Ireland 2016/17 season

First topic message reminder :

AI's
Nov 5th New Zealand vs Ireland Chicago
Nov 12th Ireland vs Canada
Nov 19th Ireland Vs New Zealand
Nov 26th Ireland vs Australia


6 Nations
Feb 4th Scotland vs Ireland
Feb 11th Italy vs Ireland
Feb 25th Ireland vs France
Mar 10th Wales vs Ireland
Mar 18th Ireland vs England

Where are the rumours on Conan and Kearney coming from? I haven't seen anything. I did hear that Kearney does have a knock, is it that bad?

While I don't wish injury on anyone, Kearney being out opens up new possibilities. Personally I'd love to see Tiernan O'Halloran get a go. He is the kind of player that isn't only fast but can see where the space is. I'm sure Zebo will be switched to fullback with Trimble coming in.


As good as Gilroy was against Italy, Id have no problem dropping him. O'Halloran, Sweetnam and Stockdale are the back 3 players I want to see more of. O'Loughlin looks a quality player too. The tour to Japan should be interesting.

Rory_Gallagher wrote:Oh, I get it now. I feel your pain. My last name also has an often forgotten "e" at the end.

Spare a thought for poor Joey Carberry, Carbury, Carburry, Carberrey, Carrbery, Cadbury.

the-goon wrote:Where are the rumours on Conan and Kearney coming from? I haven't seen anything. I did hear that Kearney does have a knock, is it that bad?

Torn bicep I think. Nothing major but it might keep him out of the 6 nations.

profitius wrote:

the-goon wrote:Where are the rumours on Conan and Kearney coming from? I haven't seen anything. I did hear that Kearney does have a knock, is it that bad?

Torn bicep I think. Nothing major but it might keep him out of the 6 nations.

Might need surgery too

Seriously people?
I name drop Josiah Gibbs a great in chemical thermodynamics and a firm favourite of Einstein, known for his pioneering work in physics chemistry and mathematics, and not one single comment or green well done thing?

Somedays this site disappoints me.

carpet baboon wrote:Seriously people?
I name drop Josiah Gibbs a great in chemical thermodynamics and a firm favourite of Einstein, known  for his pioneering work in physics chemistry and mathematics, and not one single comment or green well done thing?

Somedays this site disappoints me.

He was all those things but still an almighty failure as a fullback during his playing career and an absolute disaster as a coach. So he doesn't deserve discussion here.

SecretFly wrote:

carpet baboon wrote:Seriously people?
I name drop Josiah Gibbs a great in chemical thermodynamics and a firm favourite of Einstein, known  for his pioneering work in physics chemistry and mathematics, and not one single comment or green well done thing?

Somedays this site disappoints me.

He was all those things but still an almighty failure as a fullback during his playing career and an absolute disaster as a coach.  So he doesn't deserve discussion here.

Fair point fly. And the less said about "tour" he went on the better.

The suspicion at Ravenhill was that Marshall, Bowe and Gilroy were fighting it out for a starting spot and a bench spot against France.

Based on the assumption that there will be no Kearney and no Trimble so we have:
Wing - Earls
12 - Henshaw
13 - Ringrose
15 - Zebo

Based on the performances Gilroy starts on the wing and Marshall on the bench
Henshaw can cover 15 and Ringrose can cover the wings

Does that not go against Joes preference of not moving around players mid game because it disrupts systems or is it a case of needs must at the minute?

What about O'Halloran? Is he not trusted by Joe yet? Thought he had a good game yesterday

carpet baboon wrote:What about O'Halloran? Is he not trusted by Joe yet? Thought he had a good game yesterday

I think the Italy team/squad just swapping out Keatly and Kearney for Sexton and TOH is the fairest based on form and talent. Its also the least disruptive.

My money is on you boys beating England 9maybe Wales) and winning the title. My only concern is injuries as i think players like Sexton and Kearney are crucial…what is fitness status of those 2? Is SOB and Healey fit?

Gwlad wrote:My money is on you boys beating England 9maybe Wales) and winning the title. My only concern is injuries as i think players like Sexton and Kearney are crucial…what is fitness status of those 2? Is SOB and Healey fit?

Is your money literally on us Gwlad? What odds did you get?

