Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
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The v2 Forum :: Sport :: Rugby Union :: International
Page 7 of 13
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Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
First topic message reminder :
SCOTLAND V SOUTH AFRICA
3 October 2015
KO: 16:45 BST
St. James' Park, Newcastle
Live on [tbc]
Referee: Nigel Owens (Wales)
Touch judges: Chris Pollock (New Zealand) & Leighton Hodges (Wales)
Television match official: George Ayoub (Australia)
A. Head to Head
25 Played 25
5 Won 20
0 Drawn 0
20 Lost 5
270 Points 652
B. Recent Form
28 June 2014
Nelson Mandela Bay Stadium, Port Elizabeth
55 – 6 to South Africa
17 November 2013
Murrayfield, Edinburgh
0 – 28 to South Africa
15 June 2013
Mbombela Stadium, Nelspruit
30 – 17 to South Africa
17 November 2012
Murrayfield, Edinburgh
10 – 21 to South Africa
20 November 2010
Murrayfield, Edinburgh
21 – 17 to Scotland
15 November 2008
Murrayfield, Edinburgh
10 – 14 to South Africa
C. Teams
SCOTLAND
15 Stuart Hogg (Glasgow Warriors) – 35 caps; 9 tries, 2 pens, 51 points
14 Tommy Seymour (Glasgow Warriors) – 19 caps; 8 tries, 40 points
13 Richie Vernon (Glasgow Warriors) – 22 caps
12 Matt Scott (Edinburgh Rugby) – 31 caps; 4 tries, 20 points
11 Tim Visser (Harlequins) – 22 caps; 10 tries, 50 points
10 Duncan Weir (Glasgow Warriors) – 20 caps; 2 tries, 6 cons, 9 pens, 1 drop, 52 points
09 Greig Laidlaw CAPTAIN (Gloucester) – 43 caps; 3 tries, 51 cons, 92 pens, 393 points
01 Gordon Reid (Glasgow Warriors) – 12 caps
02 Fraser Brown (Glasgow Warriors) – 12 caps
03 Willem Nel (Edinburgh Rugby) – 5 caps; 1 try, 5 points
04 Richie Gray (Castres) – 48 caps; 2 tries, 10 points
05 Jonny Gray (Glasgow Warriors) – 16 caps; 1 try, 5 points
06 Josh Strauss (Glasgow Warriors) – 2 caps
07 Blair Cowan (London Irish) – 13 caps, 2 tries, 10 points
08 David Denton (Edinburgh Rugby) – 29 caps
16 Ross Ford (Edinburgh Rugby) – 91 caps; 2 tries, 10 points
17 Alasdair Dickinson (Edinburgh Rugby) – 49 caps; 2 tries, 10 points
18 Jon Welsh (Newcastle Falcons) – 9 caps; 1 try, 5 points
19 Tim Swinson (Glasgow Warriors) – 14 caps
20 Ryan Wilson (Glasgow Warriors) – 13 caps
21 Sam Hidalgo-Clyne (Edinburgh Rugby) – 7 caps
22 Peter Horne (Glasgow Warriors) – 12 caps; 1 try, 1 con, 1 pen, 10 points
23 Sean Lamont (Glasgow Warriors) – 98 caps; 14 tries, 70 points
SOUTH AFRICA
01. Tendai Mtawarira
02. Bismarck Du Plessis
03. Jannie Du Plessis
04. Eben Etzebeth
05. Lodewyk De Jager
06. Francois Louw
07. Schalk Burger
08. Duane Vermeulen
09. Fourie Du Preez (captain)
10. Handre Pollard
11. Bryan Habana
12. Damian De Allende
13. Jesse Kriel
14. JP Pietersen
15. Willie Le Roux
16. Adriaan Strauss
17. Trevor Nyakane
18. Frans Malherbe
19. Pieter-Steph Du Toit
20. Willem Alberts
21. Ruan Pienaar
22. Pat Lambie
23. Jan Serfontein
SCOTLAND V SOUTH AFRICA
3 October 2015
KO: 16:45 BST
St. James' Park, Newcastle
Live on [tbc]
Referee: Nigel Owens (Wales)
Touch judges: Chris Pollock (New Zealand) & Leighton Hodges (Wales)
Television match official: George Ayoub (Australia)
A. Head to Head
25 Played 25
5 Won 20
0 Drawn 0
20 Lost 5
270 Points 652
B. Recent Form
28 June 2014
Nelson Mandela Bay Stadium, Port Elizabeth
55 – 6 to South Africa
17 November 2013
Murrayfield, Edinburgh
0 – 28 to South Africa
15 June 2013
Mbombela Stadium, Nelspruit
30 – 17 to South Africa
17 November 2012
Murrayfield, Edinburgh
10 – 21 to South Africa
20 November 2010
Murrayfield, Edinburgh
21 – 17 to Scotland
15 November 2008
Murrayfield, Edinburgh
10 – 14 to South Africa
C. Teams
SCOTLAND
15 Stuart Hogg (Glasgow Warriors) – 35 caps; 9 tries, 2 pens, 51 points
14 Tommy Seymour (Glasgow Warriors) – 19 caps; 8 tries, 40 points
13 Richie Vernon (Glasgow Warriors) – 22 caps
12 Matt Scott (Edinburgh Rugby) – 31 caps; 4 tries, 20 points
11 Tim Visser (Harlequins) – 22 caps; 10 tries, 50 points
10 Duncan Weir (Glasgow Warriors) – 20 caps; 2 tries, 6 cons, 9 pens, 1 drop, 52 points
09 Greig Laidlaw CAPTAIN (Gloucester) – 43 caps; 3 tries, 51 cons, 92 pens, 393 points
01 Gordon Reid (Glasgow Warriors) – 12 caps
02 Fraser Brown (Glasgow Warriors) – 12 caps
03 Willem Nel (Edinburgh Rugby) – 5 caps; 1 try, 5 points
04 Richie Gray (Castres) – 48 caps; 2 tries, 10 points
05 Jonny Gray (Glasgow Warriors) – 16 caps; 1 try, 5 points
06 Josh Strauss (Glasgow Warriors) – 2 caps
07 Blair Cowan (London Irish) – 13 caps, 2 tries, 10 points
08 David Denton (Edinburgh Rugby) – 29 caps
16 Ross Ford (Edinburgh Rugby) – 91 caps; 2 tries, 10 points
17 Alasdair Dickinson (Edinburgh Rugby) – 49 caps; 2 tries, 10 points
18 Jon Welsh (Newcastle Falcons) – 9 caps; 1 try, 5 points
19 Tim Swinson (Glasgow Warriors) – 14 caps
20 Ryan Wilson (Glasgow Warriors) – 13 caps
21 Sam Hidalgo-Clyne (Edinburgh Rugby) – 7 caps
22 Peter Horne (Glasgow Warriors) – 12 caps; 1 try, 1 con, 1 pen, 10 points
23 Sean Lamont (Glasgow Warriors) – 98 caps; 14 tries, 70 points
SOUTH AFRICA
01. Tendai Mtawarira
02. Bismarck Du Plessis
