Gatland blasts critics...good on ya Gats

First topic message reminder :

http://www.allblacks.com/news/22679/Gatland-blasts-critics

Back home for you Gats, if they can't respect ya, we've plenty of teams that will.

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Kia, I'd be interested in hearing Jamie Roberts explain why it wasn't the wrong decision?

Even Gatland has said that BOD wasn't the difference in the result. We all know it was a fit scrummaging front row who squeeze out penalty after penalty in the scrum for Leigh Halfpenny to slot over.

Jonathan Sexton said that he and the Irish players were looking forward to playing against the Lions in the 6ns

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Is France still top 10. PSA seems just as clueless as Lievremont.

Australia don't want another conservative Kiwi but Ireland did have Gatland as Kidney until he was ousted by the superior Kidney.  SA will never get a foreign coach. There are reasons why teams won't take Gats but being a bad coach is not the reason you scamp!

Eddie O'Sullivan ousted Gatland,and put a big knife into his back in the process.

He's already in secret phone calls (tapped ) to the New Zealand Union.  He's telling them he knows they want him, he's laughing at them pretending they don't.  He's not coming home to go through the audition process.  He's his own man and won't be told what to do.  He's sick of people telling him what to do!!!  So, he's demanding the All Blacks come to him, on his throne in Wales, and beg him to come over to the Dark side...plus, use a lot of mney in the begging process.

That's it in a nutshell - that's what's happening now.  Wikileaks tell me everything

LordDowlais wrote:

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Is France still top 10. PSA seems just as clueless as Lievremont.

Australia don't want another conservative Kiwi but Ireland did have Gatland as Kidney until he was ousted by the superior Kidney.  SA will never get a foreign coach. There are reasons why teams won't take Gats but being a bad coach is not the reason you scamp!

Eddie O'Sullivan ousted Gatland,and put a big knife into his back in the process.

Eddie wouldn't have been able to do it without the help of Keith Wood (probably not a fan of the 14 man lineout as he wasn't much of a lineout thrower).

Lots of coaches lose their job, but its only poor old Gatty also gets knifed and we're still talking about it 12 years later.

Yes first Fast Eddy and then Kidney stone.

BOD or JD wouldn't have changed the result. Axing BOD wouldn't have happened if Gats was still Ireland coach. Watching the aftermath probably gave him a good laugh. Should he have done it out of spite? The mature answer would be no. Did he enjoy it? My intuition says yes.

We'll do a swap in the middle of the Irish sea...with the UN looking on so that it doesn't get nasty.

We'll hand over the past Welsh coach who was knifed in the back by Welsh players... and the Welsh will hand over the past Irish coach who was knifed in the back by an Irish coach...and some fireWood.

These coaches have been living in exile long enough, a new chapter of peace must emerge........................... Here, Gatty, Gatty....  Come here boy, all is forgiven...

Sin é wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Is France still top 10. PSA seems just as clueless as Lievremont.

Australia don't want another conservative Kiwi but Ireland did have Gatland as Kidney until he was ousted by the superior Kidney.  SA will never get a foreign coach. There are reasons why teams won't take Gats but being a bad coach is not the reason you scamp!

Eddie O'Sullivan ousted Gatland,and put a big knife into his back in the process.

Eddie wouldn't have been able to do it without the help of Keith Wood (probably not a fan of the 14 man lineout as he wasn't much of a lineout thrower).

Lots of coaches lose their job, but its only poor old Gatty also gets knifed and we're still talking about it 12 years later.

It was you lot who were going on about this all that time ago, then you all bitched about Eddie O'Sullivan, next it was Declan Kidney's turn, now it is because BOD was dropped from the Lions, do we see a trend here ? I wait to see what happens within the Irish national setup with eager eye's because if the new coach does not bend to the whim of the Irish fan then he should get out of dodge on the quickest horse possible.

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Yes first Fast Eddy and then Kidney stone.

BOD or JD wouldn't have changed the result. Axing BOD wouldn't have happened if Gats was still Ireland coach. Watching the aftermath probably gave him a good laugh. Should he have done it out of spite? The mature answer would be no. Did he enjoy it? My intuition says yes.