Kearney is not someone alot of Irish fans would call crucial though he has played well in first two matches. He will miss rest of 6 nations. Sexton will be in squad for France, but many fans would like to see him on bench as Jackson has done well. Healy is second choice to McGrath, SOB is fit but van def flier is injured. Peter O'Mahonny likely to move to bench in his absence. At the moment we are as healthy a squad as we've had in many a six nations, with depth weakest at halfback.

marty2086 wrote:Does that not go against Joes preference of not moving around players mid game because it disrupts systems or is it a case of needs must at the minute?

When you have only one back on the bench covering the threes and the 15 you have to if needs must - look at the autumn.
What it will mean is the back three would not be replaced unless they have to be.

How else are you going to configure the backs and the bench to avoid the possibility of someone moving around ? - you cant

wolfball wrote:

carpet baboon wrote:What about O'Halloran? Is he not trusted by Joe yet? Thought he had a good game yesterday

I think the Italy team/squad just swapping out Keatly and Kearney for Sexton and TOH is the fairest based on form and talent. Its also the least disruptive.

Schmidt clearly has Zebo above TOH in his 15 pecking order.

Also if you only have Gilroy or Marshall on the bench the disruption in the event of injury will be at least as great as if Zebo starts at 15

What I propose has one change Zebo to 15, Gilroy played against Italy anyway and is on top form - better form than TOH I reckon.

Ireland squad (v France): Forwards: Best (Ulster), Furlong (Leinster), Healy (Leinster), Heaslip (Leinster), Henderson (Ulster), Leavy (Leinster), McGrath (Leinster), O'Brien (Leinster), O'Donnell (Munster), O'Mahony (Munster), Roux (Connacht), D Ryan (Munster), J Ryan (Munster), N Scannell (Munster), CJ Stander (Munster), Toner (Leinster), Tracy (Leinster).

Backs: Bowe (Ulster), Conway (Munster), Earls (Munster), Gilroy (Ulster), Henshaw (Leinster), Jackson (Ulster), Kearney (Leinster), Keatley (Munster), Marmion (Connacht), L Marshall (Ulster), McGrath (Leinster), Murray (Munster), O'Halloran (Connacht), Ringrose (Leinster), Sexton (Leinster), Trimble (Ulster), Zebo (Munster).

No Dilane, Carbery, Stu McC,

Dilane no longer in the squad is a surprise, anyone know what is happening with that?

Dillane has seemed a little underwhelming when hes come on in the previous games but then again others have done the same in the past and not been dropped

I see Ian Madigan wants to return to home pastures.

"Madigan left Leinster for France last year and has seen himself frozen out of Joe Schmidt’s Ireland plans, despite the ongoing injury problems plaguing Johnny Sexton.

According to the report Bordeaux will not stand in Madigan’s way if he wishes to leave and they have lined Toulouses’s Toby Flood as his replacement.

Madigan’s time in France has been largely frustrating, and he hasn’t started a Top 14 game in 2017."

I see handsome rob is expected to train fully this week

Pete330v2 wrote:I see Ian Madigan wants to return to home pastures.

"Madigan left Leinster for France last year and has seen himself frozen out of Joe Schmidt’s Ireland plans, despite the ongoing injury problems plaguing Johnny Sexton.

According to the report Bordeaux will not stand in Madigan’s way if he wishes to leave and they have lined Toulouses’s Toby Flood as his replacement.

Madigan’s time in France has been largely frustrating, and he hasn’t started a Top 14 game in 2017."

The AP is his preferred destination apparently

marty2086 wrote:

Pete330v2 wrote:I see Ian Madigan wants to return to home pastures.

"Madigan left Leinster for France last year and has seen himself frozen out of Joe Schmidt’s Ireland plans, despite the ongoing injury problems plaguing Johnny Sexton.

According to the report Bordeaux will not stand in Madigan’s way if he wishes to leave and they have lined Toulouses’s Toby Flood as his replacement.

Madigan’s time in France has been largely frustrating, and he hasn’t started a Top 14 game in 2017."

The AP is his preferred destination apparently

Ulster could use him as back up to Jacko, much like the international setup

Pete330v2 wrote:

marty2086 wrote:

Pete330v2 wrote:I see Ian Madigan wants to return to home pastures.

"Madigan left Leinster for France last year and has seen himself frozen out of Joe Schmidt’s Ireland plans, despite the ongoing injury problems plaguing Johnny Sexton.

According to the report Bordeaux will not stand in Madigan’s way if he wishes to leave and they have lined Toulouses’s Toby Flood as his replacement.

Madigan’s time in France has been largely frustrating, and he hasn’t started a Top 14 game in 2017."