03. Jannie Du Plessis
04. Eben Etzebeth
05. Lodewyk De Jager
06. Francois Louw
07. Schalk Burger
08. Duane Vermeulen
09. Fourie Du Preez (captain)
10. Handre Pollard
11. Bryan Habana
12. Damian De Allende
13. Jesse Kriel
14. JP Pietersen
15. Willie Le Roux
16. Adriaan Strauss
17. Trevor Nyakane
18. Frans Malherbe
19. Pieter-Steph Du Toit
20. Willem Alberts
21. Ruan Pienaar
22. Pat Lambie
23. Jan Serfontein
Last edited by George Carlin on Thu 01 Oct 2015, 10:55 am; edited 4 times in total
George Carlin- Admin
- Posts : 15807
Join date : 2011-06-23
Location : KSA
Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
Screaming, it's a fair question, but as the English-born son of Scottish parents, I would never have considered playing for anyone other than Scotland (my test career being cruelly cut short by a noticeable lack of bulk, speed, handling, bravery, talent, and skill).
Yet, I would have been considered 'foreign born'. I have a lot of time for anyone willing to pull on the dark blue, particularly with metropolitan hacks constantly waiting in the wings to second-guess their motivation.
Yet, I would have been considered 'foreign born'. I have a lot of time for anyone willing to pull on the dark blue, particularly with metropolitan hacks constantly waiting in the wings to second-guess their motivation.
IanBru- Posts : 2909
Join date : 2011-04-30
Age : 36
Location : Newcastle
Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
IanBru wrote:Screaming, it's a fair question, but as the English-born son of Scottish parents, I would never have considered playing for anyone other than Scotland (my test career being cruelly cut short by a noticeable lack of bulk, speed, handling, bravery, talent, and skill).
Yet, I would have been considered 'foreign born'. I have a lot of time for anyone willing to pull on the dark blue, particularly with metropolitan hacks constantly waiting in the wings to second-guess their motivation.
Being from a military family I was also born in England to a totally Scottish family. I've never considered myself anything other than totally Scottish, and had I been blessed with the ability to maintain a bodyweight of more than about 4 stone and a bit less of a liking for binge drinking then my test career could also have taken off in the blue jersey.
I fully agree that it is all too easy to criticise people as being foreign imports and journeymen without having the slightest understanding of what their view of their own nationality is.
EDIT: This almost comes across as if I believe I have some sort of ability on the rugby field. I would like to comprehensively state that this is untrue, as proven by many years spent on said field.
TheMildlyFranticLlama- Posts : 2111
Join date : 2013-11-07
Age : 38
Location : Brighton
Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
I am happy enough with that team. A degree of rotation was always going to be required here, it was not realistic given our schedule to put our best 15 out in every game.
It would also have been a travesty if VC had not played all the squad at some stage. It is good that he has faith in his squad and they in each other. RV is the only really contentious pick and he would not be there if Dunbar had been picked. He has had a good season and was our next best centre once the injuries licked in. That's the way it goes, the injury gods have actually been pretty kind to us so far.
The time to be putting our best 15 out week after week is when we hit the knockouts. Utilising our squad may be our best chance of getting there.
This is a competitive team, not a B team. Might be worth noting that it is a must win game for SA, not for us, they are the ones who could be out if they lose. The Japs I fancy, will be pretty competitive against Samoa
It would also have been a travesty if VC had not played all the squad at some stage. It is good that he has faith in his squad and they in each other. RV is the only really contentious pick and he would not be there if Dunbar had been picked. He has had a good season and was our next best centre once the injuries licked in. That's the way it goes, the injury gods have actually been pretty kind to us so far.
The time to be putting our best 15 out week after week is when we hit the knockouts. Utilising our squad may be our best chance of getting there.
This is a competitive team, not a B team. Might be worth noting that it is a must win game for SA, not for us, they are the ones who could be out if they lose. The Japs I fancy, will be pretty competitive against Samoa
BigGee- Admin
- Posts : 15493
Join date : 2013-11-05
Location : London
Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
Riskysports wrote:URGENT
My Missies is very ill (not life threatening) but means I can not make the game
Does anyone want 2 tickets for the match - face value (plus posting)
Cat C - £85
Need to know asap - as would prefer to sell them to someone here - for face value than someone else
Thanks
Do you still have the tickets Risky?