What had Kidney to do with Gatland's sacking (or to be more accurate his contract was not renewed)? Kidney was Munster coach when Gatland was Ireland coach.

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Yes first Fast Eddy and then Kidney stone.

BOD or JD wouldn't have changed the result. Axing BOD wouldn't have happened if Gats was still Ireland coach. Watching the aftermath probably gave him a good laugh. Should he have done it out of spite? The mature answer would be no. Did he enjoy it? My intuition says yes.

I hope he did, kia.  I hope he had a few full belly laughs in the privacy of his hotel room.  There would be no fun looking forward to the future if we felt he did'na get any pleasure out of it.

Very classless of Paul O'Connell to do that. God forbid that anybody would dare drop his precious whittle Bwian.

I find it difficult to fathom how a professional rugby player as experienced as him can't get his head round the fact that a proven centre combination might be chosen, particularly one that played as part of the best functioning back line before the tests.

Maybe if another coach had the guts to do what Sir Warren did, Ireland wouldn't be having to beg BOD to stay on another year.

Risca Rev wrote:Very classless of Paul O'Connell to do that. God forbid that anybody would dare drop his precious whittle Bwian.

I find it difficult to fathom how a professional rugby player as experienced as him can't get his head round the fact that a proven centre combination might be chosen, particularly one that played as part of the best functioning back line before the tests.

Maybe if another coach had the guts to do what Sir Warren did, Ireland wouldn't be having to beg BOD to stay on another year.

Waff now, weep waiter, Wisca Wev

LordDowlais wrote:

Sin é wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Is France still top 10. PSA seems just as clueless as Lievremont.

Australia don't want another conservative Kiwi but Ireland did have Gatland as Kidney until he was ousted by the superior Kidney.  SA will never get a foreign coach. There are reasons why teams won't take Gats but being a bad coach is not the reason you scamp!

Eddie O'Sullivan ousted Gatland,and put a big knife into his back in the process.

Eddie wouldn't have been able to do it without the help of Keith Wood (probably not a fan of the 14 man lineout as he wasn't much of a lineout thrower).

Lots of coaches lose their job, but its only poor old Gatty also gets knifed and we're still talking about it 12 years later.

It was you lot who were going on about this all that time ago, then you all bitched about Eddie O'Sullivan, next it was Declan Kidney's turn, now it is because BOD was dropped from the Lions, do we see a trend here ? I wait to see what happens within the Irish national setup with eager eye's because if the new coach does not bend to the whim of the Irish fan then he should get out of dodge on the quickest horse possible.

I don't recall any bitching about Eddie O'Sullivan not being reappointed after 7 years.

I bitched about Declan Kidney ?  I won't be bitching about his contract not being renewed in 12 years time and I won't be claiming he was knifed in the back.

That's my theory Fly. A big mid digit to Ireland and a statement of power in the middle of a decider. If I were a conspiracy theorist I'd day he ordered Hibbard to screw up that line out at the end of the second test to raise the stakes and make the axing of BOD seem even worse.  

Risca Rev wrote:Very classless of Paul O'Connell to do that. God forbid that anybody would dare drop his precious whittle Bwian.

I find it difficult to fathom how a professional rugby player as experienced as him can't get his head round the fact that a proven centre combination might be chosen, particularly one that played as part of the best functioning back line before the tests.

Maybe if another coach had the guts to do what Sir Warren did, Ireland wouldn't be having to beg BOD to stay on another year.

Maybe he is a little confused as to why the same thinking didn't apply to the Heislip/Murray/Sexton axis particularly when Phillips is playing like a wet rag.

Sin é wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:

Sin é wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Is France still top 10. PSA seems just as clueless as Lievremont.

Australia don't want another conservative Kiwi but Ireland did have Gatland as Kidney until he was ousted by the superior Kidney.  SA will never get a foreign coach. There are reasons why teams won't take Gats but being a bad coach is not the reason you scamp!