The AP is his preferred destination apparently

Ulster could use him as back up to Jacko, much like the international setup

Maybe hes coming in as scrum half and Cooneys his backup

marty2086 wrote:

Pete330v2 wrote:

marty2086 wrote:

Pete330v2 wrote:I see Ian Madigan wants to return to home pastures.

"Madigan left Leinster for France last year and has seen himself frozen out of Joe Schmidt’s Ireland plans, despite the ongoing injury problems plaguing Johnny Sexton.

According to the report Bordeaux will not stand in Madigan’s way if he wishes to leave and they have lined Toulouses’s Toby Flood as his replacement.

Madigan’s time in France has been largely frustrating, and he hasn’t started a Top 14 game in 2017."

The AP is his preferred destination apparently

Ulster could use him as back up to Jacko, much like the international setup

Maybe hes coming in as scrum half and Cooneys his backup

Or maybe defence coach

Pete330v2 wrote:

marty2086 wrote:

Pete330v2 wrote:I see Ian Madigan wants to return to home pastures.

"Madigan left Leinster for France last year and has seen himself frozen out of Joe Schmidt’s Ireland plans, despite the ongoing injury problems plaguing Johnny Sexton.

According to the report Bordeaux will not stand in Madigan’s way if he wishes to leave and they have lined Toulouses’s Toby Flood as his replacement.

Madigan’s time in France has been largely frustrating, and he hasn’t started a Top 14 game in 2017."

The AP is his preferred destination apparently

Ulster could use him as back up to Jacko, much like the international setup

I'd ask Jacko first. I think that arrangement might be a little too close to the bone for him.... after all, new Ulster boss knows Madigan quite well. Coup!

Pete330v2 wrote:

marty2086 wrote:

Pete330v2 wrote:

marty2086 wrote:

Pete330v2 wrote:I see Ian Madigan wants to return to home pastures.

"Madigan left Leinster for France last year and has seen himself frozen out of Joe Schmidt’s Ireland plans, despite the ongoing injury problems plaguing Johnny Sexton.

According to the report Bordeaux will not stand in Madigan’s way if he wishes to leave and they have lined Toulouses’s Toby Flood as his replacement.

Madigan’s time in France has been largely frustrating, and he hasn’t started a Top 14 game in 2017."

The AP is his preferred destination apparently

Ulster could use him as back up to Jacko, much like the international setup

Maybe hes coming in as scrum half and Cooneys his backup

Or maybe defence coach

No sure Ryan Constables lined up Ian Humphreys for that job

If he is not with Esportif he has no chance.

http://www.esportif.com/portfolio/ian-madigan/

https://uk.linkedin.com/in/ian-humphreys-b3a3595b

We're doomed!!!!

marty2086 wrote:

Jesus, more bunk from the ancient out-of-touch, blazer brigade. What the hell would they know? Just look at them.

Nice little funny piece in the Independent with Alan Quinlan and Bull Hayes:

'..... that famous try against Toulouse in the 2000 Heineken Cup semi-final, a brilliant score, disguised by the fact that John stayed on the ground for about 20 seconds after being tackled in an early phase of that attack, before inadvertently finding himself at the right place at the right time, to cross the line.

"Twenty seconds. You sure?" he said.

Alan Quinlan: "Let's remember this clearly. Dominic Crotty made a line break, gets tackled and pops the pass to you. You fall over the line and the only reason you were there was because you were too f*****g lazy to get your big arse off the floor."

John Hayes: "Go away you. If an openside had got that score, they'd say he showed great anticipation. I wasn't lying there resting, I was watching how the play would unfold." '

In fairness to Hayes, he touched the ball 3 times in that attack, not bad for a TH.

Luke Fitzgerald says Trimble should start so I assume he must be fit - same being said about Kearney

Looks like Sexton will start ahead of Paddy as well. If he does, its a bit harsh on Paddy as I think he has played well.

POM into the squad, as good a player as he is, I think I would keep him on the bench as he is not going to oust CJ and Heaslip had a very good game against Italy.

Shame TOH is not going to get a shot as I think he is probably the best 15 in Ireland right now.

Not sure that France is the ideal game back for Sexton. They normally target him and, if anything, they're bigger and meaner than usual!

Jackson seems to have been doing well enough.

Cyril wrote:Not sure that France is the ideal game back for Sexton. They normally target him and, if anything, they're bigger and meaner than usual!

Jackson seems to have been doing well enough.