I would be more than happy to take them both of your hands if they are still free?
Second Ranker- Posts : 11
Join date : 2014-03-14
Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
Positive news on Russell and Hardie - they're both expected to be fit for next week.
VC confirmed that Hardie was still recovering from his head knock.
VC confirmed that Hardie was still recovering from his head knock.
RDW- Founder
- Posts : 33186
Join date : 2011-06-01
Location : Sydney
Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
Second Ranker wrote:Riskysports wrote:URGENT
My Missies is very ill (not life threatening) but means I can not make the game
Does anyone want 2 tickets for the match - face value (plus posting)
Cat C - £85
Need to know asap - as would prefer to sell them to someone here - for face value than someone else
Thanks
Do you still have the tickets Risky?
I would be more than happy to take them both of your hands if they are still free?
Sorry have gone now
Gutted not to be going
R!skysports- Posts : 3667
Join date : 2011-03-17
Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
funnyExiledScot wrote:screamingaddabs wrote:What do the Scottish fans on here think about the number of foreign born starters in your team this weekend? Your whole back row is foreign born. Not trying to start a fight here, just wondering, as I dislike when players like Flutey were picked for England.
Love it. The more the merrier. I've lived in Scotland half my life, and don't like 45% of the voters in my country, so more than happy to have some "good immigration".
RuggerRadge2611- Posts : 7194
Join date : 2011-03-04
Age : 39
Location : The North, The REAL North (Beyond the Wall)
Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
TheMildlyFranticLlama wrote:IanBru wrote:Screaming, it's a fair question, but as the English-born son of Scottish parents, I would never have considered playing for anyone other than Scotland (my test career being cruelly cut short by a noticeable lack of bulk, speed, handling, bravery, talent, and skill).
Yet, I would have been considered 'foreign born'. I have a lot of time for anyone willing to pull on the dark blue, particularly with metropolitan hacks constantly waiting in the wings to second-guess their motivation.
Being from a military family I was also born in England to a totally Scottish family. I've never considered myself anything other than totally Scottish, and had I been blessed with the ability to maintain a bodyweight of more than about 4 stone and a bit less of a liking for binge drinking then my test career could also have taken off in the blue jersey.
I fully agree that it is all too easy to criticise people as being foreign imports and journeymen without having the slightest understanding of what their view of their own nationality is.
EDIT: This almost comes across as if I believe I have some sort of ability on the rugby field. I would like to comprehensively state that this is untrue, as proven by many years spent on said field.
Yeah I kind of agree in a lot of ways. My son was born in glasgow, has three English grandparents and one scottish, an English dad and a Scottish mum. So if he played for England then I'd be Ok with that, same for playing for Scotland.
I'm not so keen on players like strauss, who is to me south African. I don't blame the coaches though, they should pick the best eligible players.
screamingaddabs- Posts : 999
Join date : 2011-02-23
Age : 39
Location : Glasgow and Edinburgh (Work and Home)
Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
Strauss take on representing Scotland - for him it is more about doing his best for his team mates
Scotsman wrote:There is a photograph somewhere with Scotland flanker Josh Strauss sitting on a bench right next to the South African coach Heyneke Meyer. It was taken a little over three years ago when the bearded one was part of a wider Springboks training squad. He failed to make the cut and, shortly after, moved to Glasgow to throw in his lot with Scotland.
Strauss denies that being rejected by the Boks caused him to jump ship. He might even be telling the truth because the South African club that he captained, the Golden Lions, lost their Super Rugby franchise that season and he was left scratching around for a new start in life. He got one.
Now decked in the blue of Scotland with a huge game against the land of his birth looming, what competing emotions are cavorting about his brain right now?
“I haven’t thought about the emotions,” Strauss insists. “It’ll be no different than playing any other game. I was far more emotional playing my first Test. I haven’t thought too much about it but I don’t see it being any different than just playing in a very big game.
“It won’t be any different other than playing one of the best teams in the world. That’s what they are and they’ve been there for all of those years so it’s a massive match.
“Everything in life happens for a reason, I’m a firm believer in that. I’ve loved my time in Scotland and everyone has been great. I’ve been really proud of the things I’ve achieved and I wouldn’t wish it any other way.”
It is difficult to imagine two cultures with less in common than white Johannesburg and Glasgow but then again Strauss never was your typical South African. Rather than a Bible bashing Christian he would rather thrash his guitar in a jam session, specialising in music he describes as “punk and metal”. Ahead of this World Cup he was asked the best thing about Glasgow and his reply, “the banter”, suggests that he has thrown himself into life in his adopted homeland with something like relish.
He certainly does not look like a man who harbours too many regrets about the decision to move halfway around the world, even if Glasgow’s renown as a centre of rugby excellence is a work in progress.
“When I came to Glasgow, the rugby side was quite small,” says that man who helped the Warriors lift the Pro12 title last season. “People would ask me: ‘Where are you from, why are you here?’
“That has changed in the last couple of years. Now I get people stopping me in the streets, people saying congratulations, stopping me in shops. It’s tough to compare the rugby cultures of two very different nations. But it is getting there in Glasgow and Scotland.”
He didn’t play with any of the Springboks squad while in South Africa but Strauss banged heads against a good few of them and it turns out that Schalk Burger was a friend of a friend so the two blindside breakaways, who go head to head tomorrow, are pretty pally off the field.
“We’ve obviously played against each other quite a few times and been to different functions, things like that,” says Strauss. “Schalk is a great guy and he actually went to school with my cousin, so I got to know him quite well over the years. He is always very warm and welcoming. Whenever we played down in Cape Town, he always went out of his way to make sure I felt comfortable, came and had a chat. I don’t think he will be doing that on Saturday, nice guy or not!”
