row have the ability to win plenty of ball. I'd back Edinburgh to win the kicking and territorial game...............................

Unlikely tho Sad

by bsando Sat 27 Dec 2014, 1:50 pm

Hullo!!

Been a while, looking forward to this afternoons game. I'll be backing embra although I suspect glasgow will will comfortably as I see most on here expect also.

I haven't seen a single edinburgh game this season :/ so today I'm looking forward to seeing how they on.

Hope dry one had a good Xmas and have been enjoying Scotland's improved form under cotter!

My guess for today, glasgow 21 - edinburgh 15

by IanBru Sat 27 Dec 2014, 2:21 pm

Hey Bsando, good to have you back!

I'm not sure about this one - the BBC preview was uncharacteristically perceptive was it said that in matches of high-emotion, the edge lies with the team that wants it the most.

It's true that Glasgow are superior in every position and that Edinburgh's game plan can be more confused than a nun that stumbles onto LoveHoney.com (NSFW), but there is no telling how Glasgow players can react to being favorites, and the desire for Edinburgh to 'bring that one down a peg or two' can be decisive.

I think Glasgow will win, and comfortably, but I wouldn't be surprised if Edinburgh shock us with a good performance, if not a win.

by cakeordeath Sat 27 Dec 2014, 2:28 pm

Well I can only describe as having a Xmas made up with one disaster after another, I am currently 15 miles from the comfort of my own TV and sky box. On top of that Sky Go is being a Frak. I am now reduced to finding a feed or watching it on my phone.

by nickj Sat 27 Dec 2014, 2:51 pm

Merry Xmas all - Is there any way of catching the game live without sky?

by **RDW** Sat 27 Dec 2014, 2:56 pm

This is pretty turgid so far....

by **RDW** Sat 27 Dec 2014, 3:05 pm

Glasgow haven't had a straight lineout yet!

by VinceWLB Sat 27 Dec 2014, 3:05 pm

Swinson never makes yards ball in hand, for a 2nd row this is very poor.

by cakeordeath Sat 27 Dec 2014, 3:06 pm

Did Greenwood just say Lamont loves to off-load!

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