Sexton returned from injury against France in this fixture two years ago in Dublin and played a stormer. Whatever happens Sexton will go off injured anyway and Jackson will come on.

We gotta win the game though, Cyril. So that's the plan.... use Sexton as a crash-test-dummy in the first half, let the French exhaust all their adrenalin levels on trying to bang him out of the game (legally of course)...and then Paddy to come on in the second half and run circles round them.

34 - 8 to France.

Paddy ran around in circles a little too much. Schmidt pi-ssed!

SecretFly wrote:We gotta win the game though, Cyril.  So that's the plan.... use Sexton as a crash-test-dummy in the first half, let the French exhaust all their adrenalin levels on trying to bang him out of the game (legally of course)...and then Paddy to come on in the second half and run circles round them.

34 - 8 to France.  

Paddy ran around in circles a little too much.  Schmidt pi-ssed!

Was it not last year they did it not so legally?

marty.... I'm trying to be diplomatic here. I have enough libel writs coming through my postbox.

wolfball wrote:

Gwlad wrote:My money is on you boys beating England 9maybe Wales) and winning the title. My only concern is injuries as i think players like Sexton and Kearney are crucial…what is fitness status of those 2? Is SOB and Healey fit?

Is your money literally on us Gwlad? What odds did you get?

Kearney is not someone alot of Irish fans would call crucial though he has played well in first two matches. He will miss rest of 6 nations. Sexton will be in squad for France, but many fans would like to see him on bench as Jackson has done well. Healy is second choice to McGrath, SOB is fit but van def flier is injured. Peter O'Mahonny likely to move to bench in his absence. At the moment we are as healthy a squad as we've had in many a six nations, with depth weakest at halfback.

Knew Kearney would be picked once fit, huge player for a huge game.

Hell of a team Ireland have with a fine bench, and while England are busy playing silly buggers by experimenting mid tournament, Ireland are cementing their side. I am sure that Ireland will beat France comfortably and remain convinced you'll win in the final game with a huge victory over England.

England playing sill buggers by experimenting mid tournament.

Not so sure about that, England are building strength in the team/squad. by giving players who have shown they can play at this level, and giving them a chance to prove Eddie Jones has made the right choice.


It is a pitty Rob Howley did not that with the Wales squad. Don't you think.

England will win easily - smart move to improve depth and experience

Guys, don't think this has been asked yet, so.....

If Jared Payne is fully fit and ready to go for the Wales game, having come through his Ulster return, should he go straight back in at 13 in place of Ringrose?

I know a lot will say drop Kearney, Payne at 15 and Ringrose at 13, but its never gonna happen.  Payne will be 13 or nothing under Schmidt.  Personally I think Ringrose has looked very good in attack at 13, but fairly dodgey in defence.  On a couple of occasions against France he came out of the line looking for a big hit.  We know how much Schmidt loves Payne's defensive abilities at 13, so if its a straight shoot out who do you want and what do you think Schmidt will do?

Payne will get 20 mins or so against Zebre

That does not make him fully fit or anywhere near ready for the 6N


Would be a terrible mistake

Schmidt is heavy on the fact that players need to be up to speed with moves from the training pitch - even if Payne is fit now, no way he would be ready for Wales - maybe a chance for England if he gets brought into camp and trains over the next 2 weeks. However I reckon he won't be up to speed for this six nations, especially if Ringrose continues to play well enough. Pity - I think his defensive organisation is top notch and it would be good for Ringrose to get exposure to Payne's experience as the future is obviously with the younger guy. ( I think Ringrose has been quoted as saying he learnt a good chunk off Payne)

With young joey starting at 15 for Leinster again at the weekend could it be possible that Joe sees him as a 15 long term?
Or is it just a needs must ?

I'd say Payne could well have a seat on the bench against Wales if he can prove he's lost nothing against Treviso tonight for Ulster. Personally I fully expect him to play like he's never been injured, he has that kind of class and it doesn't go away you know
Ringrose deserves to retain that 13 shirt, he's been excellent and it's hard to believe he's only starting his rugby career. The Ringshaw axis should be retained as it's definitely one for the long run.

Is there anyone else who thinks that the Henshaw-Ringrose combination doesn't quite gel?

Rory_Gallagher wrote:Is there anyone else who thinks that the Henshaw-Ringrose combination doesn't quite gel?

Its just a step above Ringrose at the minute especially in defence, he'll own the shirt in years to come but still has plenty to learn as is natural

Its pretty early days. Think it offers a little more in attack than Payne and Henshaw though.