While you might not agree with World Rugby’s three-year residency rule, which will almost certainly be reviewed after this tournament is done and dusted, all the talk of nations and nationality hides one important truth: players play for each other every bit as much as taking up arms for their nation, wife or sweetheart, as Strauss confirms.
“I think it’s probably said a lot, to the extent that it’s devalued, but you become really close to the guys you play with. And although it sounds a bit of a cliché to say they become your family, that is the case.
“We’re together for massive chunks of time and, especially in a tournament like this, you are in a confined space for four weeks. There is almost never any friction, everyone gets along well.
“You play for the guy next to you. I can’t compare it to going to war but, I mean, you are all soldiers in a way. So you play for each other because you are brothers in arms.”
Which is why the Afrikaans-speaking South African Josh Strauss, turning out against the land of his birth and upbringing, will be putting heart, body and soul into Scotland’s cause tomorrow afternoon.
RDW- Founder
- Posts : 33186
Join date : 2011-06-01
Location : Sydney
Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
cp10 wrote:According to "hack" David Ferguson John Hardie has been cleared of concussion.
http://www.fergusonmedia.co.uk/?p=813
I wonder why Ferguson stated that Hardie had cleared the concussion protocol, whereas Cotter is now saying that he hasn't.
Here's a baseless theory: Hardie is perfectly fit to play, however Cotter was slammed at the press conference yesterday for picking second string players against our main Group rival, and in defence Cotter is claiming now that Hardie is in fact unavailable.
funnyExiledScot- Posts : 17072
Join date : 2011-05-31
Age : 43
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
I should perhaps add that Cotter is also in possession of the facts, whereas Ferguson isn't, but I still like my theory.
funnyExiledScot- Posts : 17072
Join date : 2011-05-31
Age : 43
Location : Edinburgh
Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
journalist wrote:It is difficult to imagine two cultures with less in common than white Johannesburg and Glasgow but then again Strauss never was your typical South African. Rather than a Bible bashing Christian he would rather thrash his guitar in a jam session, specialising in music he describes as “punk and metal”. Ahead of this World Cup he was asked the best thing about Glasgow and his reply, “the banter”, suggests that he has thrown himself into life in his adopted homeland with something like relish.
It is statements like these that really p.i.s.s.e.s me off.
WTF does that even mean?
Does this journalist know Johannesburg hasn't been "white" for two F ..ing decades. Why doesn't he just say what he means? If he wants to call us Racist bible bashers, then why hold back?
Anyway rant over.
I have a new philosophy about foreign born players in other teams. If you want to plow with another man's cows, it is your decision. As long as I can identify with the Springboks and they don't become a "barbarian" like team, I will support them.
As for the three year residency rule, the grandparent rule, "I knew your great grandfather" rule.
Who cares?
Why change it now, it is working absolutely swimmingly.
Last edited by Biltong on Fri 02 Oct 2015, 9:13 am; edited 2 times in total
Biltong- Moderator
- Posts : 26945
Join date : 2011-04-27
Location : Twilight zone
Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
That said, what Strauss is saying about playing for your team mates makes more sense than any other "I love my adopted country" or whatever else.
Biltong- Moderator
- Posts : 26945
Join date : 2011-04-27
Location : Twilight zone
Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
Biltong wrote:journalist wrote:It is difficult to imagine two cultures with less in common than white Johannesburg and Glasgow but then again Strauss never was your typical South African. Rather than a Bible bashing Christian he would rather thrash his guitar in a jam session, specialising in music he describes as “punk and metal”. Ahead of this World Cup he was asked the best thing about Glasgow and his reply, “the banter”, suggests that he has thrown himself into life in his adopted homeland with something like relish.
It is statements like these that really p.i.s.s.e.s me off.
WTF does that even mean?
Does this journalist know Johannesburg hasn't been "white" for two F ..ing decades. Why doesn't he just say what he means? If he wants to call us Racist bible bashers, then why hold back?
Anyway rant over.
I have a new philosophy about foreign born players in other teams. If you want to plow with another man's cows, it is your decision. As long as I can identify with the Springboks and they can become a "barbarian" like team, I will support them.
As for the three year residency rule, the grandparent rule, "I knew your great grandfather" rule.
Who cares?
Why change it now, it is working absolutely swimmingly.
The residency thing doesn’t always sit right with me. Hardie, despite being an incredible talent did not really endear himself to many Scottish fans with his sulking “Scotland will just have to do since the All Blacks don’t want me” attitude. He has really put his body on the line for Scotland in Particular in the Japan game but those comments were ill conceived and will haunt him for the rest of his career.
Strauss makes a lot of sense. International rugby is becoming quite mercenary by its nature. Mercenaries have loyalty to no flag or country but will have strong loyalties to those who endure the same hardship vis a vis team mates. I’m not sure we want international rugby to descend into a playing for my team mates mindset. That’s what your club rugby is predominantly for. When you put the thistle on you Should be playing for “your” country. It doesn’t matter if you are playing beside Ali Dickinson or me for that matter you play for your country with all your passion and love you can muster. Your team mates should be irrelevant. His comments although noble again don’t endear me to Strauss. I think he has missed the point of why he is playing for Scotland. It’s not just for his exposure at the highest level. He and the entire team are representing us and should honour the jersey and those who have bled for it before.
Was it Geech who said the jersey is never yours, you are just borrowing it? I can’t remember but that hits the nail on the head for me.
Although Strauss as with Hardie I admire their honesty. They are playing for Scotland and I will always respect and support that, however their attitudes are exactly what one would expect from a mercenary. They will no doubt be effective and have long prosperous careers, but they perhaps lack the passion and pride of guys who have spent their entire lives dreaming of playing for Scotland who are notable by their absences (Kelly Brown, John Barclay and others).