Eddie O'Sullivan ousted Gatland,and put a big knife into his back in the process.

Eddie wouldn't have been able to do it without the help of Keith Wood (probably not a fan of the 14 man lineout as he wasn't much of a lineout thrower).

Lots of coaches lose their job, but its only poor old Gatty also gets knifed and we're still talking about it 12 years later.

It was you lot who were going on about this all that time ago, then you all bitched about Eddie O'Sullivan, next it was Declan Kidney's turn, now it is because BOD was dropped from the Lions, do we see a trend here ? I wait to see what happens within the Irish national setup with eager eye's because if the new coach does not bend to the whim of the Irish fan then he should get out of dodge on the quickest horse possible.

I don't recall any bitching about Eddie O'Sullivan not being reappointed after 7 years.
I bitched about Declan Kidney ?  I won't be bitching about his contract not being renewed in 12 years time and I won't be claiming he was knifed in the back.

No, but you were all bitching about how you all wanted him out after the world cup performance, and how he was not good enough to be coach of Ireland, ok I will concede it may not have been you personally but a raft of Irish posters on the old 606 were wanting him out, and they were very vocal about how he underminded and backstabbed Gatland.

Risca Rev wrote:Very classless of Paul O'Connell to do that. God forbid that anybody would dare drop his precious whittle Bwian.

I find it difficult to fathom how a professional rugby player as experienced as him can't get his head round the fact that a proven centre combination might be chosen, particularly one that played as part of the best functioning back line before the tests.

Maybe if another coach had the guts to do what Sir Warren did, Ireland wouldn't be having to beg BOD to stay on another year.

He disagrees with a coachs call he is allowed to do it like why is it an issue? If you read what he says he is completely right about what he says. I'd agree he wasn't the guy for Gatland's plan but Gatland's plan had its issues on Saturday no doubt about that.

Sin é wrote:Jonathan Sexton said that he and the Irish players were looking forward to playing against the Lions in the 6ns

He'll be waiting a while for that.

Of course POC is entitled to support his team mate. It'd be classless not to. Of course Gatland is going to show national bias and stick to the players he knows. Of course there was an incentive albeit a spiteful one to drop BOD. Let's not be naive and think the Lions is just a bed of roses and clover. It's also made of thistles and dragons!

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Of course POC is entitled to support his team mate. It'd be classless not to. Of course Gatland is going to show national bias and stick to the players he knows. Of course there was an incentive albeit a spiteful one to drop BOD. Let's not be naive and think the Lions is just a bed of roses and clover. It's also made of thistles and dragons!

Where were you when this place needed you last week, kia? You say that, and it's glaringly, obviously all true. Some of us say it and it's Anti-Lions treason!!!

Thisltles- really?

mystiroakey wrote:Thisltles- really?

---

Yea, the Scots got screwed as well.

Funny how some people think that Gats in a shoe-in as the head coach for the Lions to NZ  

Shoo.

I'll be serious. He could have chosen his words better. It wasn't the Brian O'Driscoll and Guests tour, there were three other good centres initially selected. It's not difficult to fathom why O'Driscoll wouldn't be picked.

Re Phillips, he might've looked just as effective as Murray when our tails were up. He did also create the first try, so not a bad return for one so badly off form.

Well look a win is a win. However isnt it time wales ands the Lions picked home talent.

Foreign managers don't work in this game in the long run..

I doubt anyone's ever toured with the Lions and been told beforehand that they're guaranteed to play in all three Tests. That's as it should be. The problem is that so many people assumed on O'Driscoll's behalf that he would start all three Tests.

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:I doubt anyone's ever toured with the Lions and been told beforehand that they're guaranteed to play in all three Tests. That's as it should be. The problem is that so many people assumed on O'Driscoll's behalf that he would start all three Tests.

Warburton was guaranteed three

Shame he had to get injured and ruin that bit of the nicely crafted plan.

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:I doubt anyone's ever toured with the Lions and been told beforehand that they're guaranteed to play in all three Tests. That's as it should be. The problem is that so many people assumed on O'Driscoll's behalf that he would start all three Tests.