RuggerRadge2611- Posts : 7194
Join date : 2011-03-04
Age : 39
Location : The North, The REAL North (Beyond the Wall)
Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
Biltong wrote:journalist wrote:It is difficult to imagine two cultures with less in common than white Johannesburg and Glasgow but then again Strauss never was your typical South African. Rather than a Bible bashing Christian he would rather thrash his guitar in a jam session, specialising in music he describes as “punk and metal”. Ahead of this World Cup he was asked the best thing about Glasgow and his reply, “the banter”, suggests that he has thrown himself into life in his adopted homeland with something like relish.
It is statements like these that really p.i.s.s.e.s me off.
+1, Agreed
Manky-Flanker- Posts : 590
Join date : 2011-06-09
Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
Manky-Flanker wrote:Biltong wrote:journalist wrote:It is difficult to imagine two cultures with less in common than white Johannesburg and Glasgow but then again Strauss never was your typical South African. Rather than a Bible bashing Christian he would rather thrash his guitar in a jam session, specialising in music he describes as “punk and metal”. Ahead of this World Cup he was asked the best thing about Glasgow and his reply, “the banter”, suggests that he has thrown himself into life in his adopted homeland with something like relish.
It is statements like these that really p.i.s.s.e.s me off.
+1, Agreed
The Scotsman has pretty decent rugby coverage but their journalism can be a bit sloppy at times, take no offence guys
RuggerRadge2611- Posts : 7194
Join date : 2011-03-04
Age : 39
Location : The North, The REAL North (Beyond the Wall)
Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
Biltong wrote:journalist wrote:It is difficult to imagine two cultures with less in common than white Johannesburg and Glasgow but then again Strauss never was your typical South African. Rather than a Bible bashing Christian he would rather thrash his guitar in a jam session, specialising in music he describes as “punk and metal”. Ahead of this World Cup he was asked the best thing about Glasgow and his reply, “the banter”, suggests that he has thrown himself into life in his adopted homeland with something like relish.
It is statements like these that really p.i.s.s.e.s me off.
WTF does that even mean?
Does this journalist know Johannesburg hasn't been "white" for two F ..ing decades. Why doesn't he just say what he means? If he wants to call us Racist bible bashers, then why hold back?
Anyway rant over.
I have a new philosophy about foreign born players in other teams. If you want to plow with another man's cows, it is your decision. As long as I can identify with the Springboks and they don't become a "barbarian" like team, I will support them.
As for the three year residency rule, the grandparent rule, "I knew your great grandfather" rule.
Who cares?
Why change it now, it is working absolutely swimmingly.
Ian Morrison isn’t held in overly high esteem as a journalist, but I’d be surprised if he was deliberately trying to make some kind of statement or stir up trouble. He’s just a bad journalist.
RDW- Founder
- Posts : 33186
Join date : 2011-06-01
Location : Sydney
Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
Biltong wrote:journalist wrote:It is difficult to imagine two cultures with less in common than white Johannesburg and Glasgow but then again Strauss never was your typical South African. Rather than a Bible bashing Christian he would rather thrash his guitar in a jam session, specialising in music he describes as “punk and metal”. Ahead of this World Cup he was asked the best thing about Glasgow and his reply, “the banter”, suggests that he has thrown himself into life in his adopted homeland with something like relish.
It is statements like these that really p.i.s.s.e.s me off.
WTF does that even mean?
Does this journalist know Johannesburg hasn't been "white" for two F ..ing decades.
Anyway rant over.
I have a new philosophy about foreign born players in other teams. If you want to plow with another man's cows, it is your decision. As long as I can identify with the Springboks and they can become a "barbarian" like team, I will support them.
As for the three year residency rule, the grandparent rule, "I knew your great grandfather" rule.
Who cares?
Why change it now, it is working absolutely swimmingly.
At least the boks have honour and prefer to play SA born and raised players rather than simply go to rugby's tesco's and pick out the best players they want from abroad.
Chaps with ancestry, fine with that.. kiwi's from the south island, fine with that... Scottish traditions and pride runs deep there. However parachuting players in... thats simply hired guns... mercenaries and mecenaries look after themselves only.
Josh Strauss... "I love my adopted country". OK I will take a bet with any single person on here... a tenner that he loves his adopted country so much within 12 months of finishing his contract with Glasgow he returns to South Africa probably never to return.
I'm a scot but thats just BS. The guy who wrote the article simply has his head in his backside. They somehow think that Scotland is the progressive beacon of the western world then he needs to get a reality check. Yes there are areas of predominately white residents in SA and jozi but its now rare. Whenever I go back to Scotland and the UK outside of certain cities most are pretty white only, especially Glasgow and lets be honest whilst the SNP love to promote itself as some tree hugging, angelina jolie adopting a child of every colour type... race relations in scotland is still a few notches below the rest of the west.
fa0019- Posts : 8196
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
RuggerRadge2611 wrote:Manky-Flanker wrote:Biltong wrote:journalist wrote:It is difficult to imagine two cultures with less in common than white Johannesburg and Glasgow but then again Strauss never was your typical South African. Rather than a Bible bashing Christian he would rather thrash his guitar in a jam session, specialising in music he describes as “punk and metal”. Ahead of this World Cup he was asked the best thing about Glasgow and his reply, “the banter”, suggests that he has thrown himself into life in his adopted homeland with something like relish.
It is statements like these that really p.i.s.s.e.s me off.
+1, Agreed
The Scotsman has pretty decent rugby coverage but their journalism can be a bit sloppy at times, take no offence guys
I read a comment a guy made a few weeks ago on a rugby forum when the topic was about tranformation and quotas in the Springbok team.
Wish I had an easy way to find it, but the essence of his comment was about how people continually make South Africa the focal point of racism as if they themselves are squeeky clean.
The history of the world will show where racism, slavery and discrimination originated.
But as long as there is someone like SA to point to it keeps the focus squarely on them, everyone else is absolved of their dark history.
So, no mate, it isn't sloppy journalism, it is poor journalism.
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
I do hope our bible bashing Boks read that article, I know it will add a few notches to my motivation come tomorrow
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
I tell you one thing though. I would hate to be WP Nel or Josh Strauss in the first 10 mins of the game.
fa0019- Posts : 8196
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
Manky-Flanker wrote:Biltong wrote:journalist wrote:It is difficult to imagine two cultures with less in common than white Johannesburg and Glasgow but then again Strauss never was your typical South African. Rather than a Bible bashing Christian he would rather thrash his guitar in a jam session, specialising in music he describes as “punk and metal”. Ahead of this World Cup he was asked the best thing about Glasgow and his reply, “the banter”, suggests that he has thrown himself into life in his adopted homeland with something like relish.
It is statements like these that really p.i.s.s.e.s me off.
+1, Agreed
Agree as well. I genuinely don't know what he means either. It isn't difficult to imagine two cultures with less in common than Joburg and Glasgow either. It's very easy to imagine, as there are literally hundreds of such examples. Syria and USA. Papua New Guinea and Greenland. North Korea and Germany.
Anyway, what's different about Joburg and Glasgow anyway? Just look at the crime statistics
funnyExiledScot- Posts : 17072
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
The "Bible bashing" comment is odd as well. Glasgow doesn't have any issues with religion. None whatsoever.
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
Biltong wrote:I do hope our bible bashing Boks read that article, I know it will add a few notches to my motivation come tomorrow
I think you’re getting a bit carried away here Biltong – as I said he is a poor journalist and I’d be surprised if he meant anything by it.
As for your idea of using it as motivation, if it had come from the Scotland camp then fair enough, but it is probably fair to say that a lazy comment from a poor journalist who has absolutely nothing to do with the Scotland team does not reflect the opinion of the Scotland camp!
Chill out and have a beer!
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
funnyExiledScot wrote:The "Bible bashing" comment is odd as well. Glasgow doesn't have any issues with religion. None whatsoever.
One of my favourite ancedotes of Scotland...
Certain celtic fans started to fly the Palestinian flags in solidarity due to their IRA sympathies etc... brothers with common causes etc. Because of this rangers fans looked at this and began to fly the flag of Israel. The enemy of my enemy is my friend!
Genius.
fa0019- Posts : 8196
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
RDW_Scotland wrote:Biltong wrote:I do hope our bible bashing Boks read that article, I know it will add a few notches to my motivation come tomorrow
I think you’re getting a bit carried away here Biltong – as I said he is a poor journalist and I’d be surprised if he meant anything by it.
As for your idea of using it as motivation, if it had come from the Scotland camp then fair enough, but it is probably fair to say that a lazy comment from a poor journalist who has absolutely nothing to do with the Scotland team does not reflect the opinion of the Scotland camp!
Chill out and have a beer!
Wrong article, wrong day for a Boer in a foul mood mate. Guys like him turn people like me into "angry monsters"
Biltong- Moderator
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
funnyExiledScot wrote:The "Bible bashing" comment is odd as well. Glasgow doesn't have any issues with religion. None whatsoever.
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
RDW_Scotland wrote:Biltong wrote:I do hope our bible bashing Boks read that article, I know it will add a few notches to my motivation come tomorrow
I think you’re getting a bit carried away here Biltong – as I said he is a poor journalist and I’d be surprised if he meant anything by it.
As for your idea of using it as motivation, if it had come from the Scotland camp then fair enough, but it is probably fair to say that a lazy comment from a poor journalist who has absolutely nothing to do with the Scotland team does not reflect the opinion of the Scotland camp!
Chill out and have a beer!
The Boks aren't short of motivation. They should just watch the Japan video again.
funnyExiledScot- Posts : 17072
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
funnyExiledScot wrote:RDW_Scotland wrote:Biltong wrote:I do hope our bible bashing Boks read that article, I know it will add a few notches to my motivation come tomorrow
I think you’re getting a bit carried away here Biltong – as I said he is a poor journalist and I’d be surprised if he meant anything by it.
As for your idea of using it as motivation, if it had come from the Scotland camp then fair enough, but it is probably fair to say that a lazy comment from a poor journalist who has absolutely nothing to do with the Scotland team does not reflect the opinion of the Scotland camp!
Chill out and have a beer!
The Boks aren't short of motivation. They should just watch the Japan video again.
They had memory chips implanted into the frontal lobes so they can replay the Japan match at any point. Even on field.
Biltong- Moderator
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
Cant wait to get up to St James for this one. Should be a big old support for Scotland due to the location.
Geordie- Posts : 28896
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
Biltong wrote:funnyExiledScot wrote:RDW_Scotland wrote:Biltong wrote:I do hope our bible bashing Boks read that article, I know it will add a few notches to my motivation come tomorrow
I think you’re getting a bit carried away here Biltong – as I said he is a poor journalist and I’d be surprised if he meant anything by it.
As for your idea of using it as motivation, if it had come from the Scotland camp then fair enough, but it is probably fair to say that a lazy comment from a poor journalist who has absolutely nothing to do with the Scotland team does not reflect the opinion of the Scotland camp!
Chill out and have a beer!
The Boks aren't short of motivation. They should just watch the Japan video again.
They had memory chips implanted into the frontal lobes so they can replay the Japan match at any point. Even on field.