It seems that the Welsh players were pretty much guaranteed their starting spot before the Tour (i.e., everyone is glossing over that the best result was when Warburton was missing with O'Brien starting). The Welsh players were pretty much guaranteed to start - some of the players on tour were not even given a proper chance (i.e., Hogg played as a 10, Best sent out to captain a scratch team that had Shane Williams).

I'd say now that the players are out of the Lions bubble, we'll hear what they all think of it.

According to POC:

“It wouldn’t even be a case of letting anyone down; Brian would have been one of the best players on the pitch. That’s just the way it is," O'Connell replied.

“I thought Brian was playing well. If you look at the first two Tests there wasn’t a whole lot of quality ball given to the back-line.


btw Luckless, no one has yet explained why the country partnership argument applied to Davies & Roberts, but it didn't apply to Sexton & Murray. Looks like Mike Phillips was guaranteed his spot.

Cuthbert wasn't sin. At least Gats had the smarts to pick Murray and not Youngs. You could argue he should've done the same with Farrell but that's for another time. Today let's just focus on BOD. We don't want you bursting a vein.

Luckless Pedestrian wrote:I doubt anyone's ever toured with the Lions and been told beforehand that they're guaranteed to play in all three Tests. That's as it should be. The problem is that so many people assumed on O'Driscoll's behalf that he would start all three Tests.

Wrong-

Phillips - even though he was in terrible form
Roberts- even though he in terrible form and became injured - still jumped into the test starting position
Warburton - even though he was not the best in his position, before and during the tour


The fact that these people got injured and did not play in all tests should not disguise the fact Gatland was never going to drop them as he had already penned their name in the test side

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Cuthbert wasn't sin. At least Gats had the smarts to pick Murray and not Youngs. You could argue he should've done the same with Farrell but that's for another time. Today let's just focus on BOD. We don't want you bursting a vein.

Phillips & Youngs started the first Test. Youngs started the 2nd (and was awful) as well. He then reverts back to Phillips (still awful) with Murray benching.

As for Cuthbert - probably hanging out a lot with Zebo & Wade probably made him the dispensable Welshman.

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Of course POC is entitled to support his team mate. It'd be classless not to. Of course Gatland is going to show national bias and stick to the players he knows. Of course there was an incentive albeit a spiteful one to drop BOD. Let's not be naive and think the Lions is just a bed of roses and clover. It's also made of thistles and dragons!

Yup.

I'm glad you're all able to know exactly what Gatland is thinking. Maybe Scott Johnson and Joe Schmidt should get you involved in your National teams.

Maybe I'm already involved in yours. Cue horror music.

Risca Rev wrote:I'm glad you're all able to know exactly what Gatland is thinking. Maybe Scott Johnson and Joe Schmidt should get you involved in your National teams.

Well, I'm glad it's back to 'you' and 'your' at least.  All is right with the world when an end comes to pretending it's all 'we' during Lions month.

Rev, many of your own country men also claim to have an angle on Gatland's thoughts.  They know it wasn't anything selfish in his final choice of team for the final game.  They know he wasn't secretly gloating at letting a people's favourite know who is boss.  They know it was all about 'combinations' that worked (even though Murray was on the bench for most of the game)

Welsh observers seem to know fully and confidently Gatland's true thoughts, and the Irish seem to fully and confidently know his hidden ones  The truth is probably somewhere in the middle as usual.  Autobiographies and future interviews will uncover more detail in time.

I'm surprised Edward Snowden didn't mention the wiretaps on Gats's phone. Maybe the tapes will be released eventually where we hear him promising these players that they'll play in all three Tests.

I've been crediting wikileaks for my exclusives all through the tour . Whose meeting room (and bedroom) have you been tapping for your lowdown on the decisions that mattered, Luckless?

Warburton got the 3 test promise. Even written in blood so that Gats couldn't claim he never gave such assurances further down the line. Assange again gave me that one.