For all that's been written about the Boks, I still think you'll win your last two games and top the Group, probably going on to face Wales in the next round. I also think you'll have enough to beat Wales. I then think you'll lose to NZ in the SF. When all is said and done, I suspect the Boks will end up very much where you would have expected to be, albeit with a bumpier road to get there.
The other silver lining is the experience your younger players will get from this WC, particularly the backs. You'll be far less a team in transition for the next one.
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
fa0019 wrote:I tell you one thing though. I would hate to be WP Nel or Josh Strauss in the first 10 mins of the game.
I'm sure they'll be just fine.
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
Tattie Scones RRN wrote:fa0019 wrote:I tell you one thing though. I would hate to be WP Nel or Josh Strauss in the first 10 mins of the game.
I'm sure they'll be just fine.
Agree - if the Boks are wasting time and energy trying to single out "Jock Boks" for special treatment then that's an early advantage to Scotland. It won't happen though. Sadly for us every ounce of complacency has been surgically removed from the Boks by Japan. We'd have been far better off if the Boks had stuffed Japan by 80 points.
funnyExiledScot- Posts : 17072
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
funnyExiledScot wrote:Tattie Scones RRN wrote:fa0019 wrote:I tell you one thing though. I would hate to be WP Nel or Josh Strauss in the first 10 mins of the game.
I'm sure they'll be just fine.
Agree - if the Boks are wasting time and energy trying to single out "Jock Boks" for special treatment then that's an early advantage to Scotland. It won't happen though. Sadly for us every ounce of complacency has been surgically removed from the Boks by Japan. We'd have been far better off if the Boks had stuffed Japan by 80 points.
They'll also be far too relieved that Stroks isn't playing to concentrate on any special treatment of our players.
Advantage ours.
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
Walesonline:
Jap Jitters Justifies Jugular Jumps on Jock Boks! ....... says Meyer
Jap Jitters Justifies Jugular Jumps on Jock Boks! ....... says Meyer
SecretFly- Posts : 31800
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
Gonna be a tough game. Its a shame its not quite a full strength team but its not far off and we need to manage players and their knocks.
Scotland may well und up player a more controlled / territory type game but I hope not. Its no foregone conclusion but Boks by ten for me.
Really looking forward to it tho - should be a good game. Looking forwaqrd to watching Vernon at work and it could be a final chance for Weir - he really needs to show what he can do
Must win for SA and if Scotland get anything out of the game they will be in a very good position indeed but a loss is no disaster
Scotland may well und up player a more controlled / territory type game but I hope not. Its no foregone conclusion but Boks by ten for me.
Really looking forward to it tho - should be a good game. Looking forwaqrd to watching Vernon at work and it could be a final chance for Weir - he really needs to show what he can do
Must win for SA and if Scotland get anything out of the game they will be in a very good position indeed but a loss is no disaster
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
funnyExiledScot wrote:Biltong wrote:funnyExiledScot wrote:RDW_Scotland wrote:Biltong wrote:I do hope our bible bashing Boks read that article, I know it will add a few notches to my motivation come tomorrow
I think you’re getting a bit carried away here Biltong – as I said he is a poor journalist and I’d be surprised if he meant anything by it.
As for your idea of using it as motivation, if it had come from the Scotland camp then fair enough, but it is probably fair to say that a lazy comment from a poor journalist who has absolutely nothing to do with the Scotland team does not reflect the opinion of the Scotland camp!
Chill out and have a beer!
The Boks aren't short of motivation. They should just watch the Japan video again.
They had memory chips implanted into the frontal lobes so they can replay the Japan match at any point. Even on field.
For all that's been written about the Boks, I still think you'll win your last two games and top the Group, probably going on to face Wales in the next round. I also think you'll have enough to beat Wales. I then think you'll lose to NZ in the SF. When all is said and done, I suspect the Boks will end up very much where you would have expected to be, albeit with a bumpier road to get there.
The other silver lining is the experience your younger players will get from this WC, particularly the backs. You'll be far less a team in transition for the next one.
Yeah, that was pretty much my expectation from this world cup.
The biggest benefit for us in this world cup, we will get rid of the last bit of 2007 mentality that has hung on too long, and there are a new breed of South African rugby player coming
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
Agreed Biltong.
South Africa have approached this WC in quite an English sort of way. Favouring "pragmatism" and "experience" and reverting back to a couple of old warhorses.
I can actually see the Boks coming 3rd in this WC, very much doing the same sort of thing as England in 2007.
South Africa have approached this WC in quite an English sort of way. Favouring "pragmatism" and "experience" and reverting back to a couple of old warhorses.
I can actually see the Boks coming 3rd in this WC, very much doing the same sort of thing as England in 2007.
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
What are people’s thoughts on SA changing all their lineout codes on Monday to counteract Nel and Strauss’ knowledge of them? It has been joked about, but surely that could be a weak point for SA?
Let’s face it, forwards aren’t the brightest, and 5 days to learn entirely new line out calls could mean that there will be mix ups on the day.
I do hope so!
Let’s face it, forwards aren’t the brightest, and 5 days to learn entirely new line out calls could mean that there will be mix ups on the day.
I do hope so!
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
RDW_Scotland wrote:What are people’s thoughts on SA changing all their lineout codes on Monday to counteract Nel and Strauss’ knowledge of them? It has been joked about, but surely that could be a weak point for SA?
Let’s face it, forwards aren’t the brightest, and 5 days to learn entirely new line out calls could mean that there will be mix ups on the day.
I do hope so!
I assumed they were joking!! Nel and Strauss haven't been involved in SA rugby for 3 years. I find it difficult to believe that SA haven't changed their lineout calls in that time, otherwise everyone would have cracked them.