God help this place if Joe Scmidt drops BOD for the AI or he does something radical and picks some young players with potential and uses the next 6N as a transitional season, I tell you all now, and you can book mark me and quote me back at a later date, the Irish will be all over this forum bitching about him before to long, because all there seems to be on this forum as of late are Irish people who feel they have been shafted.

I didn't need to wiretap anyone, Fly. I'm Welsh, so I'm on Gats's contacts list. He sends us a daily group e-mail.

A Thought for the Day to Believers kinda thing?   Good idea.  I must ask the IRFU to get that started up for us too.  Schmidt is already totally infallible in our eyes and he hasn't even coached the team yet!  I'd love to hear his thoughts on things like.......sunburn and what facotr to wear if you still want a tan.

BTW, if Schmidt drops BOD for the AIs, he'll be perfectly right of course.  He's Irish coach.  He knows everything.

SecretFly wrote:BTW, if Schmidt drops BOD for the AIs, he'll be perfectly right of course.  He's Irish coach.  He knows everything.

Only a fool would dare to drop BOD!

BOD cannot go on for ever unfortunatley

LordDowlais wrote:BOD cannot go on for ever unfortunatley

BOD can play way into his 40s

LordDowlais wrote:God help this place if Joe Scmidt drops BOD for the AI or he does something radical and picks some young players with potential and uses the next 6N as a transitional season, I tell you all now, and you can book mark me and quote me back at a later date, the Irish will be all over this forum bitching about him before to long, because all there seems to be on this forum as of late are Irish people who feel they have been shafted.

Well I'd hope that Schmidt wouldn't be so nasty to drop BOD for the last game in the 6Ns before he retired when he has started all the other games in the 6Ns.

Paul O'Connell /Tommy Bowe interview with Ray D'Arcy on today FM (from 42 mins in Part 1).

http://player.todayfm.com/player/listen_back/4/4197/11th_July_2013_-_The_Ray_D%27Arcy_Show_Part_1

Sheesh, Paul O'Connell and Tommy Bowe are not getting any younger either, he may have to drop those pair as well, I can see the mushroom cloud erupting in Ireland from the valley's.

Sin é wrote:

LordDowlais wrote:God help this place if Joe Scmidt drops BOD for the AI or he does something radical and picks some young players with potential and uses the next 6N as a transitional season, I tell you all now, and you can book mark me and quote me back at a later date, the Irish will be all over this forum bitching about him before to long, because all there seems to be on this forum as of late are Irish people who feel they have been shafted.

Well I'd hope that Schmidt wouldn't be so nasty to drop BOD for the last game in the 6Ns before he retired when he has started all the other games in the 6Ns.

Paul O'Connell /Tommy Bowe interview with Ray D'Arcy on today FM (from 42 mins in Part 1).

http://player.todayfm.com/player/listen_back/4/4197/11th_July_2013_-_The_Ray_D%27Arcy_Show_Part_1

Don't be so silly, Sin.  If BOD plays four of the five 6N, and we were in with a shot of a Slam, and he's on his last emotional 'sentimental' day with Ireland. That'd be the perfect time to get a combo that works in to finish off the job.  Bowe at 12 and Dave Kearney at 13.  Or maybe Zebo 12 and Earls 13.  Or maybe Earls 12 and Bowe 13.  AnyBODy but BOD would fit right in.

You'd have to have Paddy Wallace at 12.

Secret!!!!

Now you've really let the genii out of Pandora's bell!!!!

 

rodders wrote:

kiakahaaotearoa wrote:Of course POC is entitled to support his team mate. It'd be classless not to. Of course Gatland is going to show national bias and stick to the players he knows. Of course there was an incentive albeit a spiteful one to drop BOD. Let's not be naive and think the Lions is just a bed of roses and clover. It's also made of thistles and dragons!

Yup.

Good post.

We Irish are an emotional, sentimental, passionate and stubborn people. All of this just serves to cue up Ireland vs Wales in the Six Nations as a Big Game. With the fallout and bitterness over this selection debate it almost feels like an interprovincial game- it should have an extra edge to it.

What are the odds it wazzes down with rain and it's a 9-all draw.