A bit of a non-story. Our lineout is utter mince anyway, and if we get too excited about throwing players in the air to challenge, we'll probably end up being mauled to death (we're rubbish at defending those as well).
I see the lineout and rolling mauls as one area where South Africa hold all the cards.
funnyExiledScot- Posts : 17072
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
I thought the lineout calls thing had been implemented since before the RWC, with a view to the Scotland game!
BamBam- Posts : 17226
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
SA are aware that Scott Murray has retired, right?
funnyExiledScot- Posts : 17072
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
RDW_Scotland wrote:What are people’s thoughts on SA changing all their lineout codes on Monday to counteract Nel and Strauss’ knowledge of them? It has been joked about, but surely that could be a weak point for SA?
Let’s face it, forwards aren’t the brightest, and 5 days to learn entirely new line out calls could mean that there will be mix ups on the day.
I do hope so!
I doubt anything will change, SA teams play eaxh other all the time, they speak afrikaans or english, it does not matter, a code is a code no matter the language.
Unless of course Strauss smuggles in an Enigma machine from the second world war
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
Biltong wrote:RDW_Scotland wrote:What are people’s thoughts on SA changing all their lineout codes on Monday to counteract Nel and Strauss’ knowledge of them? It has been joked about, but surely that could be a weak point for SA?
Let’s face it, forwards aren’t the brightest, and 5 days to learn entirely new line out calls could mean that there will be mix ups on the day.
I do hope so!
I doubt anything will change, SA teams play eaxh other all the time, they speak afrikaans or english, it does not matter, a code is a code no matter the language.
Unless of course Strauss smuggles in an Enigma machine from the second world war
Nel and Strauss were never in the bok camp. Never played with the bulls where the codes probably originated.
Would just be like domestic bokke rugby. Nothing to worrying about more than usual.
fa0019- Posts : 8196
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
Yes, a non-story. I remember when Nathan Hines moved to Clermont and had to play Leinster in the following year in the (then) Heineken Cup. An interviewer asked him if Hines had told his team mates all of the Leinster line-out calls. Hines laughed and said that he couldn't even remember them when he played for Leinster...funnyExiledScot wrote:RDW_Scotland wrote:What are people’s thoughts on SA changing all their lineout codes on Monday to counteract Nel and Strauss’ knowledge of them? It has been joked about, but surely that could be a weak point for SA?
Let’s face it, forwards aren’t the brightest, and 5 days to learn entirely new line out calls could mean that there will be mix ups on the day.
I do hope so!
I assumed they were joking!! Nel and Strauss haven't been involved in SA rugby for 3 years. I find it difficult to believe that SA haven't changed their lineout calls in that time, otherwise everyone would have cracked them.
A bit of a non-story. Our lineout is utter mince anyway, and if we get too excited about throwing players in the air to challenge, we'll probably end up being mauled to death (we're rubbish at defending those as well).
I see the lineout and rolling mauls as one area where South Africa hold all the cards.
Last edited by George Carlin on Fri 02 Oct 2015, 11:41 am; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
fa0019 wrote:Biltong wrote:RDW_Scotland wrote:What are people’s thoughts on SA changing all their lineout codes on Monday to counteract Nel and Strauss’ knowledge of them? It has been joked about, but surely that could be a weak point for SA?
Let’s face it, forwards aren’t the brightest, and 5 days to learn entirely new line out calls could mean that there will be mix ups on the day.
I do hope so!
I doubt anything will change, SA teams play eaxh other all the time, they speak afrikaans or english, it does not matter, a code is a code no matter the language.
Unless of course Strauss smuggles in an Enigma machine from the second world war
Nel and Strauss were never in the bok camp. Never played with the bulls where the codes probably originated.
Would just be like domestic bokke rugby. Nothing to worrying about more than usual.
You wouldn't believe what he fits in that beard of his!
Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
Here's what Jannie du Plessis said about it
BBC Sport wrote:The tight-head prop, with 66 caps packed into his near-33 years, bows his head and laughs.
"It was Monday. Black Monday," he explains.
"Our forwards coach came in and said, 'OK, on the weekend Scotland will have Josh Strauss and WP Nel in their team. We respect them as rugby players and we respect their ability to understand line-out calls in Afrikaans. So we're changing our calls.'
"We said, 'What? All of them?' Our coach said, 'Yes, every one. We start today.' There was more than one sigh of frustration in that room, I can tell you. We were saying, 'No! How am I going to learn all of this in a week!' Maybe it's a blessing. We made so many mistakes with the old ones. Maybe we needed to change anyway."
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
Good news all - Misses is on the mend - and avoided surgery - still missing the game live, but at least she will be at home beside me to watch Scotland win
Sorry for those who wanted the tickets - ended up a - first to the posst type thing
If only she was ill earlier could have made a fortune on the site Stub HUb :-)
Sorry for those who wanted the tickets - ended up a - first to the posst type thing
If only she was ill earlier could have made a fortune on the site Stub HUb :-)
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
Riskysports wrote:Good news all - Misses is on the mend - and avoided surgery - still missing the game live, but at least she will be at home beside me to watch Scotland win
Sorry for those who wanted the tickets - ended up a - first to the posst type thing
If only she was ill earlier could have made a fortune on the site Stub HUb :-)
good to hear mate
RuggerRadge2611- Posts : 7194
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Re: Scotland v South Africa, 3 October
Very good news.RuggerRadge2611 wrote:Riskysports wrote:Good news all - Misses is on the mend - and avoided surgery - still missing the game live, but at least she will be at home beside me to watch Scotland win
Sorry for those who wanted the tickets - ended up a - first to the posst type thing
If only she was ill earlier could have made a fortune on the site Stub HUb :-)
good to hear mate
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